Mech mod weak hits

[erlik28]

Hi guys,

I just bought a new Bonza Kit, but I was very disappointed that it gives such weak hits. Thing is that it's my first mech mod, and I'm convinced I'm doing something wrong.
I checked all the connections and cleaned them.
Batteries are brand new, Samsung's 40T 21700 4000mah, 3.6V, 30A discharge, fully charged (i tried a couple of them, I also tried a older 18650)
At first, I installed a couple of claptons (KA1 Clapton coils 0.85 ohms, inner diameter 2.5mm ) barely got any vape out of it.
Then I installed a diy coils Ni40, 3.5 mm, 9 wraps, the build came out at 0.41 ohms. A bit better but that's still very weak.

I saw in all the adverts/reviews the guys blowing out huge vapes, and I can barely get out a few drizzles.

I was thinking to put in a new build that should go down to 0.2 ohms.

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong here? Or is it possible the mod if faulty? (although I highly doubt the latter)

Thanks in advance

 

[bombastinator]

Advertising is usually mostly BS. The photographs were likely of competitive cloud chasing pros vaping pure VG for one. High VG juices have muted flavor but create large dense clouds. I generally vape single coil and I find large diameter wraps (I generally like 3.5mm) with a good amount of cotton will do just as well as a dual coil. The bonsa appears to be a dedicated dual coil deck though so a dual coil is probably what you are going to have to make for correct operation. Mechs do not create bigger clouds than regulated mechs. I personally stopped using mechs entirely some time ago. They’re a pain in the ...., do not in my opinion provide a superior vape, and can be dangerous. More air will provide bigger clouds. It is possible your airflow or wicking may also be an issue.

 

[erlik28]

Thank you for your reply.
I didn't mention but the airflow is fully opened.
I've been vaping for a few years now, but regulated only. I just thought I might need more durable/less breakable at times so i thought to myself why not try a mech mod, no screens, no chips what on earth can break

 

[bombastinator]

Thank you for your reply.
I didn't mention but the airflow is fully opened.
I've been vaping for a few years now, but regulated only. I just thought I might need more durable/less breakable at times so i thought to myself why not try a mech mod, no screens, no chips what on earth can break

They do tend to last longer, but the disadvantage is you have to be much more careful about your builds, and just about every battery fire on the internet is the result of a misused mech mod. With a mech the battery dumps all the juice it can all the time. They will also fire with an upside down battery creating a positively charged case. I’ve vented two batteries in my pocket using a mech with an unprotected switch.

 

[tailland]

Your 0.85ohm Klaptons..they'll make (without calculated loss) 1,18A at 3.6V = 4,25W
That's nothing.

Let's say you have a 0.5ohm build, running at 3.6v. makes it 3.6v*7,2A=25,92W.
That's good enough for 6-wraps/24A micro-coils, but not really for that much more :ß

Trying building something simple and solid between 0.3 and 0.25, then you should be going somewhere.

 

[erlik28]

Thanks for your reply @tailland i'll try to get to 0.2 - 0.25, in a couple of hours

 

[Shawn Hoefer]

Also, look to Ni80 or SS316L wires. These have a much faster ramp up compared to Kanthal.

My go to mech build is a dual coil Ni80 fused Clapton (26x2/36) 6 wrap 3mm ID 0.17Ω. It's a hot vape on a fresh cell but settles down shortly.

 

[sonicbomb]

@erlik28 a single battery can only put out so much oomph, somewhere between 60 and 90 watts battery dependent.
Even if you use a lower resistance, claptons and the like use a lot of wire and this increase in mass will need (a lot) more power to bring up to temperature.
If you think 0.85 ohms is going to produce a lot of vapor on a single battery mech, then perhaps you need to examine how much you think you know about unregulated devices and ohms law. I don't mean to appear overly harsh, but unregulated devices can be frustrating/dangerous if not used with significant prerequisite knowledge.

IMHO a hot vape on a single battery unregulated device is an exercise in frustration even if you like solving engineering problems, for fun. To get more power you need lower resistances using more metal which is harder to heat, with higher and higher current levels leading to exponentially increasing voltage drop. Akin to the mythical Ouroboros consuming it's own tail.
There was time when I liked nothing better than trying to engineer a great vape out of the limitations of mechs. Those days are over.

 

[erlik28]

Thanks for your reply @sonicbomb, i guess it was wishful thinking to those claptons could produce proper clouds. But you're right , alongside @tailland , 20 something W is veeeery low. I'll go for 0.25 build. That should at least get me past the point of feeling like it was a complete waste of money

 

[gpjoe]

As many have already pointed out - the mass of wire is killing your single battery as it struggles to heat up all of that metal. You would get a faster ramp and much more vapor from a couple of single wire coils. The only other option would be a dual-battery series mech at 8.4v, which would instantly heat those coils to a blistering hot vape.

I would save the massive dual coils for my regulated mods.

Try starting with a single SS clapton or a couple of 22 or 24ga single wire kanthal, SS, or nichrome coils and move on from there.

 

[gpjoe]

And Sonic is correct: as you lower your coil resistance in an attempt to increase current and wattage at your coil, the voltage drop of the mod itself will increase resulting in less voltage at your coil, which equals less wattage. It's simple Ohm's Law in a series circuit.

Think about it: If your mod has a resistance of .15 ohms, and your coil has the same resistance - fully half of the voltage will be dropped across the mod, with the other half available across your coil. If your coil resistance is lower than your mod's internal resistance - it gets even worse.

 

[Ben85]

This is the common tale of too much coil mass.

Scrap the fancy pants builds and Follow the advice given above. FWIW when I used dual coils (long time ago now) I used 24g ss316 spaced builds. Just ensure you build to your battery.

 

[Ben85]

Oh and in addition, 20 watts is not “low”. It entirely depends on your atomiser and your liquid. I shifted away from cloudy set ups to small chambered single coils and high nic salts. I can now happily vape away on 12w.

 

[dhomes]

for mechs IF you want clouds & fast ramp up you are looking at .15 ohms (many of us do lower but that's still on the safe side w/a good battery)

5 wraps of parallel 26g SS wire on 3mm bit, dual coil will get you right there. It's a simple buid that ramps up FAST and gives me plenty of vapor.

Add an extra wrap if you want extra safety, but original batteries from Sony / Samsung / LG should have an issue handling that (never had an issue myself)

 

[Ben85]

for mechs IF you want clouds & fast ramp up you are looking at .15 ohms (many of us do lower but that's still on the safe side w/a good battery)

5 wraps of parallel 26g SS wire on 3mm bit, dual coil will get you right there. It's a simple buid that ramps up FAST and gives me plenty of vapor.

Add an extra wrap if you want extra safety, but original batteries from Sony / Samsung / LG should have an issue handling that (never had an issue myself)

Hate to challenge a statement, but this is simply not correct.

Each individual battery has its own CDR. Yes Sony, Samsung and LG arguably make the “best” batteries, but just because they are those brands doesn’t mean they can all be run at the same (very low) resistance.

Before you run any build on any battery, you need to find out how many amps that specific battery can safely run at, and then build within that safety parameter.

Always remember to build to your battery.

 

[Baditude]

I agree totally with @Ben85.

Explain it to the Dumb Noob: Ohm's Law Calculations for a Mechanical Mod

 

[VHRB2014]

for mechs IF you want clouds & fast ramp up you are looking at .15 ohms (many of us do lower but that's still on the safe side w/a good battery)

5 wraps of parallel 26g SS wire on 3mm bit, dual coil will get you right there. It's a simple buid that ramps up FAST and gives me plenty of vapor.

Add an extra wrap if you want extra safety, but original batteries from Sony / Samsung / LG should have an issue handling that (never had an issue myself)

Your coils are the bomb. But you gotta remember that all those manufactures make low amp batteries also and you definitely dont want to use a 10 amp specced battery on that build. Always specify which model battery so there is no confusion. I know you meant vtc's or 25r's, but just tossing out the brand name is not good enough. Gotta be spacific due to the less thans that will read this page. Vape on!

 

[Baditude]

But you gotta remember that all those manufactures make low amp batteries also and you definitely dont want to use a 10 amp specced battery on that build. Always specify which model battery so there is no confusion. I know you meant vtc's or 25r's, but just tossing out the brand name is not good enough. Gotta be spacific due to the less thans that will read this page. Vape on!

I totally agree with the above.

Mooch's Approved 18650 Batteries

Samsung 18650 30Q, 3000 mah 15 amp CDR

Sony 18659VTC6 3000mAh 15 amp CDR

AW 18650 3000 mah 20 amp CDR

LG 18650HG2 3000mah 20 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC5, 2600 mah 20 amp CDR

LG 18650HE4 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-25R, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

Sanyo UR18650 NSX, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC4, 2100 mah 23 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC5A, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-24S, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

LG 18650 HD4 2100 mah 25 amp CDR

LG 18650 HD2 2000 mah 25 amp CDR

LG18650HB6 1500mah 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB2 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB4 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC3 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-20S 2000mah 30 amp CDR

 

[MacTechVpr]

for mechs IF you want clouds & fast ramp up you are looking at .15 ohms (many of us do lower but that's still on the safe side w/a good battery)

5 wraps of parallel 26g SS wire on 3mm bit, dual coil will get you right there. It's a simple buid that ramps up FAST and gives me plenty of vapor.

Add an extra wrap if you want extra safety, but original batteries from Sony / Samsung / LG should have an issue handling that (never had an issue myself)

Agreed, it's about the relationship of wetted wire surface to mass given the power level supplied. High mass and big power will give you a great deal of diffusion…after the fact. But it's not vaporization (or power) efficiency.

Good luck.

 

[Tmebs]

P.S.
Mooch just down graded the LG HG2's
Now 18 not 20 amp
My order of 6 new ones arrived in the mail on the same day he posted the new info

I mirror Shawn, same wire, single coil, .34.
Single battery mech squonk, use all day (7-8hrs) and when I need to refill bottle I change battery. Love the N80 coils!!!