Placebo's can be used in various different ways and are sometimes used by knowing participants. Even though an e cig contains nicotine but none of the other 1000's of harmful chemicals it could be that an e cig mirrors the placebo in enough ways for e cigs to be considered placebo's. They kind of do the same thing, and i know not exactly the same thing, but there are enough similarities, aren't there ?. Tell me why you think an e cig should not be considered a placebo ?. Please try not to define the exact definition of a placebo because there isn't one. Maybe check wiki's definition of a placebo first. Try to make an informed opinion. Would it be right for the e cig to be defined in this way ?. If not how would "you" define an e cig in one word ?. If that's possible !. If not then explain in detail how the FDA should define e cigs ?.
Is the e cig a placebo !?
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I liked the AEMSA guy's definition or terminology: ENDD
Electronic nicotine delivery device. Much better than anything that links "cigarette" to it imo.
As far as what constitutes a placebo, sure the exact definition is elsuive because it's relative to the context. In a RCT (randomized controlled trial) a placebo is a substance, drug, whatever that is EXACTLY like (same consituents) as the study medication/device, or whatever minus the active ingredient(s). Having nicotine in them, which is the MAIN active ingredient in cigarettes to the best of my knowledge, means they are not placebos. My two cents anyway. Now a 0 nic juice PV/e-cig/ENDD certainly could be a placebo, if the person vaping it has no idea that there isn't nicotine in it and it is being compared to one that does.
Carbon
Electronic nicotine delivery device. Much better than anything that links "cigarette" to it imo.
As far as what constitutes a placebo, sure the exact definition is elsuive because it's relative to the context. In a RCT (randomized controlled trial) a placebo is a substance, drug, whatever that is EXACTLY like (same consituents) as the study medication/device, or whatever minus the active ingredient(s). Having nicotine in them, which is the MAIN active ingredient in cigarettes to the best of my knowledge, means they are not placebos. My two cents anyway. Now a 0 nic juice PV/e-cig/ENDD certainly could be a placebo, if the person vaping it has no idea that there isn't nicotine in it and it is being compared to one that does.
Carbon
I don't think that you get the same amount of nicotine with them cause I can go a lot longer inbetween gaping then I ever did smoking. At work I rarely even think about it. I do like to gape in the evenings though. I think its just the act that does it for me.
Whatever you do, DO NOT google gaping. You'll call up some seriously disturbing images. Seriously.
Quite the innappropriate auto correct! I'm laughing hysterically. Like to gape in the evening huh... sounds like something best kept to one's self! 
Anyway, no, I don't think ecigs are Placebos in ANY way, shape, or form. The main active ingredient in tobacco is Nicotine. People get addicted to Nicotine. Nicotine gives them the "buzz" from tobacco. There are some other alkaloids that also have effects, as well as some ingredients that potentiate the nicotine, but at it's base tobacco is basically a nicotine delivery sytem. Some people use zero nic juice, but again they aren't tricking themselves into thinking they are getting a nic buzz, they just enjoy the feeling of vapor in the lungs, and the flavor of the vapor. Nothing at all related to a Placebo.
PVs are also a nictoine delivery system, so there is no connection whatsoever to being a placebo. You could say that ecigs are an analog of cigarettes, but past that I don't even get where you are coming from. I can't think of any logical argument at all that could be made for labeling ecigs a placebo.
Sorry, just not understanding how any connection could be made....
Anyway, no, I don't think ecigs are Placebos in ANY way, shape, or form. The main active ingredient in tobacco is Nicotine. People get addicted to Nicotine. Nicotine gives them the "buzz" from tobacco. There are some other alkaloids that also have effects, as well as some ingredients that potentiate the nicotine, but at it's base tobacco is basically a nicotine delivery sytem. Some people use zero nic juice, but again they aren't tricking themselves into thinking they are getting a nic buzz, they just enjoy the feeling of vapor in the lungs, and the flavor of the vapor. Nothing at all related to a Placebo.
PVs are also a nictoine delivery system, so there is no connection whatsoever to being a placebo. You could say that ecigs are an analog of cigarettes, but past that I don't even get where you are coming from. I can't think of any logical argument at all that could be made for labeling ecigs a placebo.
Sorry, just not understanding how any connection could be made....
now I have to google gaping cause I'm curious -- thought it meant staring at something but am now assuming it's something vile or pervy.
No I don't think it is because one of the main identifiers of a placebo is that the user does not know its not the real thing. That is essential for the "placebo effect" to result. However, I do think "substitute" fits. An analogy would be a full baby bottle vs. a pacifier which would be a substitute. There are many similarities between the two just as with vaping and smoking but they aren't exactly the same ... there are elements missing and the baby learns pretty quickly a pacifier is NOT a full bottle. Definitely no placebo effect.
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Whatever you do, DO NOT google gaping. You'll call up some seriously disturbing images. Seriously.
OMG!!!
(I rarely do what others tell me NOT to do. When will I learn?
)
A placebo, by definition, does not contain a drug. Vaping provides nicotine, which is a drug. It is certainly not a placebo.
OMG!!!
(I rarely do what others tell me NOT to do. When will I learn?
I told ya but you just had to do it anyway didn't ya?
OT: I don't believe vaping is a placebo. I'm addicted to nicotine. My body craves it when I don't get it. Nicotine is in my smoke juice. When I vape it quells my cravings.
Even then, a pacifier and a bottle fulfill two different needs. The baby needs a bottle for sustenance. A pacifier just fullfils the desire of the baby to be chewing/sucking on something. While that desire is related to the need to feed, they are two different needs/desires being fullfilled by two different things.
A smoker needs his/her nicotine. A cigarette gives them their Nicotine. An ecig ALSO gives them their nicotine. In order for an ecig to be a placebo, it would have to fail at ACTUALLY delivering nicotine. Considering we know for a fact that nicotine IS delivered into the body with ecigs, it's not a Placebo. If anything, like I said, it's just an analog of real cigarettes.
A little of column A, a little of column B. While there's other ways to replace the nicotine we'd ordinarily be getting from smoking, perhaps the hand to mouth and inhale motion might be a bit placebo in nature. But smoking is both a chemical dependency and a "ritualistic" physical dependency. Maybe a 0mg vaper should chime in and offer their opinion.
But who really cares either way... it's working, ain't it?
But who really cares either way... it's working, ain't it?
I would say that it is a substitute rather than placebo. splendid is not a placebo for those who love sugar but find it unhealthy. It address the physical and behavioral effects of cigarettes
I would prefer the FDA to stay out of it all together but since we all know that won't happen, then define the E-Cigarette as a Smoking Substitute. The smoking ritual remains intact with little modification, as well as the visual cue ( the vapor ). This is why I believe the PV is so successful where NRT's have failed. The nicotine content of the liquid has little to do with its effectiveness.
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The device itself can never be a placebo, you will always know that it is not a cigarette.
Not the same with the liquid though, you could give someone 0mg nic liquid and tell them that it is >0mg nic liquid.
Not the same with the liquid though, you could give someone 0mg nic liquid and tell them that it is >0mg nic liquid.
LMAO!
No you're quite right, that would require Haldol, risperidone, or something like that!
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