Lament of a former vaper

[butchrobotpope]

Ok - I'm sorry - I was certainly not attacking anyone for using e-cigs. I'm just trying to point out that it's A LOT OF WORK for something that is supposed to be care-free and enjoyable. I am not chastising people for vaping - I'm not discouraging it! I'm just expressing my disappointment to come back two years later and find out that the ....ing things still don't work on their own!

I totally get ya, man. But it's different and it *is* getting better. I had to adjust my expectations - hell, I had to learn that it's a lot different than smoking!

Someone, somewhere in ecf, summed it up like this: "I don't clean ashtrays; I refill carts. I don't buy new lighters; I charge my batteries..." I can't remember the rest of it, but it was like a cool litany. Analog or vaporizer - either way there's gonna be some crap to deal with.

Good luck.

 

[butchrobotpope]

Travis, I think you're just pushing for a wish that ain't gonna be true for awhile. I did hear there was a tobacco company sniffing around at e-cigs, but who knows if they'll get into the biz? And if "US industries" jump on board, it's not automatically going to make anything better, or cheaper.

If anything, you should be more cynical! It's amazing that this hasn't been outlawed, taxed out my price range and regulated to hell and back! Pharmacy for $10?! Please. Try with a prescription, for $200, plus your co-pay.

I know you're not yelling at people in particular, or even .....in really. I get it. I really, really wish this was a solid, dependable device *right now* too. It is what it is. And the people on this forum, or posting videos on youtube are just like you and me - because nobody else is doing it yet. Overall, this is a good thing.

 

[Viv Savage]

Alright, I was just razzing you with my last comment (although I do believe the payoff is far worth the effort). But I've only been vaping for just over 3 months, and I really can't imagine what it must be like to return to the technology after 2 years and find so little has changed... and I do agree with you here:

But what I knew then - and what I still know now - is that this device will NEVER succeed until major US Industry embraces it as a legitimate alternative to smoking. I'm talking about a multi-billion dollar investment - with a team of MIT graduates inventing the necessary technology out of thin air. That's what it will take to topple big-tobacco's hold on this country.

Unfortunately, right now, it's the federal, state, and local governments that are preventing any U.S. companies from blowing this thing wide open. When and if (hopefully just "when") there is a green light for it, of course American industry will radically revamp and overhaul electronic cigarettes (I mean, it's a market of nicotine addicts!). And yes, when that day comes, we'll probably be buying packs of hassle-free disposables (which are already on the market now, btw) at 7-11 on the cheap. (Although, hopefully for the environment's sake, it'll just be smoother running hardware & carts... but knowing America, it'll be diposables)

 

[travis]

alright - so, a couple of you told me to ..... off, understandably - several of you told me to just change my hardware - and the rest of you are just saying to stick with the whole experience, because it takes some effort, but is worth it in the long run.

Well, I appreciate everyone taking a moment to read my rant and reply to it, regardless of what your take was. I just needed to share my frustration in re-visiting vaping... and this site, which I really do think is great - it's just a little intimidating in scope. My anger really is is not directed at any member of this site - but rather, the US Tech industry, the FDA, MI state government... I suppose they can all go fu*k themselves. I just want a vape/smoke that doesn't seem like a daily chore.

 

[Captain Spaulding]

I just want a vape/smoke that doesn't seem like a daily chore.

lol.... you sound just like i did when i was first looking for one... i know i've already said it in the thread and so have others, but seriously go and buy a KR808D-1 and im tellin you, you'll think differently about it all.

 

[ZorbaTheGreek]

It can be frustrating Travis. for sure. You said you tried the aquarium filter (You don't smoke the filter, it doesn't even get warm under normal operation) I found with that one simple trick, and a few tries to get the size just right of the plug, I have a 100% reliable satisfying smoke. I pick it up, and puff all I like and it just keeps hitting. Put it down, even overnight. Roll over in the morning pick it up and start puffing. I use a m401, not a 510, but I have a 510.

I think they are pretty reliable devices. But the cartridges are the most fidgety part. Keep trying the foam IMO. Trim a little off, leave it a little thicker, once you get the balance right, it's just the bees knees. I would also say, that while I don't really do it personally, dripping/dipping seems like a good way to go. You get about a cigarettes worth of smoke, and it's not that much more trouble than getting out you smokes and a lighter, let alone ashtray. I don't see why people are telling you off, bummer it's been a pain for you. But hope you find something that works!

 

[travis]

Unfortunately, right now, it's the federal, state, and local governments that are preventing any U.S. companies from blowing this thing wide open. When and if (hopefully just "when") there is a green light for it, of course American industry will radically revamp and overhaul electronic cigarettes (I mean, it's a market of nicotine addicts!). And yes, when that day comes, we'll probably be buying packs of hassle-free disposables (which are already on the market now, btw) at 7-11 on the cheap. (Although, hopefully for the environment's sake, it'll just be smoother running hardware & carts... but knowing America, it'll be diposables)

Are you sure it's the fed's that are preventing the development of e-cig technology? I understand that it's under review by the government (guess they suddenly realized that simultaneously raising cig taxes while enacting smoking bans was hazardous to their income) - but I still don't see any evidence of proper tech research being conducted on vaping. Again - I could be wrong - but a device that replicates cigarettes, without generating combustible carcinogens? I'm pretty sure US Tech would jump all over that, regardless of what the FDA had to say about it.

 

[Wireguy]

Yes in a way they are. Would you sink millions in a technology only to find new, unknown, unforseen regulation would totally destroy your investment? Thats not investing, thats gambeling,

Are you sure it's the fed's that are preventing the development of e-cig technology? I understand that it's under review by the government (guess they suddenly realized that simultaneously raising cig taxes while enacting smoking bans was hazardous to their income) - but I still don't see any evidence of proper tech research being conducted on vaping. Again - I could be wrong - but a device that replicates cigarettes, without generating combustible carcinogens? I'm pretty sure US Tech would jump all over that, regardless of what the FDA had to say about it.

 

[420GypsyGirl]

If we could get a university or a lab to conduct a real gas chromatography-mass spectrometry analysis on the vapor produced by various PV's and liquids that are used to see exactly what is in the vapor, maybe then we can really start to make some headway on getting development on e-cigs in America. I do not believe enough testing was done by the FDA and I also believe that they did it with bias due to pressure from Tabacco companies.

We need 3rd party testing and studies done by people who have nothing to gain on the outcome.

 

[Wireguy]

Right now (yet) there isn't enough money to attract the businesses and a morass of litigation in the way. The only development the current manufacturers are doing is reading this forum. We are the developers and test departments.

The "Frankenstein PV some guy made in his basement", "but e-cigarettes need a breakthrough, MIT style. And the MacGuyver stuff here - it's admirable - but it's not going to cut it for me."

Thats it! Collectively we are MIT. Modders in transition. Or what ever. Two years later it seems almost all of the innovation in this industry has come from former and present members of this forum. It's likely to remain so for awhile.

If you read for a while you will find amongst our members engineers of several varieties, chemist and a whole host of specialties and tinkerers contributing. It's kind of like the Linux of the e-cig world.

When the e-cig gets to where you want it there wont be as much use for this forum. In the mean time we get to play, develop and share ideas.

 

[travis]

If we could get a university or a lab to conduct a real gas chromatography-mass spectrometry analysis on the vapor produced by various PV's and liquids that are used to see exactly what is in the vapor, maybe then we can really start to make some headway on getting development on e-cigs in America. I do not believe enough testing was done by the FDA and I also believe that they did it with bias due to pressure from Tabacco companies.

We need 3rd party testing and studies done by people who have nothing to gain on the outcome.

Somebody who has an investment in E-Cigs should solicit a 3rd party testing of a real gas chromatography-mass spectrometry analysis on the vapor, and submit the results to the press. I'm not trying to tell people how to run the e-cig business - I'm just observing that as a user, nobody of any relevance seems to be running the industry, and that is kind of ....ed up.

 

[Brewster 59]

To me there is a trade off, yes ecigs can be frustrating but no going to the store every day, no smelling like an ash tray, no dealing with cig butts, no burn holes, better flavors, better for me, and i dont have to go outside to smoke. I think I can live with the trade off.

 

[Cielo]

Hi Travis,

Glad you came back to this forums. Several other people mentioned the kr8 and I just wanted to chime in that this is also my favorite pv. While I dont spend any time at all tinkering with it, I do spend about 10 minutes a week cleaning out my cartomizers and refilling them. I will admit that I spend lots of time reading the reviews on different flavors but thats all fun for me.

Even if you decide that pv's arent right for you at this moment, I hope you will still continue and support the group wide effort to make pv's better and better.

 

[AlexTM]

It seems to me like 90% of this website is devoted to people still trying to get their e-cig to work properly.

Well, that is what forums are about quite often. If I visit a forum about, say, mobile phones, I might also get the impression that a very large part of the postings is about getting those fracking things to work properly.
Because, well, that is what forums are (also) for: Problem solving.

After all, it would be a fairly boring forum, if everybody would post every day: "Vaping still great, vaped the whole day without any problems!" And yet, that is exactly what happens to most people on most days.

Ok - I'm sorry - I was certainly not attacking anyone for using e-cigs. I'm just trying to point out that it's A LOT OF WORK for something that is supposed to be care-free and enjoyable.

If I had a dollar for everything I brought with the promise of "care-free and enjoyable" which was not really, I'd have been able to place quite a few neat orders, instead of wondering if I can afford this or that.

Also, analogs are not all that easy, either. (And certainly you never tried pipe smoking!) You need to remember to get them, have them with you, have fire with you, a small ashtray, ashtrays at home, you need to know how to treat small burns, burns in your stuff, etc. It's just that we were used to do that over umpteen years, while vaping is new. That's all.

 

[Hudsonkm]

What he said...

Same here.

Ive only been vaping for about two weeks now and have been using the kr808d-1.

VERY hassle free and simple to use. And once I figured out the correct way to draw off of it Ive been impressed by the amount of vapor, throat hit, and flavor of the cartomizers.

I hear some people say that the kr808 doesn't provide enough of a throat hit to satisfy a former heavy smoker.

I started smoking in the military, and my habit was up to 2 1/2 packs a day of non filtered camels or lucky strikes. I'd think that is a pretty heavy habit.

And despite that the kr808 has been great for me and I haven't had the slightest temptation to pick up another analogue.

 

[Hudsonkm]

I should also add that here in Chicago you pay about 8 bucks a pack for cigs.

So the money I save is nice too

 

[butchrobotpope]

What wireguy said. In fact, what wireguy says, in general!

There are some really big brains in the forums. I feel damned lucky to have this as a free resource. If I wasn't so damn tight on money I'd love to kick down some supporting funds. In fact, I might do it anyway.

 

[FlipnOut]

I agree with everyone who said to get into Cartos (KR808-D1's as mentioned before). Then, goto your basement and build yourself a box mod... all day vape by carrying 3 cartos with ya and yer box mod. If yer not a tinkerin kinda fella, then grab a couple extra long manual batteries for your KR8's and you're golden.

Cartos hold about 20 drops of liquid, most people kill 1.5-1 cartos per day. You can refill them with a heavy duty paperclip and some liquid.

Don't give up, cartos will make your life easy.

 

[UberDuper]

I've only been at it a week now and I understand most of the OPs points. Probably the single most limiting factor to the progress of the tech is the desire to have a cigarette lookalike. I don't mean by the modders.. They've got the right idea. There's just no real manufacturers building hassle free devices of any size that incorporate a large battery, atomizer and liquid tank.
I'm amazed that nobody seems to make a 'home vaporizer' unit that doesn't use batteries at all. Yes I know there's passthroughs.. But if I'm going to sit at a desk and vape with 110AC at my disposal.. why would I want to use a tiny little atomizer at 3.7v that has to be replaced every week or two?

UD.

 

[jlmanno]

Travis, I respect your opinion and input. After using a PV for only a couple of months I wish the technology was better and there was some in depth analysis of the vapor. But one thing I know for sure is that at this time after trying everything else on the market to quit smoking, vaping worked for me on the first day. Now given that after 30+ years of smoking and repeatedly failing being able to quit, the PV, yes with some tinkering, is the best option at this time for me. I'm sure the forum has changed from it's early days but like any smoking cessation product, a support mechanism aids the process. I wish you well and certainly wish that some MIT ingenuity as well as some big$$$ would be invested into this explosive market. If vaping is found to be more hazardous than smoking well I certainly will at least enjoy the rest of my years being smoke free finally!
Take care and best wishes!