high ohm single coils

[SnesGuy]

I'm tired, don't feel like reading the whole thread. Personally I like a big single coil.
Something like 1.3-1.4 ohms with 28g Nichrome. That's a pretty large coil. Pretty snug in my kracken.

It takes a second to heat, but stays hot for several seconds after you release the fire button so you just have to adjust your timing. Its somewhat cool with lots of vapor production for me.

My brother loves kanthal micro coils, but i just find them "meh"

 

[sneakerpimp]

personally i don't see going above 2 Ω for any reason whatsoever.

 

[AndriaD]

personally i don't see going above 2 Ω for any reason whatsoever.

Apparently it saves battery life, per JeremyR in the Sigelei thread, when I was asking many questions about batteries.

Andria

 

[The Ocelot]

Actually I have to make a correction.

The higher ohm coils give you more efficiency in the use of power, so
For the same watts
the higher ohm coil should vaporize more liquid than the lower ohm coil.
hence a longer battery life.

I agree that higher ohms use power more efficiently, but not because it is vaporizing more liquid. 9 watts of heat is 9 watts of heat, no matter how you get there, it's amps that determine battery life. Reading this thread it's obvious you know far more about wire and resistance than I do, but I think I understand battery life.

I changed the order of quadrants around on the wheel, but the formulae are all still correct.

P = power (watts)
V = volts
R = resistance
I = current (amps) I forgot why it's "I"

Voltage x voltage ÷ resistance (ohms) = power (watts)

4.5v²/2.2Ω = 9.2w

Voltage ÷ resistance (ohms) = I (current/amps)

4.5v/2.2Ω = 2.05 amps

3.7v²/1.5Ω = 9.1w

3.7v/1.5Ω = 2.47 amps

Even though a 2.2Ω atty at 4.5v and a 1.5Ω atty at 3.7v are producing the same amount of watts (+/- 9), when vaping low-res the amps increase, which draws more from the battery.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I was just looking for an excuse to post my groovy power wheel.

 

[AndriaD]

Even though a 2.2Ω atty at 4.5v and a 1.5Ω atty at 3.7v are producing the same amount of watts (+/- 9), when vaping low-res the amps increase, which draws more from the battery.

This is *exactly* what I was told, when I was asking many questions about batteries, stacking batteries, getting the most life from batteries, etc. So, even though the HyperTank 2 I ordered comes with 1.8Ω and 2.2Ω coils, I'll keep those for my Mini PT II, and order some 2.5Ω replacement coils for the HyperTank, which will be riding on a Sigelei Zmax v3; with my iTaste vv3, where I'll be using the Mini PT II, I run it on pass-thru 90% of the time, so battery life is no thang. But with the replaceables, it becomes a thang.

Andria

 

[The Ocelot]

Apparently it saves battery life, per JeremyR in the Sigelei thread, when I was asking many questions about batteries.

Andria

It also depends on what device you are using. Low resistance devices came on the market when most of the batteries available were regulated. Using a low-res topper gave a user with a 3.7v device the ability to vape at higher watts. When variable voltage batteries became mainstream, the use higher resistance toppers was more practical.

I use low-res on my mechanicals and higher res on my variable power devices, if that makes sense.

 

[The Ocelot]

This is *exactly* what I was told, when I was asking many questions about batteries, stacking batteries, getting the most life from batteries, etc. So, even though the HyperTank 2 I ordered comes with 1.8Ω and 2.2Ω coils, I'll keep those for my Mini PT II, and order some 2.5Ω replacement coils for the HyperTank, which will be riding on a Sigelei Zmax v3; with my iTaste vv3, where I'll be using the Mini PT II, I run it on pass-thru 90% of the time, so battery life is no thang. But with the replaceables, it becomes a thang.

Andria

You got it. I use 2.5Ω Kanger heads (or try to build coils around the same resistance) on VV/VW devices and about 1.3Ω to 1.5Ω on my mechanicals.

ETA: Have you tried a HyperTank? They are freakin' huge! I have one, but don't use it very often. 5ml of juice is a lot for me to put in one tank, since I tend to buy 10-15ml bottles to see if I like them.

 

[N00dl3s]

This is *exactly* what I was told, when I was asking many questions about batteries, stacking batteries, getting the most life from batteries, etc. So, even though the HyperTank 2 I ordered comes with 1.8Ω and 2.2Ω coils, I'll keep those for my Mini PT II, and order some 2.5Ω replacement coils for the HyperTank, which will be riding on a Sigelei Zmax v3; with my iTaste vv3, where I'll be using the Mini PT II, I run it on pass-thru 90% of the time, so battery life is no thang. But with the replaceables, it becomes a thang.

Andria

This was exactly what I've been trying to wrap my head around as well. I'm looking at getting a nice vv/vw mod that will run the right combo of watts/ amps that'll run an 18650 2000mAh the longest between recharges with decent vapor production/taste. I just couldn't figure out which way to go to get there.

 

[Stosh]

.....Even though a 2.2Ω atty at 4.5v and a 1.5Ω atty at 3.7v are producing the same amount of watts (+/- 9), when vaping low-res the amps increase, which draws more from the battery.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I was just looking for an excuse to post my groovy power wheel.

You are correct in how the circuit of the atty coil and 510 connector is concerned, there's a BUT here though. For a regulated mod to produce 4.5 volts to the 510 connector from a 3.7 volt battery, the circuit inside the mod draws higher amperage to increase the voltage....

There's no such thing as a free lunch, or a perpetual motion machine....the power that the coil gets has to come from somewhere, the difference is if the amperage increase happens inside or outside of the mod used....

Battery will get used up almost equally (save some differences in efficiency) either way you choose.

 

[PaulBHC]

I have a Vision Slip, a simple mech with 18350. I suppose that the batt starts at 4.2 and quickly goes to 3.9 for most of the run time. Looking at the charts, 2-2.2 Ω single coil is going to give me the most watts at that range. I also suppose that this will give me the best battery run time.

Sound correct?

What about dual coils?

 

[sneakerpimp]

Apparently it saves battery life, per JeremyR in the Sigelei thread, when I was asking many questions about batteries.

Andria

with the same vapor output??

 

[JeremyR]

Just a thought ive been having lately and I cant find an answer for the life of me.

Everyone talks about sub ohming and going lower and lower on the ohms. Not my cup of tea. Yes i can wrap the coils that low i just have no desire to do so. But what about higher ohm vaping. Instead of dual coils running at 1.5 ohm on a rda what about wrapping a single coil at like 3.5 or 4 ohm range using28 or 30 ga wire to give more surface area than a standard single coil at 1.5 ohm or even 2 ohm? Any advantage or disadvantage to running say a 3.5 ohm micro or nano coil? Any dangers to be aware of?

Please look at my knowledge is power blog. It's mostly technical tidbits with links to discussions. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/jeremyr/5666-knowledge-literally-power-vapers.html

Going longer/ higher ohms with 28 or 30 is going to increase heat up time as you increase mass too much. I've run 3 ohms for quite some time. 32g is the optimal gauge for this. 8-12 wraps is the optimal number of coils. A 3 Ohm of 32 will provide a quick heat up and a 3 second draw will produce a really nice amount of vapor. I usually hit them at 12-15watts, and yes it most efficient even at 15w. You get the fast instant vapor of a subohm just not as dense.

Blinding Heat from a 3 ohm 32g micro @ 5v 2-3 seconds, You dot get this kind of heat till you make it to lower sub ohm

 

[AndriaD]

You got it. I use 2.5Ω Kanger heads (or try to build coils around the same resistance) on VV/VW devices and about 1.3Ω to 1.5Ω on my mechanicals.

ETA: Have you tried a HyperTank? They are freakin' huge! I have one, but don't use it very often. 5ml of juice is a lot for me to put in one tank, since I tend to buy 10-15ml bottles to see if I like them.

Yeah, the main reason I wanted a telescoping mod, so I could use the smaller batts at home, and the bigger ones for day-long trips to my folks' house without having to pack a suitcase of vape stuff, also means that a big tank for those day trips is necessary too -- in May I'm going to get a 25mm IBTanked, but wanted something for now to go on the new toy . Also I think a 23mm wide mod looks ridiculous with a way-skinnier topper, AND I'm tired of having to refill so often. I currently use T3S tanks, which ostensibly hold just under 3ml; but, it starts the gurgling at about half that, so I really only get about 1.4ml out of it before I have to refill -- I figure the same is probably true of any bottom-coil tank, but that means I'd actually get bout 2.5ml before needing to refill -- works for me.

Andria

 

[AndriaD]

Please look at my knowledge is power blog. It's mostly technical tidbits with links to discussions. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/jeremyr/5666-knowledge-literally-power-vapers.html

Going longer/ higher ohms with 28 or 30 is going to increase heat up time as you increase mass too much. I've run 3 ohms for quite some time. 32g is the optimal gauge for this. 8-12 wraps is the optimal number of coils. A 3 Ohm of 32 will provide a quick heat up and a 3 second draw will produce a really nice amount of vapor. I usually hit them at 12-15watts, and yes it most efficient even at 15w. You get the fast instant vapor of a subohm just not as dense.

I am *so* glad you showed up in this thread to explain this; there's no way I could possibly explain it, except to repeat what you told me about higher ohms saving amps and thus battery life.


Andria

 

[edyle]

I agree that higher ohms use power more efficiently, but not because it is vaporizing more liquid. 9 watts of heat is 9 watts of heat, no matter how you get there, it's amps that determine battery life. Reading this thread it's obvious you know far more about wire and resistance than I do, but I think I understand battery life.

I changed the order of quadrants around on the wheel, but the formulae are all still correct.

P = power (watts)
V = volts
R = resistance
I = current (amps) I forgot why it's "I"

Voltage x voltage ÷ resistance (ohms) = power (watts)
4.5v²/2.2Ω = 9.2w
Voltage ÷ resistance (ohms) = I (current/amps)
4.5v/2.2Ω = 2.05 amps
3.7v²/1.5Ω = 9.1w
3.7v/1.5Ω = 2.47 amps
Even though a 2.2Ω atty at 4.5v and a 1.5Ω atty at 3.7v are producing the same amount of watts (+/- 9), when vaping low-res the amps increase, which draws more from the battery.
Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I was just looking for an excuse to post my groovy power wheel.

Well, you are only looking at the final output power and not counting the power lost inside the battery itself.
I gotta admit its harder to explain it having to account for the kick function in between; but if you want to check the numbers use a value of 0.5 ohms for the internal resistance of the battery.

I'll skip the same watts in order to illustrate and just use same volts on a mech:

Example: 4 volt battery with 0.5 ohm internal resistance:
1: 2 ohm coil;
Total Power = 4 x 4 / 2.5 = 6.4 watts
Current = 4/2.5 = 1.6 amps
Voltage drop = 1.6 x 0.5 = 0.8 volts
Voltage to coil = 4 - 0.8 = 3.2 volts ; or 1.6 amps x 2 ohms = 3.2 volts
Power delivered to coil = 1.6 x 1.6 x 2 = 5.12 watts
Efficiency = 5.12 / 6.4 = 80%

2: 1 ohm coil
Total Power = 4 x 4 / 1.5 = 10 watts
Current = 4/1.5 = 2.67 amps
Voltage drop = 2.67 x 0.5 = 1.33 volts
Voltage to coil = 4 - 1.33 = 2.67 volts ; or 2.67 amps x 1 ohm = 2.67 volts
Power delivered to coil = 2.67 x 2.67 x 1 = 7.1 watts
Efficiency = 7.1 / 10 = 71%

So in the case of a mech, with no kick, the lower ohm coil uses the battery less efficiently than the higher ohm coil;

Now, I find myself rethinking that maybe it applies only to a mech but not to an apv with a kick....

 

[guambred]

I'm waiting for one of these on a slow boat from china:

On what site, and how much were these magic eyes?

 

[edyle]

I agree that higher ohms use power more efficiently, but not because it is vaporizing more liquid. 9 watts of heat is 9 watts of heat, no matter how you get there, it's amps that determine battery life. Reading this thread it's obvious you know far more about wire and resistance than I do, but I think I understand battery life.
[snip]

Oh; I was looking to closely at the math to notice the english;

Yes the higher ohms use battery power more efficiently, and not BECAUSE it vaporizes more liquid; I was saying it will vaporize more liquid BECAUSE it uses the battery more efficiently. Meaning you will go through more milliliter of liquid on the same battery if you are using the battery more efficiently

 

[edyle]

I have a Vision Slip, a simple mech with 18350. I suppose that the batt starts at 4.2 and quickly goes to 3.9 for most of the run time. Looking at the charts, 2-2.2 Ω single coil is going to give me the most watts at that range. I also suppose that this will give me the best battery run time.

Sound correct?

What about dual coils?

4 volts @ 2 ohms will burn 4x4/2 = 8 watts.
If you use a 2 ohm dual coil you'll still burn 8 watts but it would be 4 watts per coil and they'd be cooler that the single coil.
If you use a 1 ohm dual coil (2 2 ohm coils in parellel) you'd burn 16 watts, and fog twice as fast.

 

[TampaToker69]

Personally I love 2.4-2.6 ohm coils, below 1.8 and it hurts my throat.

 

[edyle]

Personally I love 2.4-2.6 ohm coils, below 1.8 and it hurts my throat.

Sounds like you are using a mech or a regular eGo batt;
if you use a regulated VW mod, it shouldn't matter so much.