Is DIY juice making hard?

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Xorxand

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So I want to start mixing my own juice. I find my local Australian suppliers slightly lacking in pre-mixed options. I have tried and like 50/50 so that's my target at this stage. Vendors either offer ranges of 80/20 to 60/40 or 100% pre-mixed flavor that you still have to VG anyway.

My confusion is in the ratios of Flavor/PG/VG.

I don't need to worry about Nic values in my formula (zero nic vaper).

So am I correct in saying that 25% flavor, 25% PG, and 50% VG makes a 50/50 mix with 25% flavor? If its that simple an equation that mixing juice at different flavor% wont be hard to work out.

All the other information I have read is confusing and over-thought and contains more advanced formula than required for a beginner and puts me off.

The other thing I am worried about is... I know that mixing my own is a dangerous place to expect immediate results but is it hard to correct a poor tasting mix?
 

Katya

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juice making is not hard, but you need to know what you're doing. Even though you won't be be dealing with a dangerous substance--liquid nicotine--I still suggest you visit our DIY forum and read all the stickies (the permanent threads stuck at the top of the forum). You'll find a lot of good information there, including a handy juice calculator and tips on what kind of flavorings to use. You'll need to have at least 5 posts to be able to post there and ask questions.

DIY E-Liquid

Good luck and happy vaping!
 
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MiamiMom63

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Mixing is pretty simple. You should download the ejuicemeup calculator even though you won't be using nic. Many flavors are good to start at 10% flavor and then go from there. Some flavors are real strong and you might only want 1-2% flavor! such as enhances like cinnamon, chocolates, etc. You should start by making real small batches until you know if you like it, like 3 ml. The calculator is good because you will most likely eventually need to do more than one flavor and different percentages to round out your flavor. Very few are exceptional with just one flavor alone. There are Youtubes on how to use the calendar.
 

yellowsnow

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So I want to start mixing my own juice. I find my local Australian suppliers slightly lacking in pre-mixed options. I have tried and like 50/50 so that's my target at this stage. Vendors either offer ranges of 80/20 to 60/40 or 100% pre-mixed flavor that you still have to VG anyway.

My confusion is in the ratios of Flavor/PG/VG.

I don't need to worry about Nic values in my formula (zero nic vaper).

So am I correct in saying that 25% flavor, 25% PG, and 50% VG makes a 50/50 mix with 25% flavor? If its that simple an equation that mixing juice at different flavor% wont be hard to work out.

All the other information I have read is confusing and over-thought and contains more advanced formula than required for a beginner and puts me off.

The other thing I am worried about is... I know that mixing my own is a dangerous place to expect immediate results but is it hard to correct a poor tasting mix?

The ejuicemeup calculator is pretty simple. eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator
 

Jonathan Tittle

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When it comes to DIY, start small and work your way up. For new flavors, I mix 5-10 ml starter batches and once those are nailed down, I move to 30-60 ml batches of each flavor. Using this method, the waste is far less.

As far as ratios, if you mix 50/25/25, you may be a little off as most flavoring has PG in it as a base. The calculator below will help give you an accurate blending ratio, even if you're not using nicotine in your mix.

eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator


Set it as follows:

Nicotine Strength E-Juice: 0

Target Nicotine Strength: 0

Amount to Make: 5 (or 10, 15 etc)


The default flavor is set to 20%, so if you want to blend 25%, just change the number :).


For a 25% flavor (10 ml) mix, the mix ratio is:

2.5 ml PG
5.0 ml VG
2.5 ml Flavoring
 

vernhall

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check out the DIY forum here on ECF (DIY E-Liquid) or the DIY Group on FaceBook (https://www.facebook.com/groups/187700181289735/)... They both have tons of info dealing with starting flavor percentages and etc...

But, no, a 50/50 mix is not 25% flavor, 25% pg, and 50% vg - unless, that is, your flavoring is a pg base... most flavoring, in my experience, is not pg based, but either water or alchohol base...

DIY is not hard, but don't expect to jump in and be able to make commercial quality mixes on your first try.... Making complex, multi flavor juices is difficult, but simpler ones are a snap and just as satisfying in my opinion...

Pick up a good ejuice calculator like E-JuiceMeUp (eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator), some basic gear (a few syringes, bottles, etc), some flavoring and PG/VG and Nic base and you'll be ready to roll...
 

DasBluCig

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Three PRIME "ingredients" of DIY: 1.) TIME 2.) PATIENCE 3.) DETERMINATION........
If you suffer from what I call "McDonald's Syndrome" - ie., "Gotta have it NOW!!!!!!!!"...then, perhaps DIY isn't for you...
Especially with more "mellow" flavors - butter, caramel, vanilla, cream, marshmallow - it will take TIME for flavor to permeate the juice...
If you use 100% VG.....a WEEK OR MORE for a juice to "steep" is NOT uncommon....
ABOVE ALL.......Hope for the best ---- but EXPECT THE WORST on your first batch!!! Then, if things don't turn out as expected (and they often WON'T...!!:D) you won't be beating yourself up over it...."tweak" the original recipe.....or just move onto another!!
Some DIY'ers do it to save $$$....some, like me, are in search of a particular flavor's "Holy Grail" (in my case, vanilla!!) and don't mind playing with recipes, attempting to find Nirvana.....;)
Others' suggestions on supplies and e-juice calculators are spot-on!! But all the hardware and the finest ingredients are all for naught....
Without the "Big 3" atop my post.....!!
Best of Luck! And BE SURE to let us know about your creations!!
 

Vapoor eyes er

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The technical aspect is so very easy with all the available calculators BUT when finding the right recipe that's another story. Some of my recipes have upwards of 10+ flavors in them.
Juice Components
Flavoring usually about 5- 15%- could be higher or lower depending on the flavor used.
PG enhances flavor, TH and lung hit- water like - many of us believe PG to be a throat irritant.
VG= vapor and can mute flavor- thick
Nicotine- TH, lung hit and our need for nicotine. The MOST important ingredient in regards to TH and lung hit.
Standards in the industry are 80/ 20 or 70/ 30 PG/ VG. A 50/ 50 PG/ VG ratio seems to be gaining popularity.
 

Scottzilla

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check out the DIY forum here on ECF (DIY E-Liquid) or the DIY Group on FaceBook (https://www.facebook.com/groups/187700181289735/)... They both have tons of info dealing with starting flavor percentages and etc...

But, no, a 50/50 mix is not 25% flavor, 25% pg, and 50% vg - unless, that is, your flavoring is a pg base... most flavoring, in my experience, is not pg based, but either water or alchohol base...

DIY is not hard, but don't expect to jump in and be able to make commercial quality mixes on your first try.... Making complex, multi flavor juices is difficult, but simpler ones are a snap and just as satisfying in my opinion...

Pick up a good ejuice calculator like E-JuiceMeUp (eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator), some basic gear (a few syringes, bottles, etc), some flavoring and PG/VG and Nic base and you'll be ready to roll...
I have tried to join that group a couple of times now. (no luck so far) I really want to start DIY. I think I am going to start with MBV premix base just to keep it simple. I will most likely place my order Monday. Im gonna start with single flavors to find my percentage of flavors.
 

Screamin Eagle

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So I want to start mixing my own juice. I find my local Australian suppliers slightly lacking in pre-mixed options. I have tried and like 50/50 so that's my target at this stage. Vendors either offer ranges of 80/20 to 60/40 or 100% pre-mixed flavor that you still have to VG anyway.

My confusion is in the ratios of Flavor/PG/VG.

I don't need to worry about Nic values in my formula (zero nic vaper).

So am I correct in saying that 25% flavor, 25% PG, and 50% VG makes a 50/50 mix with 25% flavor? If its that simple an equation that mixing juice at different flavor% wont be hard to work out.

All the other information I have read is confusing and over-thought and contains more advanced formula than required for a beginner and puts me off.

The other thing I am worried about is... I know that mixing my own is a dangerous place to expect immediate results but is it hard to correct a poor tasting mix?

Mixing isn't hard, but it's a little more complicated then just adding 25%flavoring/25%PG/50%VG together. As many others have stated there are times you will only use 2-3% of a certin flavoring. That will leave a large void in your ratio.
Your best bet is to look at some juice calculators like http://dot1ml.com/ , or E-Liquid Recipe Name .

Play around with some fictitious recipes and get the hang of how the calculators work. Meanwhile gather some of the minor equipment you'll need to start mixing (Bottles, syringes, PG, VG...ect). Go into the DIY mixing section of this forum and read.

As for recipes? Start small and simple. One or two flavorings. Here's a good thread that I post in... http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/e-liquid-recipes/439217-simple-recipes.html . Stick to recipes for a little while until you get an idea of how some flavors are stronger then others and which ones they are. Keep reading the forums to get a good heads up on some flavors. Then once you get the hang of what you are doing, bust loose and go for it!!!

The main thing is, have fun with it.

Good Luck :thumbs:
 

bluecat

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It can be as complicated or as easy as you wish to make it. I tend to go the easy route and works for me. As with vaping in general a lot of it is trial and error to see what you like.

The easy route. 20 drops = 1 ml. 5 ml = 100 drops. Finding a % from 100 is easy. No it is not exact. I get a slightly different variation in every mix. I like it that way. Specially since that liquid will change taste slightly every day I vape it.

If I want a 10% flavoring mix that's 10 drops of flavoring in 5 ml or 20 in 10 or 30 in 15mls. The pg/vg will vary of course, but I don't find that slight variation meaningful to me. The more exact you want it, the more complicated it can be.. Since you are 0 nic it would make it much easier.

If it isn't sitting right one day. Drop a drop of something in. Presto.
 

Coastal Cowboy

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+1 on the recommendations of the EJuiceMeUp application. It takes a little time to get used to it, but after playing with it you'll have it down pat.

DIY can be a little intimidating at first, it's actually a lot easier than it looks when you first step through that door. And you actually don't need a ton of lab equipment to do it. If you have one of those little kiddie medicine dosing cups, some empty plastic bottles, an eyedropper and a clean cocktail glass, you've pretty much got a workable DIY "starter kit."
 
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Bill's Magic Vapor

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Once you can master a DIY calculator (I use juice me up), it's a piece of cake. The calculators take all the variables into consideration, forcing you to consider all the variables. Once you understand all the variables, then, yes, it's very easy. I've heard some good things in this thread, and some things which are completely inaccurate. Like others said, head over to the DIY section. I found that once I chose a good flavor vendor (The Flavor Apprentice in my case), I was able to find a thread on the DIY section on their juices. Some threads contain starting percentages for flavors. That was the hardest part for me. Some flavors need 1%, others 15%. How can you tell, other than to make 15 different batches? Starting flavor percentages was the key for me, and allows me to adjust up or down in a couple of batches to get very close to my desired result.

The most important part of DIY'ing is to be patient. It took me six months to get a "feel" for the juices. I really thought I just sucked as an "artist" on mixing and almost gave it up. I had spent so much on gearing up, though, that I couldn't quit, kept at it, and now can often make vapeable stuff on the first attempt. It takes a while to learn that a little of this, and a lot of that are what may be required to make a good juice. When I say a while, it took months and months. So, be patient. Master the DIY calculator and learn all the variables. Event the gear you select will affect the recipes. Sometimes, with pipettes, for example, 40 drops equals 1 mil, not 20 drops. It depends on your gear and measuring equipment. But, just knowing about all the variables is nigh impossible without a good calculator. The calculator also allows you to keep track of your concoctions, just in case you nail one.

That being said, many vapers slap together a nic base PG/VG blend and then add flavoring. That can work, but it doesn't convert to percentages, and is not easily communicated to others, let alone easy to record recipes accurately for reproduction. I was a nerdy scientific approach to it initially, sans lab coat. Not anymore, I don't perfect everything to the drop, but I get very close, again, this just comes from making a lot of juice. The thing that made the most sense to me, is that I can make juice so cheap, that it still works out cheaper to make an unvapeable juice, than to buy one that sucks. I make batches in 4 ml quantities to experiment with and continue to adjust until I find something that works. I will say that my best juices often take me a month or more (including long steeping times) to get just right, so, again, please be patient. It takes anywhere from a few days to a few weeks to properly steep the juices. I have some ten ingredient juices that just come to life after 5 weeks of steeping. I know, sounds like forever, but it is, what it is. I know all about speed steeping too, but I have the patience to just let it play out. Juicing is more than half the fun of vaping after you get the vaping gear you love and use.

So, to answer your question, technically it's easy, once you have the right gear and calculator and an understanding about all the variables. Until then, though, it's not easy at all, if you want to make something with more than one flavor. Throwing a 15% flavoring of a single ingredient is a piece of cake, but since we're playing with nicotine, it's best to be very accurate, than very sick. Best to you!
 

MiamiMom63

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Like Bill said, making juice is easy but liking it is a challenge. It took me months also to actually find a flavor I could call my all day vape and not have to go buy premade. You do start to learn as you go as to what flavors work good with what other flavors, which ones are real strong and you only need a little bit, and which ones you can use alot of. We've all poured out many bad batches so don't let it get you down. Also, for me anyway, I still try to stick to one or two recipes at a time, preferrably one so I don't get too frustrated. For example, if I want to make a good bubblegum flavor, I might try my bubblegum flavor at a certain percantage by itself to start, mainly to see how that flavor tastes by itself. I wait a week and try it out. From there I can decide what other slight flavor might enhance it, etc. Sometimes I have to go find a totally different brand of bubblegum to try because I had no luck with the one I have, etc. Sometimes I get so frustrated after several attempts that I put that flavor aside altogether and concentrate on something else and proceed the same way. lol. It does take alot of patience and time. Usually you may need to wait a week before you know what it really is going to taste like. If it is too perfumey, you know you used too much flavoring. But it can be alot of fun to experiment and sometimes you just are pleasantly surprised at how delicious your flavor came out and add that recipe to your book of good recipes. My book is actually sort of meager compared to others. ha!

Edit: I forgot to mention another group this is great to join if you are interested in asking questions or seeing other's recipes is on Facebook and called DIY Recipes. Best of luck to you!
 

Xorxand

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Sep 21, 2013
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OK so to everyone that replied, thanks very much for the very helpful advice. I grabbed the EJuiceMeUp and had a basic look around. At Least that is a lot simpler to use than most I've seen and considering that I'm in the zero nic dept it made it even easier.

Funny that the application indicates that for zero nic, you make a simple 50/50 and just add flavor. In most of the research I have done, if for example that PG is 60 drops per ML and VG is 30 drops per ML and flavor is 52 drops per ML that would mean that your not really truly getting a 50/50 using that method because you are now diluting your mixture. Methods used in the calculations from the EJMU application are all based on 20 drops per ML but the dilution still applies. Based on this I would be fair in assuming that my original statement about the ratio for PG(flav+PG)/VG is correct to some degree.

I'll be sure to do an actual check on drops per ML before running the numbers any further on my liquids, that will be my starting point and from all the above perspectives I have gathered here, its all based on trial and error and personal preference.

I'll join in at DIY soon and post my results.
 

Caridwen

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It depends on what flavoring you're using. Most will tell you the percentage to use. The super concentrated use 3-5%. Some as low as 1.5%. Some flavoring manuf. recommend 10%. So it depends.

I don't think I've ever used 20%. I start at 7-10% and work up. Too much flavoring is the same as too little- you can't taste it.
 

MiamiMom63

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For the Nature's Flavors organic extracts, I use higher percentages on some of them like 15-20%. But their bubblegum gets perfumey after 7% or so. Strange but it all depends on the flavoring. The TFA flavors are decent at 10-15%, but some are super strong and require only 1-2% like coffees, chocolates, cinnamon, gingerbread.
 
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