I've decided...

[glassgal]

I appreciate the concern, and are not saying there are no concerns at all. I'm just saying that it's a negligible risk, the same risk you take holding a cell phone containing a hot lithium ion battery to your ear, 3/4" from your brain.

If your battery is overheating (can't count the number of times my laptop or cellphone got HOT), buy safer batteries, which Gato already plans to do. Charge on a non-flammable surface. Never carry battery items in your pockets. Throw away batteries that are even a bit deformed or damaged. Even if it blows up it doesn't mean it's going to harm you, let alone kill you.

I responded because the OP became so concerned that they are reconsidering some vaping gear due to battery concerns. That level of fear-mongering with new vapers is just going too far. Everyone I know has a cell phone and a laptop, and ipod, and other lithium ion batteries. Some of them may be cheap batteries.

Millions of lithium ion powered batteries, perhaps billions are in use every single day. You have a better chance of winning the lottery than your battery blowing up. What's the chances of winning the lotto? 13.5 million to 1? How many of these batteries are being charged worldwide as I type this? 100 million? A billion?

But someone should be worried about buying a PV that holds batteries because it might blow up? Nevermind that the USB plug in types also contain batteries? Yes, batteries can blow up. But again, the chances of it happening to you are probably about the same as being hit by lightning 5x back to back, or winning 2 lottos. Why scare people for odds like that?

 

[CommaHolly]

I think the thing to remember, is that this cautionary advice about not leaving batteries unattended while charging is for ANY BATTERY,,,,,,

so any battery you buy for any mod, no matter what the cost,,,,,,,should be attended. So should ego batteries. so should cell phone batteries.

and no, they don't take 8 hours to charge,,,,,,2 or 3 tops on a decent charger.

 

[Arch]

Thanks for all of the help every one! I've made my decision and I'm definitely buying the Provari along with a handful of batteries and the Nitecore i4 charger. Like others stated, I'll just slowly buy more batteries to lessen the amount of time I have to give to charging batteries per week. Eight 18650 batteries isn't really THAT expensive if you think of it in a long-term purchase of a new battery every couple weeks.

I do hope that one 18650 can last me from 6AM~ to 9PM~ with medium to heavy vaping.

 

[Train2]

Just a couple notes - even though I think the horse died:

- ALMOST every story that goes "viral" about an e-cig "blowing up" has been an Ego or cig-alike battery plugged into a USB port. Most of them of questionable source (cheap clone) and several of them plugged into a computer USB, rather than a wall outlet. Not all, but most.

- The "danger" that suggests charging while attended is that a venting battery could cause a fire. You want to be there to put the fire OUT (or have it inside a LiPo bag) - so it doesn't burn down your house.

- The SECOND type of "battery accident" is from improper storage - several people have SHORTED a battery by sticking it in a pocket or purse with other metal stuff (coins, keys...).

Good batteries, good charger, proper handling - and they're pretty safe.

 

[Gato del Jugo]

Yes, batteries can blow up. But again, the chances of it happening to you are probably about the same as being hit by lightning 5x back to back, or winning 2 lottos.

Based on your join date & post count, you'll probably have noticed by now that apparently ECF has had a few "multiple-lottery winners".. what are the odds!

Although I was lurking here for a little while prior to registering, I've already seen a couple threads where the OP's had their battery venting (no fire) while in their pockets.. nobody was hurt, but they did experience some warmth & caught it quick enough.. I don't recall the specifics, but I believe one was a non-removable eGo type in their pants pocket, and one was a loose battery(?) in a shirt pocket.. I don't believe either pocket contained anything else


One difference between a phone or lap-top battery, as opposed to a mod battery.. is the way it's used. With a mod, there are a number of variables when you start factoring in various voltage/wattage & ohm combos. Over time, this can potentially begin to chemically change the battery's internals, especially if it's of a lower-quality variety. You don't really have that variability with phone or lap-top -- since there's no real way to mess with the discharge rate like you can with vaping.


Nobody is fear-mongering. Odds are, most vapers will never have an issue over their vaping lifetimes. That said, things can & do happen from time to time -- just as they can with batteries for other devices. It's good to be mindful of what potentially could happen, especially if doing certain things could increase or decrease those odds.

Although the ProVari is not a mech, but a regulated mod with all sorts of protection already built in, there is a reason why this thread in another ECF forum is so popular right now...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...many-jan-join-dates-asking-about-sub-ohm.html

 

[Jazzman]

I appreciate the concern, and are not saying there are no concerns at all. I'm just saying that it's a negligible risk, the same risk you take holding a cell phone containing a hot lithium ion battery to your ear, 3/4" from your brain.

If your battery is overheating (can't count the number of times my laptop or cellphone got HOT), buy safer batteries, which Gato already plans to do. Charge on a non-flammable surface. Never carry battery items in your pockets. Throw away batteries that are even a bit deformed or damaged. Even if it blows up it doesn't mean it's going to harm you, let alone kill you.

I responded because the OP became so concerned that they are reconsidering some vaping gear due to battery concerns. That level of fear-mongering with new vapers is just going too far. Everyone I know has a cell phone and a laptop, and ipod, and other lithium ion batteries. Some of them may be cheap batteries.

Millions of lithium ion powered batteries, perhaps billions are in use every single day. You have a better chance of winning the lottery than your battery blowing up. What's the chances of winning the lotto? 13.5 million to 1? How many of these batteries are being charged worldwide as I type this? 100 million? A billion?

But someone should be worried about buying a PV that holds batteries because it might blow up? Nevermind that the USB plug in types also contain batteries? Yes, batteries can blow up. But again, the chances of it happening to you are probably about the same as being hit by lightning 5x back to back, or winning 2 lottos. Why scare people for odds like that?

I probably did a bad job of explaining the danger issues, namely cheap batteries and faulty chargers. The Nitecore i4 is a reasonable charger... for what it is. A $17.00 charger. These chargers have no where near the protection sophistication of even inexpensive cell phones or laptops. Plus, almost all of them use Lithium Polymer, not Lithium Ion. These 2 batteries are a very different chemical composition, so add nothing to the conversation but confusion. Apples and oranges. I use all kinds of Lithium based batteries in my other hobby (remote control helicopters) and we use very expensive chargers because of the dangers during charging. A typical charger I use runs $250.00. When a charger goes bad the resulting likelihood of venting is not lotto huge. And a $17.00 charger's likelihood of going bad is not lotto huge. It's a cheap charger, the chances of it going bad is proportionally greater than an expensive, high quality charger. Please don't downplay the dangers here. They are real.

 

[glassgal]

I think it's a great thing that people talk about battery safety. What got me commenting, which I linked, was that some of the fear mongering had someone so confused, they were thinking of not upgrading at all.

The reason all of us are here is to stay away from cigarettes, or get support while quitting. More powerful batteries help by getting us enough enjoyment to distract us from wanting cigarettes.

Are batteries more dangerous than cigarettes? I edited a comment last nite about insurance actuaries, it was so long-winded. But the fact is, that insurance agencies raise your health and life insurance rates if you smoke. They do not ask if you own items powered with batteries. Insurance companies are in business to make money. If batteries were a bigger risk than smoking, in any situation, they would ask.

So good point. I haven't seen them, but you say there are multiple lottery winners here. How many here have had their battery blow up while charging? There's 170,000+ members, and people are linking to off-site news stories. How many here got injured by a blown up PV battery themselves? (I saw none). And how many multiple lottery winners? (you claim several). How many here play the lottery? (I don't). How many charge pv batteries? (every single one of us).

How dangerous are batteries again?

 

[Arch]

From what it seems like to me from the perspective of a new vaper, there's a lot of hype involved on both ends. Some will say that there's a very high risk of battery issues due to their own past experiences or other people's experiences that have rubbed off on them. There's also people that have never seen or faced battery problems who will praise the comfort they have with using them. In reality, I think the possibility of a battery malfunction is definitely real, however unlikely if such batteries are treated correctly.

Just like a cigarette with fire safe protection, you could go to sleep with a lit cigarette in your hand and wake up to it ashed out and no fire started, or you could wake up to a house fire due to YOUR own lack of care. In the end, it all boils down to how you treat your equipment and the simple cautions you take during the process. I think that's where the safety is. Of course there's protection added with the Provari, which I damn well expect paying that much money for it. As well as protection in the battery, which is also expected.

That's just my current view on the situation after reading into it, and taking the advice from these comments that I really appreciate were taken the time and written out for me to read.

 

[Gato del Jugo]

glassgal,


If you go back a couple pages, Villiska was more concerned about battery-charging time, than anything, and became a little frustrated, understandably so.. Somebody in another thread mentioned that an 18650 takes 8 hours to charge... what?? I can see 4 hours at 500 mAh output.. is somebody using a charger with a 250 mAh output?

A 1-amp charger (1000 mAh), which is what was recommended in this thread, will take about 2 hours for your typical fully-depleted 2000 mAh 18650 battery.

Due to his busy schedule, he does not have time to "watch" it charging for 8 hours -- most people don't. People in this thread suggested that it's probably not the best idea to charge while sleeping or while away from the house. Do some people still do it anyway? Yep. And they probably won't ever have any issues. That doesn't mean it's entirely the wisest thing to do. I've already admitted earlier that I occasionally leave the house unattended for an hour or two while charging -- with lower-quality chemically-different more-volatile batteries, no less! Has anything bad happened to them? Nope! Does that mean if I continue to do that, especially with these batteries, that nothing funky will ever happen? Nope!


Again, Villiska was more concerned about battery charging-time, and thought that maybe he might have to purchase more than 2 batteries ($$), based on his schedule & various bits of info gathered from different sources... And because of it all, wondered if maybe he was making the best decision, considering the cost of ProVari -- and a few other added necessities required to vape with one. He's using an eGo type at the moment.. he doesn't have removable batteries & a charger, which obviously pushes the upfront expense a bit higher.


And then this thread started going the way of battery safety..

I wish I had links to those couple battery incidents here at ECF, even for my own curiosity.. alas, the search isn't exactly the best. Maybe I'll trying finding them later...

 

[glassgal]

Well, his ego should be watched while charging too then.

 

[Arch]

Well, his ego should be watched while charging too then.

Hahahaha, I totally read that as an insult at first before I realized you meant my current battery.

 

[Jazzman]

glassgal,


If you go back a couple pages, Villiska was more concerned about battery-charging time, than anything, and became a little frustrated, understandably so.. Somebody in another thread mentioned that an 18650 takes 8 hours to charge... what?? I can see 4 hours at 500 mAh output.. is somebody using a charger with a 250 mAh output?

A 1-amp charger (1000 mAh), which is what was recommended in this thread, will take about 2 hours for your typical fully-depleted 2000 mAh 18650 battery.

Due to his busy schedule, he does not have time to "watch" it charging for 8 hours -- most people don't. People in this thread suggested that it's probably not the best idea to charge while sleeping or while away from the house. Do some people still do it anyway? Yep. And they probably won't ever have any issues. That doesn't mean it's entirely the wisest thing to do. I've already admitted earlier that I occasionally leave the house unattended for an hour or two while charging -- with lower-quality chemically-different more-volatile batteries, no less! Has anything bad happened to them? Nope! Does that mean if I continue to do that, especially with these batteries, that nothing funky will ever happen? Nope!


Again, Villiska was more concerned about battery charging-time, and thought that maybe he might have to purchase more than 2 batteries ($$), based on his schedule & various bits of info gathered from different sources... And because of it all, wondered if maybe he was making the best decision, considering the cost of ProVari -- and a few other added necessities required to vape with one. He's using an eGo type at the moment.. he doesn't have removable batteries & a charger, which obviously pushes the upfront expense a bit higher.


And then this thread started going the way of battery safety..

I wish I had links to those couple battery incidents here at ECF, even for my own curiosity.. alas, the search isn't exactly the best. Maybe I'll trying finding them later...

OK, so we all recognize the dangers of charging mishaps. That's good. So what reasonable precautions should we take. Common sense rules the day here and eliminates most of the worry. Don't put your charger next to the curtains or cloth of any type. A clear fairly open area is much safer than a cluttered area. Don't charge next to that 18YO bottle of Scotch. Don't store your extra batteries next to the charger. Occasionally, if you pass by the charger while doing other things, feel the battery to make sure it's not getting more than very mildly warm. Keep stuff off the charger, not a good place to throw your dirty underwear while charging. Get a cheap fire extinguisher... they are really cheap at Home Depot and couldn't hurt to have one anyway. If you are going to charge while sleeping (must admit I do from time to time) dry out the kitchen sink and place the charger there, even a venting occurrence should be contained. If you have any type of issue with a charger, battery seemed to get warmer than normal during charging, funny smell, sparks flew out the side... get rid of it and buy another $17 charger.

Common sense will make the dangers manageable. Being aware of potential issues is half the battle. Nothing will make these batteries totally safe, but an airplane could crash into your head too. Take reasonable precautions and vape happy.

 

[CommaHolly]

OK, so we all recognize the dangers of charging mishaps. That's good. So what reasonable precautions should we take. Common sense rules the day here and eliminates most of the worry. Don't put your charger next to the curtains or cloth of any type. A clear fairly open area is much safer than a cluttered area. Don't charge next to that 18YO bottle of Scotch. Don't store your extra batteries next to the charger. Occasionally, if you pass by the charger while doing other things, feel the battery to make sure it's not getting more than very mildly warm. Keep stuff off the charger, not a good place to throw your dirty underwear while charging. Get a cheap fire extinguisher... they are really cheap at Home Depot and couldn't hurt to have one anyway. If you are going to charge while sleeping (must admit I do from time to time) dry out the kitchen sink and place the charger there, even a venting occurrence should be contained. If you have any type of issue with a charger, battery seemed to get warmer than normal during charging, funny smell, sparks flew out the side... get rid of it and buy another $17 charger.

Common sense will make the dangers manageable. Being aware of potential issues is half the battle. Nothing will make these batteries totally safe, but an airplane could crash into your head too. Take reasonable precautions and vape happy.

smoke detectors are wonderful things as well.

From someone who had a horriffic house fire in 1994,,,,,,,,you don't want one.