I'd like a definitive answer once and for all: do amps matter?

[sahsah]

The watts are identical so both examples produce the exact same amount of heat (BTU's). If you were able to build the coils identical to each other, same gauge, same number of wraps and the only difference is resistance the BTU's would be identical. The higher voltage draws less amps so would be more efficient.

I think you misread something. The builds can't be identical and have ones resistance come out to .25 and the other one come out to 3.0 ohms. Like I stated in an earlier post, the only differences are the amperage draw and the length of kanthal or I suppose gauge of kanthal would work too.

 

[Tangaroav]

space heaters are rated in wattage so you as a user can make sure the outlet your using has a sufficient rating. one may need a 20 amp fused circuit as opposed to a 10 amp circuit.
one can have 2 1500 watt heaters with different BTU outputs depending on the design of the coil. BTU's are also listed on the device. of course any control circuitry has to be account for also.

assuming the wire used in the OP's original post is the same gauge and type wire the heating profile would be hotter in the smaller coil as it is releasing the same amount of power in a twelfth of the space.

regards
mike

Two 1500 watt heaters with different btu output: ???? I dont think so ! Maybe you meant different temperatures that I agree.

But different BTU output, please explain. I remember that 1 watt = approximately 3.41 BTU/hour .

 

[rusirius]

i agree, as I stated earlier, I was just trying to gain other vapers opinions to support my claim in an argument. My opponent was proposing the creation of a variable amperage mod, claiming that amperage was the most important thing and that it would be much more practical than a variable wattage device like is often produced nowadays. I showed various examples for the impracticality and nonsensical nature of this but I thought I'd "ask the audience" so to speak, to gain further support.

It is nonsensical, but truly has nothing to do in a way with the original question. Let me explain...

In an atty you have a fixed resistance... wattage and amperage are both functions of the resistance and voltage...

Just like in a vw mod, you aren't "changing" the wattage. I mean you are, but there isn't some magical energy that travels along the wire called "wattage"... when you adjust the wattage you are simply adjusting the voltage in a different way... if you change the font size, you can click the up and down arrows, or you can just type in a size, but they aren't two always things, you're still just changing the font size... current is always a function of voltage and resistance, just as wattage is...

The point is, rather you had a variable wattage mod, or a variable amperage mod, you are still only changing one thing... the voltage... there's no other way...

Which makes the whole question moot quite honestly.

 

[dr g]

i agree, as I stated earlier, I was just trying to gain other vapers opinions to support my claim in an argument. My opponent was proposing the creation of a variable amperage mod, claiming that amperage was the most important thing and that it would be much more practical than a variable wattage device like is often produced nowadays. I showed various examples for the impracticality and nonsensical nature of this but I thought I'd "ask the audience" so to speak, to gain further support.

A variable voltage device IS a variable amperage device.

 

[Tangaroav]

It is nonsensical, but truly has nothing to do in a way with the original question. Let me explain...

In an atty you have a fixed resistance... wattage and amperage are both functions of the resistance and voltage...

Just like in a vw mod, you aren't "changing" the wattage. I mean you are, but there isn't some magical energy that travels along the wire called "wattage"... when you adjust the wattage you are simply adjusting the voltage in a different way... if you change the font size, you can click the up and down arrows, or you can just type in a size, but they aren't two always things, you're still just changing the font size... current is always a function of voltage and resistance, just as wattage is...

The point is, rather you had a variable wattage mod, or a variable amperage mod, you are still only changing one thing... the voltage... there's no other way...

Which makes the whole question moot quite honestly.

A variable voltage device IS a variable amperage device.

Yes, both right, but variable Watt will properly regulate your vaping experience without the need of constant re-adjustements

 

[twgbonehead]

A variable voltage device IS a variable amperage device.

Well, that's true but kind of misses the point. What we call a "variable-voltage" unit is actually a "Controlled-voltage" unit, in that the voltage is set to a specific value.

To my knowledge there are no "controlled-current" PV's out there.

However, this isn't actually a bad idea, particularly for a higher-powered unit. If you are controlling the current, you can drive pretty much any head "safely", even a dead short. Also, suppose you have a coil that's producing great flavor, but not enough vapor for you. You could wind the same coil, twice the length. Running it at the same current as the first one you could expect the temperature and flavor to stay pretty much the same, but with double the vapor production (assuming, of course that your wick can keep up). This is particularly true for a loose-wound coil, but it's probably not that far off for a compressed coil.

 

[Dampmaskin]

To my knowledge there are no "controlled-current" PV's out there.

From what I've heard, The Eye by Taifun is one. (Maybe the only one?)

 

[Tangaroav]

From what I've heard, The Eye by Taifun is one. (Maybe the only one?)

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...548883-introducing-eye-taifun-vw-va-vv-8.html

 

[sahsah]

space heaters are rated in wattage so you as a user can make sure the outlet your using has a sufficient rating. one may need a 20 amp fused circuit as opposed to a 10 amp circuit.
one can have 2 1500 watt heaters with different BTU outputs depending on the design of the coil. BTU's are also listed on the device. of course any control circuitry has to be account for also.

assuming the wire used in the OP's original post is the same gauge and type wire the heating profile would be hotter in the smaller coil as it is releasing the same amount of power in a twelfth of the space.

regards
mike

They don't have to be the same gauge. The variation in resistances can be achieved either through a difference in number of wraps ie amount of kanthal used, gauge of kanthal ie amount of surface area and conductivity difference, or the type of coil ie micro coil vs standard vs macro or the inner diameter of the coils could be different. Many ways to achieve different resistances. I don't see why they shouldn't be fair game. As long as the resistances match the figures in the example then it shouldn't undermine the question at hand.

 

[sahsah]

Not a good assumption, it is not specified and for good reason -- you can build a coil any way you like. Once you lose that assumption nothing about the performance can be assumed. Build is everything.



The important word there is could, yes it could. Or it could not. And that's the bottom line, build is everything.

So the correct answer is amps don't matter, the build matters.

Ok, well could a 3 ohm build and a .25 build produce the same Vape if both produce the same wattage, like where one couldn't tell them apart if blindfolded? Unless someone's using some sort of anti freeze wick I'm going to go out on a limb here and say I don't think so.

 

[dr g]

Ok, well could a 3 ohm build and a .25 build produce the same Vape if both produce the same wattage, like where one couldn't tell them apart if blindfolded? Unless someone's using some sort of anti freeze wick I'm going to go out on a limb here and say I don't think so.

Possibly, but it's irrelevant. You could build them both differently enough that you would not be able to tell which was which, and you could make them perform in opposite manners simply by build. That's the point here. So it's not the amperage that makes the difference, it's the build. Power is power for the most part and does not affect vape per se.

 

[AttyPops]

Even with everything else being equal (watts)
you'd have to factor in the watts being dissipated in the liquid. So cubic mm of coil area per cubit mm of liquid...OH...and.....the fact that one coil is thicker than another results in some kind of thermal latency differences. So, uhm, takes a complete team of a thermodynamics expert and about 2 physicists to figure it all out...on a good day.

So the "normal guy's answer" is different is different.

That's even discounting the performance differences between using different battery setups and different (or missing in the case of a mech) active components line power regulators, and charge pumps........

Bah. Different is different.

The real question: How different? Besides, you just start low and adjust higher until it vapes right. Or for a mech, you learn the ohms you like for the wire you have. And it's all subjective. And mech battery voltage varies over time constantly anyway.


(Obviously skipped some posts.

 

[AzPlumber]

I think you misread something. The builds can't be identical and have ones resistance come out to .25 and the other one come out to 3.0 ohms. Like I stated in an earlier post, the only differences are the amperage draw and the length of kanthal or I suppose gauge of kanthal would work too.

Your original post did not mention using only Kanthal wire. Theoretically one could choose two different alloys and build two identical coils with the same watts and different resistance.

 

[dr g]

Your original post did not mention using only Kanthal wire. Theoretically one could choose two different alloys and build two identical coils with the same watts and different resistance.

The OP obscures the answer to a large degree because of the wide spread in resistance. It is difficult to conceptualize with the current understanding of coil building, materials, and power levels. The two coils could indeed be built with a quite similar surface area of kanthal, or with either one greater than the other.

 

[Tbev]

The real answer is yes.

But the only thing you need to know about amperage is that you should be running Sony vtc's and then you have nothing to worry about. .. .

That's if your running low sub ohm builds. If not then amperage doesn't really matter for you.

 

[skoony]

Possibly, but it's irrelevant. You could build them both differently enough that you would not be able to tell which was which, and you could make them perform in opposite manners simply by build. That's the point here. So it's not the amperage that makes the difference, it's the build. Power is power for the most part and does not affect vape per se.

we are not talking about the build. we are talking about a straight up comparison of to different loads at the same wattage.
vapor production would be roughly equal.other attributes would be different.one still has to start from basic premises then advance to more complicated forms.
basic construction is one thing,advanced theory is another.
in a basic case scenario power makes a difference.

regards
mike

 

[dr g]

we are not talking about the build. we are talking about a straight up comparison of to different loads at the same wattage.
vapor production would be roughly equal.other attributes would be different.one still has to start from basic premises then advance to more complicated forms.
basic construction is one thing,advanced theory is another.
in a basic case scenario power makes a difference.

It does not make a difference in the absence of a difference in builds. And the builds determine what the difference is, if there is one.

This post summed it up really well and I think it has been missed by too many people.

 

[skoony]

It does not make a difference in the absence of a difference in builds. And the builds determine what the difference is, if there is one.

This post summed it up really well and I think it has been missed by too many people.

more power per wrap of coil=difference in vape.

regards
mike

 

[dr g]

more power per wrap of coil=difference in vape

Please read the link again.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...r-once-all-do-amps-matter-8.html#post13960874

 

[skoony]

Please read the link again.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...r-once-all-do-amps-matter-8.html#post13960874

more power per turn of coil in the parallel build different attributes to the vape. total vapor production would be roughly the same.

regards
mike