Legacy’s David Abrams acknowledges that e-cigs are “much less risky than cigarettes.” Has Legacy turned over a new leaf?

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NorthOfAtlanta

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They may be also looking at the 76,000 cohort study that proves that 2nd hand smoke doesn't kill or seem to have much influence on any ones health.

They have been caught in a 40 year old Big Lie and the e-cigarette movement should be shouting this from the roof tops. Can any one believe people who have been lying for that length of time.

They just lost the biggest club in their ban cigarettes arsenal as smokers know what they are doing can kill them, they no longer have anything but it stinks to use with the non smoking public.

It's called diversionary tactics, give them something else to fight.

Anyone else want to join it's the 40 year lie club?

ETA: We need to shove this down their throat until they choke on it, there are two things that didn't exist when the 80's WHO study came out, us and the WEB.

Those who would control our lives just had to do a 180 on salt, we need to run a gorilla type operation and use this study to undermine them every chance we get.

The nice thing about this is it moves the fight back to people need to quit smoking for their own health and off the we are killing others battle.

Guess what the best way to reduce harm is.

This may be enough of a golden bridge and may explain Legacy's change of heart. The people running it are not stupid.

:2c::vapor:
 
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NorthOfAtlanta

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Interesting how these studies are surfacing sine WHO began their "Vapers should go back to smoking" campaign. :lol:


That's ok, we can use it against them. If the fight is moved to smokers health and they lose the "it kills others" mantra it becomes harder to vilify e-cigarettes.

;):vapor:
 

AgentAnia

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I hear ya Ania, and are with you on drowning the (insert very bad words here), but take consolation in this:-

A golden bridge may lead them to a safe haven, but for how long ?
Their deeds will revisit them. ;)

I'm an old lady and don't have time to wait for them to meet their just rewards. Wanna see it soonest! :mad:
 

AgentAnia

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But look at it this way, we've found a way to survive longer to stick a finger in their eye, says the guy who turned 67 yesterday.

:D:vapor:

Good point, NoA! And happy birthday! (Did you give yourself a shiny new something to celebrate?) Mine's tomorrow. Have had a few more than you! ;)
 

NorthOfAtlanta

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Good point, NoA! And happy birthday! (Did you give yourself a shiny new something to celebrate?) Mine's tomorrow. Have had a few more than you! ;)

Got a good present, daughter graduated from college with a business degree after 13 years of off and on schooling. She is going to take over the shop and dad might see retirement before he turns 70.

:toast::D:vapor:
 

supertrunker

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The funny thing is that most of the public "get" e-cigarettes - that they are as effective a way to get away from tobacco as anything else on offer. Only in NY apparently can they not distinguish between an e-cig and a real one!

More to the point, the evidence is mounting daily that ecigs are safer than tobacco, to the point that "we just don't know how safe they may or may not be" becomes an unrealistic stance. I vape all day at work with the full blessing of my workmates who are not maths geniuses. But you ask someone which is safer: a cigarette with 4000+ chemicals and 70 carcinogens in it, or my e-liquid, with 4 ingredients (one of which is in your toothpaste, one in your inhaler and one in the pie you will eat at lunchtime from the pastry store) and see what they reckon.

That is not to say they are 100% safe, but i have heard figures like 1000 times safer than cigarettes bandied about. You cannot argue with the science and so even delaying knee-jerk regulation may well be enough to ensure the acceptance of vaping as a viable alternative for smokers to quit.

T

And Happy Birthdays!
 

Fulgurant

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I hear ya Ania, and are with you on drowning the (insert very bad words here), but take consolation in this:-

A golden bridge may lead them to a safe haven, but for how long ?
Their deeds will revisit them. ;)

Unfortunately, your sentiment -- though admirable -- runs directly counter to my experience. In this world, the larger and more powerful you are (and thus the greater the magnitude of your mistakes), the less accountable you are. A janitor who misplaces $20 in office equipment may get fired and denied a favorable reference; a CEO (or politician) who mismanages or misplaces billions of dollars gets a Powerball-sized severence package, a politically correct send-off, and every opportunity to spend the rest of his days at lucrative speaking engagements or in other honoraria/consulting positions.

That article Ania posted shows exactly what's wrong with our political process. What's most striking is that the theft of the computer money (the main subject of the article) is the least of the problem. Every single person cited as having worked for Legacy drew an extremely generous check for, um, spreading propaganda? Bribing congresspeople? Pretending to be important? I'm wracking my brain here.

The justification for those salaries is so scant, so elusive, that the lament at the end of the article comes off as unintentionally (and morbidly) hilarious: "Ohh, think of all the extra children we could have reached if our tech expert hadn't stolen $4 million from under our well-compensated noses and run off to Nigeria!" Lady, seriously? Donate 2/3rds of your publicly-subsidized salary for 8 years and look! $4 million, like friggin magic! Or better yet, have you ever considered spending some of your own bloated salary on extra staff to man the supply chain so that this crap can't happen? Just a thought.

Don't get me wrong; I don't begrudge anyone a generous salary, even one that isn't morally justifiable. In fact, the problem here is precisely that morality's been incorrectly injected into what should be a fairly straightforward cost/benefit analysis. Is anyone clamoring for more ugly anti-tobacco advertisements? Is there anyone left in the entire western world who isn't aware of the health risks of smoking? Where, then, is the legitimate (as opposed to corrupt) demand for Ms Healton's services? There isn't any. Not in the private sector, not in the public sector.

The bottom line is that when you're making that kind of scratch, you don't get to style yourself as an altruist. And you surely don't get to justify your salary -- even as you remark on evidence of your own incompetence -- on the basis of altruism. The implied logic at work in Healton's commentary is so twisted I'm getting dizzy.

Say what you will about big or small government. I think everyone can agree that there are better places to put public money than in Ms Healton's pocket. Or even in her organization's pocket. But positions like hers are a dime a dozen, and they're handed out willy nilly to those with connections. You can bet that prominent ANTZ will therefore find no shortage of absurdly comfortable fallback options, in or out of tobacco control, no matter what happens in our little war.

The important thing is that we win that war. Sorry for rambling.
 
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