Just picked up a DSE905, Stick, and eGo for under $100 total (short review and comparison)
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Well, there is circuity involved, because without it, there'd be no circuit. But if it's simple circuitry, as I said (e.g., battery, switch, atomizer), then you shouldn't have any problem reversing the polarity by inserting the battery backwards.Thanks for the advice, there is no circuitry involve with a screwdriver, just the battery and the body.
So what exactly are the "wrong impressions" that people might walk away with? I feel that I have addressed every criticism raised so far, and they have either been false or matters of personal preference, but if there's an unresolved problem, I'd be happy to address it and correct it if necessary.Thank you Switched, that was EXACTLY what I was trying to say.
I don't see why someone should have to defend themselves for their views on something.
I guess the only CORRECT review on an eGo/Tornado is a GOOD review. Heaven forbid someone doesn't like ye ol' Holy eGo and posts about it.
I have got an "Genuine" (which is laughable when speaking of a Chinese product), and have the same observations as yours. Cone off center from atty, rattling button that want's to catch internally, and yes, my fingers also cover the button.
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As someone who is waiting his a new 'ego' given what I have been reading about it I found this review helpful. Infact I find one has be even more discriminating in the ecig forums because of I think a significant amount of 'hype' that can seriously derail expectations of the newbie imho. Divergent views temper this and gives more credibility to forums.
Its one's own responsibility to inform myself and posters here cannot be held responsible for that and no one should not claim that on behalf of others.
The reviewer has given us a well written and eloquent review and addressed the I think presumptions about device quality given Joye is the OEM of Janty products and Mik has never stated Joye has lower QA for products available at health-cabin or heavens gifts patiently and politely.
Its one's own responsibility to inform myself and posters here cannot be held responsible for that and no one should not claim that on behalf of others.
The reviewer has given us a well written and eloquent review and addressed the I think presumptions about device quality given Joye is the OEM of Janty products and Mik has never stated Joye has lower QA for products available at health-cabin or heavens gifts patiently and politely.
This is a "vendors" forum and as such many discussions cannot take place, because at the end of the day, it is the vendors that pay the rent.
I will not go over devices here, If an atty goes for $7 and someone else offers it for $3, when the going rate is between $8-10. Shouldn't you be questioning the $3 atty. That's all I am going to say about the matter.
I will not go over devices here, If an atty goes for $7 and someone else offers it for $3, when the going rate is between $8-10. Shouldn't you be questioning the $3 atty. That's all I am going to say about the matter.
I appreciate honest reviews. The OP doesn't need to highlight anything in his post, because he said it all. He didn't try to hide where he purchased any of the mods he talked about.
There seem to be a lot of "professional" (they think) reviewers around here that give hyper-postitive reviews of all ecigs they review because they get the ecig free for doing so. Reminds me of congressmen who take bribes.
So kuddos to the OP for just giving his sincere opinion of the Mods he bought and used.
There seem to be a lot of "professional" (they think) reviewers around here that give hyper-postitive reviews of all ecigs they review because they get the ecig free for doing so. Reminds me of congressmen who take bribes.
So kuddos to the OP for just giving his sincere opinion of the Mods he bought and used.
Wow this has been an interested debate...
Sorry to see such a hassle over this review, but thanks for sharing your outlook on the devices. Research with out hearing about flaws makes everything the same, so thanks, even though I'm still torn on several models.
Sorry to see such a hassle over this review, but thanks for sharing your outlook on the devices. Research with out hearing about flaws makes everything the same, so thanks, even though I'm still torn on several models.
As a minor update, the rubberized finish on the Joye Stick does actually give some extra protection against scratching. I've dropped it a few times now, often on pavement. With the silver body, this created scratches that went through the paint, and you could see the light from the LED shining through. With the rubberized coating, that hasn't happened as of yet. However, one down side is that it shows fingerprints and hand oils very well. It cleans up easily and well, though, so that's a minor issue for me.
Do you have any support for your assertion (e.g., forum rules indicating that "many discussions cannot take place," or even that this is a vendors forum)?
Sure...you should then answer those questions by picking up a few and trying them out. Then you can post about your experience with them here. Which is basically what I did with this thread.
A few things come to mind after reading all the posts such as - Live and learn - forgive and forget - don't take yourself too seriously - don't take it personally - can't we all get along? - it's all small stuff.
Just some of the things that come to (my) mind that overshadow the review. Like it or not. It does however make for lively dialog.
Personally, I would never rely on one opinion about anything. Something most adults have learned. Just my 2 cents.
Just some of the things that come to (my) mind that overshadow the review. Like it or not. It does however make for lively dialog.
Personally, I would never rely on one opinion about anything. Something most adults have learned. Just my 2 cents.
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I will try and be as politically correct as possible, and be done with it:
The tornado seems to have more reported battery problems than the eGo. Is one better than the other? Who knows, without knowing the actual number of units sold in comparison with reported failures? In other words:
In closing, I bought an eGo at Heaven's Gifts and it was the shetz, does that make the eGo bad or the vendor bad, since it is manufactured by the same company?
Boondogle knew he was buying a dinged stove, and there was absolutely nothing wrong with that, provided he new he bought a dinged stove. It was abvious the stove had a scratch because of the bargain basement price, once again there was nothing wrong with that. What could be construed as wrong is authorized distributors selling sub-quality products at the gpoing rate, and in turn giving said product a bad name.
My issues with Boondole's reviews is that they could have been more objective standing a lone (3 reviews) then all done at once. There was a certain degree of thoroughness wrt the Stick review, which seemed to dissipate with the others, IMO anyway.
Let's take the DSE 905 for an example, which is a nock off of the Screwdriver. To render justice to one or the other they need to be compared one against the other.
The Stick and eGo batt, IMHO opinion were units that failed QC, and hence not knock offs perse. As long as you know that you are buying a dinged stove, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. For the neophyte on the other hand that unknowingly buys a unit that perhaps has failed QC, for price alone, this is what we are trying to avoid, nothing else.
On that note, why does a $3.99 battery X at 1000 mAh show a lesser performance than battery a $6.99 battery Y at 750 mAh?
Disclaimer: The aforementioned post is fictitious and posted as pure speculation.
- ECF is not the only forum I frequent, it is just one of many. As previously mentioned one should never consider any "one" opinion prior to making a purchase or purchases;
- like the rest, I like to get the best bang for my buck. Sometimes this means paying a little extra or less. e.g the same item being sold at the same price by vendor X but being shipped at twice the cost from vendor Y;
- if the going rate for a dozen eggs is $1.99 a dz, would you be, or should you be weary of the dozen of eggs that sells for $0.49 dz. After all a chcicken is a chicken;
- otside of something that has been "fabricated" in some local machine shop, everything we purchase comes from China, right down to the majority of our liquids (read I didn't say all);
- it doesn't matter who produces product X,Y or Z, it's the quality control that counts in the long run;
- everything that is built, will be copied and resold under a different brand. the latter is not limited to e cigarettes or its components, it's the way of life and the world we live in;
- what has Walmart done for the US and Canada besides provide cheap prices? Folks say we need to buy American etc... well folks should of thought of that 20 years ago, before allowing the competition to move out. It all boils down to greed... business going offshore for manufacturing because of high manufacturing costs at home etc... who is getting richer? What is happening to local economies when these manufacturing jobs go offshore?;
- we never batted an eye when government increased the price of smokes, we b....ed about it, but payed, regardless of price, never thinking twice about it. Yet here we are going after the lowest price possible in stretching our mighty dollar in today's economy. Once again something that should have been thought out 20+ years ago. Why do you think prices are pretty uniform across the board from vendors? How does vendor A remain competative and profitable against vendor B, when prices are uniform? What makes you want to spend your dollar at one over the other?
- My name is Joe Bloggins, I developed a doodad. Unfortunately I do not have the setup or space to fabricate said doodad in my own 10x20 garage;
- I come to find that Harry what's his name who lives 2 towns over has the equipment and space to fabricate my doodads;
- Harry has garanteed me through agreement that he can produce X amount of doodads, to within X specification, in X amount of time, at cost X;
- all is well. Joe is selling his doodads and both are making money;
- the doodad is so good that Joe is having difficulty keeping up with the demand. He goes to Harry and asks can he increase production. The conversation of what transpires between Joe and Harry is a moot point and not germane to this discussion IMHO. However, with increased production more product is available and becasue the "doodad" is everywhere, and is a success, further expansion is needed, because manufacturing just cannot keep up with demand;
- for Joe he doesn't care who fabricates his doodads, providing the doodads are made to his design specifications. Unfortunately, Harry cannot meet increased production demands; so
- Joe finds another fabricator in the next county Mary, who agrees to fabricate doodads for Joe. Mary welcomes this business opportunity and all is well;
- all of a sudden Harry looses the contract of a previous customer who no longer needs "whatsyamacallits" anymore, he sourced elsewhere, maybe even offshore, regarless Harry is facing an employment situation. He went from X manufacturing hours to Y manufacturing hours whilst having XY employees. He no longer has enough work for XY employees, and has to lay some folks off or whatever. So Harry talks to his friend Joe and says I can fabricate X number more dooddads etc, and would welcome the work. Joe explains that at present the market is stable and doesn't have the need for extra fabrication of doodads;
- Harry comes to find out that Mary in the next county is also manufacturing Joe's doodads. Harry did not own exclusive manufacturing rights of Joe's doodads, and Joe had every right to seek a different fabricator in order to meet the increased demand that Harry could not fulfill, for whatever reason;
- Harry and Joe have been friends for some time and as friends often discuss the future etc... Harry's business is doing OK but not as good as it once did (this is pure conjecture) Joe not willing to see is friend Harry go down, mentions that his contract with Mary expires in W months, and that he is thinking that perhaps he can send Harry the business. Well Harry had no clue that Joe's doodads were doing that great, and although he would welcome the work, cannot meet the fabrication demands of Joe's success, Harry mulls this over for some time;
- Harry is a caring individual and wishes to provide a stable employment opportunity for his employees;
- Harry's is also a savy business man, having done the business analysis he knows that if he can corner a good portion of the market he can indeed turn things around (once again pure speculation);
- Harry and Joe meet and go over the business plan. It is agreed that Harry will become the exclusive mfr of Joe's doodads. It is further discussed/agreed that Joe only requires X doodads per whatever time frame. It is further agreed that Harry may distribute Joes doodads to other doodad vendors under contractual agreements etc... at a suggested retail price;
- well the doodad business is doing extremely well and Harry can no longer meet the demands for doodads, so he out sources, which is typical in todays business world. All is well for a while and every one is happy, business is good and profitable;
- the aforementioned story goes around and around. Too much out sourcing results in QC issues. We may be discussing e cigs here, but this happens in many industries and as such not limited to the e cig industry;
- Joe notices that the quality of his doodads has dropped. He approaches Harry with this etc... Harry promised Joe he would fabricate his doodads iaw Joe's design specifications. Joe is a descerning customer, so Harry only supplies quality product to Joe. Joe is happy. Harry on the other hand has a QC problem. It's not Joe's problem perse, it is Harry's problem;
- Harry has a supply X of sub standard product. He has a lot invested in acquiring this product and cannot merely junk them. So because Harry is as descerning as Joe, he rejects sub standard doodads from X, Y or Z, and informs them to smarten up. What happens with all these doodads that did not meet specifications?;
- the sub-contractors may not be bound as tight as Harry. Harry is the OEM for Joe. Once upon a time Harry and Mary were the only fabricators of the doodads. These doodads were manufactured entirely under the supervision and QC of Harry and Mary. Doodads became so popular, this could no longer be done. They are merely assembled by Joe now. Joe is also victim of his sub-contractors lack of QC; and
- so what happens to sub par doodads, that are relatively good, but perhaps failed QC because of a sticky button or crooked USB port. Are they thrown out or sold at a reduced price. There is absolutely nothing wrong by buying a doodad that failed QC, providing you know you bought a doodad that might have failed QC, not unlike buying a stove with a ding on the side for $50 off.
The tornado seems to have more reported battery problems than the eGo. Is one better than the other? Who knows, without knowing the actual number of units sold in comparison with reported failures? In other words:
- 10% failure rate of a 100 units sold is only 10 units; whilst
- 10% failure rate out of 1000 units sold is 100 units.
In closing, I bought an eGo at Heaven's Gifts and it was the shetz, does that make the eGo bad or the vendor bad, since it is manufactured by the same company?
Boondogle knew he was buying a dinged stove, and there was absolutely nothing wrong with that, provided he new he bought a dinged stove. It was abvious the stove had a scratch because of the bargain basement price, once again there was nothing wrong with that. What could be construed as wrong is authorized distributors selling sub-quality products at the gpoing rate, and in turn giving said product a bad name.
My issues with Boondole's reviews is that they could have been more objective standing a lone (3 reviews) then all done at once. There was a certain degree of thoroughness wrt the Stick review, which seemed to dissipate with the others, IMO anyway.
Let's take the DSE 905 for an example, which is a nock off of the Screwdriver. To render justice to one or the other they need to be compared one against the other.
The Stick and eGo batt, IMHO opinion were units that failed QC, and hence not knock offs perse. As long as you know that you are buying a dinged stove, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. For the neophyte on the other hand that unknowingly buys a unit that perhaps has failed QC, for price alone, this is what we are trying to avoid, nothing else.
On that note, why does a $3.99 battery X at 1000 mAh show a lesser performance than battery a $6.99 battery Y at 750 mAh?
Disclaimer: The aforementioned post is fictitious and posted as pure speculation.
Introducing the F16...
This is an all proprietary device, and although it may seem like a 510 clone, 510 components will not fit. They have stated the 510 components will not fit. It sports a "coned" atomizer and a 1200 mAh batt.
Nothing wrong with this device, it doesn't claim to be anything.
The cone on the eGo/Tornado on the other hand for folks who can tell the difference between vaping with and without, functions in a certain way and is not purely aesthetic. Nuff said. It does sports a 1200 mAh battery though...
This is an all proprietary device, and although it may seem like a 510 clone, 510 components will not fit. They have stated the 510 components will not fit. It sports a "coned" atomizer and a 1200 mAh batt.
Nothing wrong with this device, it doesn't claim to be anything.
The cone on the eGo/Tornado on the other hand for folks who can tell the difference between vaping with and without, functions in a certain way and is not purely aesthetic. Nuff said. It does sports a 1200 mAh battery though...
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Switched, as a currently unemployed Master production planner/scheduler (laid off due to business slow down), I enjoyed reading your long post about the 'process' that creates the availability of substandard products in the market.
A couple of things though might be added. Often, products get returned to retail vendors as defective from the user. The retailer returns to (eventually through however many middle brokers) the manufacturer for credit. The manufacturer (depending on the actual costs involved) may choose to repair or scrap the returned items. The manufacturer is trying to mitigate the costs and overhead of repairs/returns. Guess what happens to the repaired items? They may be returned through the supply chain to the same retailer or they may enter a secondary market (because some retailers, through contract, won't resell repaired goods). Just walk through a Big Lots. Or maybe (pure speculation) multi packs from Janty or TW.
Also, involved is when products reach or approach their expected shelf life (batteries are a chemical process and have a shelf life) or become the bottom of the barrel to clear out before new product arrives. What you sell (turn over) this month buys what you'll sell next month or so. So it's a good idea to turn the older, aging inventory at a discount, also justified by the carrying costs (among the other justifications for discounting and turning inventory over).
Just my two cents.
A couple of things though might be added. Often, products get returned to retail vendors as defective from the user. The retailer returns to (eventually through however many middle brokers) the manufacturer for credit. The manufacturer (depending on the actual costs involved) may choose to repair or scrap the returned items. The manufacturer is trying to mitigate the costs and overhead of repairs/returns. Guess what happens to the repaired items? They may be returned through the supply chain to the same retailer or they may enter a secondary market (because some retailers, through contract, won't resell repaired goods). Just walk through a Big Lots. Or maybe (pure speculation) multi packs from Janty or TW.
Also, involved is when products reach or approach their expected shelf life (batteries are a chemical process and have a shelf life) or become the bottom of the barrel to clear out before new product arrives. What you sell (turn over) this month buys what you'll sell next month or so. So it's a good idea to turn the older, aging inventory at a discount, also justified by the carrying costs (among the other justifications for discounting and turning inventory over).
Just my two cents.
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Absolutely true and hence probably why they are not covered under warranty.
Point two, also true providing it is a known fact at the time of purchases. Will you concede that not all vendors are honest? ... and what does that do to his/her business if they are not upfront? Honesty is still the best policy and many will do this. Am I naive to think that some "big vendors" are totally honest? Nope!
Burn me once shame on me, burn me twice shame on you.
Let's take for example Xtreme vaping for a second. Levy sells nic liquid. Not only does he sells nic liquid at a market price, he stands by his product. He is more concerned about the safety of his customers, than he is about turning a profit. The latter is not actually factual, but you catch my drift. Lately he has received liquid that becomes tainted when mixed with PG and VG, not the quality his customers have been accustomed to. (near crystal clear and no smell) He pulled the product off the shelves and had it tested, it is safe for consumption. In the mean time he has contacted his supplier wrt what happened. I gather from what we have heard it has everything to do with the chemicals used during the extraction process (neither here nore there, it will get sorted out or sourced elsewhere). This liquid is being sold as safe to use but has a slight pink tinge to it. This liquid is being sold at 35% off, to rid inventory and recoup costs.
I am sure that Levy at Xtreme vaping has the situation under control, because at the end of the day, it his reputation that is at stake, not his supplier.
When we buy the stove with the scratch on it knowingly, is very much different than buying said stove with a scratch unknowingly, wouldn't you say? e.g re-furbished batteries returning to the market place at market prices. IMO it is no different than buying a refurbishes alternator or starter for your car. The consumer has a choice which one he/she will purchase. Provided the same choice exists here, I am cool with that. That is all I am saying.
Not all vendors can be as honest as we (or they) would like to think they are. And they (the vendors) may feel they are being honest (as far as they know). I think it depends on the vendors situation and a fine line is sometimes crossed for the worse (for the customer to handle - and many will handle some loss for their own mistake. Like buying free PRADO e-cigs, such a scam). Do you own a Toyota? It's a case of the manufacturer producing cars with issues. Although they could blame a subcontractor, the burden of blame is on the manufacturer. The car dealers were caught in the middle between the customer and the manufacturer. Ultimately, the manufacturer suffers. But some vendors will suffer as well (guilt by association) for selling the defective items unknowingly. There are many organizations, certifications, quality standards in place for most of the things we buy (and add some cost to) that, unfortunately, seem to be marginalized (profit motive) in the world of e-cigarettes. It's hard, without the experience of others (such as those at this forum), to discern the good vendors from the bad, the good products from the bad.
I know that no vendor wants to take too much of a loss any more than any consumer. But some % of consumers will just suck it up, chalk it up to experience (rather than admit to being duped) and so the vendor 'gets away with it' in that case. It also is a clue to the vendor about the degree that they may 'get away with it' and be a further temptation to sell some substandard product(s). Sell a returned item to enough people and someone might, for some reason, keep it. Or for some reason not use/test it within the warranty period and find out they bought junk.
I have always bought my nic juice from Levy. Good guy. Quality product. And I did buy some of the substandard (by Levy's standard) pink nic juice. He did put it on sale because of how it looks and to clear up his inventory. He will use the proceeds to obtain his usual quality, I'm sure. It still could be that he got a tremendous deal he couldn't pass up. I don't know and I don't care. I bought 500 mls. anyway. I know the 'stove had a scratch' and I know I had a choice, and I made it willingly because of my satisfaction, with my dealings, with him in the past. And I am cool with that.
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I imagine quite a few places will be stocking them. I wouldn't mind seeing a review on these, especially from a Tornago user.
I may be that person. I am a Tornado user. I have 4 batteries. I bought them individually to get the warranty. They work just fine. I like the idea of a long period of time between charges that the F-16 or 016 or whatever MadVapes decides to call it, will, hopefully, produce. Like you mention the integrated atty/cone combo maybe a drawback, maybe not.
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