ni80 in a mech Nichrome is dangerous because it can release chromium fumes???
is this true?? haven't used ni80 for this reason
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is this true?? haven't used ni80 for this reason
@mac-nutty, not that I am aware of. I have had no issues using and I never dry burn to red hot.
coils last me a long time and never look the worse for wear.
I actually used my first attempt an N80 coils for almost six months, re wicking and dry burning every 4-5 days.
I also diy my e-liquid and its not sweetened and gunky, that may have something to do with it also.
I just make sure to never over dry burn too HOT.
coils last me a long time and never look the worse for wear.
I actually used my first attempt an N80 coils for almost six months, re wicking and dry burning every 4-5 days.
I also diy my e-liquid and its not sweetened and gunky, that may have something to do with it also.
I just make sure to never over dry burn too HOT.
Kanthal, SS and Ni80 all contain Chromium within their alloy at various amounts. Chromium Oxide is claimed to be toxic – at what amount, I have no idea. Chromium Oxide forms at higher than vaping temperatures, I believe >700 °C but do not quote me on that. All 3 metals risk chromium oxide and to my knowledge, Kanthal also risks aluminium oxide – to which I do not know of the damaging effects.
We constantly breath pollutants in the air. I smoked for 35+ years, drink alcohol, eat processed food and consume medication made with ingredients I cannot pronounce. There are toxins within the products we use in everyday life. And, as mother nature has displayed in the past, should my cat evolve opposable thumbs, she will take over the world and wipe the human race from the planet. I can only hope the bacon I feed her will lead to her showing mercy on me.
A little chromium in the system is the least of my worries.
A little chromium in the system is the least of my worries.
Merriam-Webster:
alumina noun
alu·mi·na | \ ə-ˈlü-mə-nə \
Medical Definition of alumina
: an oxide of aluminum Al2O3 that occurs native as corundum and in hydrated forms (as in bauxite) and is used in antacids — called also aluminum oxide
Kanthal was conceived perhaps a century ago to exude alumina at its surface, a ceramic. Don't recall ever seeing any significant vapor chromium traces coming out of any serious study. Any reliable data on this topic appreciated.
Good luck.
Lots of good advice...not familiar with your setup..my go to "cloud build" (keep in mind, I normally run a 1.2 ohm coil on my mech..lol) is a dual coil, 3mm ID, 316SS, 8 wrap. Comes out to .3ish ohms.
One thing that I haven't seen mentioned it to make sure your mod is clean. I give all my new stuff a bath. Keeping mechs clean makes sure there's no "extra resistance" causing weak hits.
One thing that I haven't seen mentioned it to make sure your mod is clean. I give all my new stuff a bath. Keeping mechs clean makes sure there's no "extra resistance" causing weak hits.
Merriam-Webster:
alumina noun
alu·mi·na | \ ə-ˈlü-mə-nə \
Medical Definition of alumina
: an oxide of aluminum Al2O3 that occurs native as corundum and in hydrated forms (as in bauxite) and is used in antacids — called also aluminum oxide
Kanthal was conceived perhaps a century ago to exude alumina at its surface, a ceramic. Don't recall ever seeing any significant vapor chromium traces coming out of any serious study. Any reliable data on this topic appreciated.
Good luck.
And therein lies the problem – are there any serious studies? I have read that Kanthal produces an Aluminium Oxide - what effect does this have on the human body when inhaled? You can Google Aluminum Oxide toxicology and see there are some serious effects. Are we exposing ourselves to these risks with vaping? I have no idea….as I stated above. And keep in mind, inhaling something is a lot different than consuming it.
I am not a metallurgist, nor involved in the medical field, but logically any alloy that has chromium as an element risks the toxins produced by this when heated. At what temperatures and how much is produced is unknown to me (I guessed at 700 +°C) and I never stated these toxins are a risk with vaping. I just identified that chromium is used in other metals and not just Nichrome – so if one alloy is at risk, then logically so are the others that contain this element.
Lots of info on this forum on alumina. Plenty of experience with Kanthal as it's been used as a heating element material for a very long time. We're not dealing with nano particulates of alumina either which the average reader here may mistake perhaps to be the same as deposition layers of alumina we encounter with wire. They are not, as I understand. However with other metals there is the potential of off-gasing of their respective oxides at far lower temps. This we should watch out for and all of us exercise due diligence.
Good luck.
Lots of info on this forum on alumina. Plenty of experience with Kanthal as it's been used as a heating element material for a very long time. We're not dealing with nano particulates of alumina either which the average reader here may mistake perhaps to be the same as deposition layers of alumina we encounter with wire. They are not, as I understand. However with other metals there is the potential of off-gasing of their respective oxides at far lower temps. This we should watch out for and all of us exercise due diligence.
Good luck.
And where is that objective data? I’m not disagreeing with you but are we making speculative assumptions, or do we have 100% certain fact over these claims? I do not know so I am asking.
And not disputing the off-gasing of oxides with other metals at lower temperatures. But again, where is that objective data? And how does it compare to other alloy’s/metals we use for a coil? Are all within a safe margin? Define safe.
I have seen many speculative reports over PM (Particulate matter) emanating from coils with some claiming to be harmful, some not. But not one scientific report from a credible source. So lacking that objective information means everything discusses is speculation at best.
You are correct I think under…I hesitate to use the word normal, so…typical operating conditions I don't believe some alternatives we commonly use for wire exhibit anything more than acceptable trace amounts of oxides. Perhaps I am wrong but my emphasis is not testing such wire materials used primarily for TC. Risk from off-gasing from what I've read seems more likely to be encountered through dry burning at excessive temps. Again, lot of threads here on this topic including ref links. Don't have the time to look through my own files for notables or I'd at least list some of them. I've been busy since last Thu as I mentioned and still not out of the woods. But I think we agree. Don't think anyone here's vaping at anything close to the dry fire conditions necessary to produce anything significant. I would not be.
Good luck.
In my quest for information I found this study from Johns Hopkins school of public health. Samples taken from 56 users found “claimed” unsafe levels of lead, chromium, manganese and nickel. The study does not conclude as to where these traces came from, but does suspect the heating coil to which they did state there will be further testing.
They did not go into detail as to what vape products were tested, or how they operated (ie: wattage/TC etc) but given the vast use of Kanthal as a heating coil, the probability of Kanthal being a contributor to any of these toxins is most likely pretty high. Lack of details so I am speculating.
I have no idea of the credibility of this institution, and the lack of details does leave me a little suspect. The article is also written like anti vaping propaganda than any true credible study. But if there is any fact to this, it does demonstrate there are a lot of unknowns as to the toxins being produced by our vape devices.
On a internet forum full of armchair experts (me included) I am sure we can come up with a bunch of speculative answer/debates toward these so called claims. BUT….can we provide objective data that proves they are either wrong, or that if we vape at XYZ levels we are in the clear from these toxins? I am leaving that open for discussion.
My personal view is I have little concern. Vaping has been the only way I have been able to break free from that ball and chain that is referred to as cigarettes that took control of my life for 35+ years. And as I mentioned above there are many hazards within life that we show little to no concern over. But lack of concern, at least from myself, does not mean we should not acknowledge the risks….should the above risks be of fact.
I will leave you with the link to the study for all to interpreted as they wish. I am off to vape my Kanthal mesh and feed my cat some bacon in the event she does evolve opposable thumbs and decides to take over the world!
Study: Lead and Other Toxic Metals Found in E-Cigarette ‘Vapors’
They did not go into detail as to what vape products were tested, or how they operated (ie: wattage/TC etc) but given the vast use of Kanthal as a heating coil, the probability of Kanthal being a contributor to any of these toxins is most likely pretty high. Lack of details so I am speculating.
I have no idea of the credibility of this institution, and the lack of details does leave me a little suspect. The article is also written like anti vaping propaganda than any true credible study. But if there is any fact to this, it does demonstrate there are a lot of unknowns as to the toxins being produced by our vape devices.
On a internet forum full of armchair experts (me included) I am sure we can come up with a bunch of speculative answer/debates toward these so called claims. BUT….can we provide objective data that proves they are either wrong, or that if we vape at XYZ levels we are in the clear from these toxins? I am leaving that open for discussion.
My personal view is I have little concern. Vaping has been the only way I have been able to break free from that ball and chain that is referred to as cigarettes that took control of my life for 35+ years. And as I mentioned above there are many hazards within life that we show little to no concern over. But lack of concern, at least from myself, does not mean we should not acknowledge the risks….should the above risks be of fact.
I will leave you with the link to the study for all to interpreted as they wish. I am off to vape my Kanthal mesh and feed my cat some bacon in the event she does evolve opposable thumbs and decides to take over the world!
Study: Lead and Other Toxic Metals Found in E-Cigarette ‘Vapors’
I'm sorry, I wish I had the kind of time time to rev these old anti-vape "studies" or the extent they were covered here or not. I know there was some considerable discussion on so-called metal quasi-studies in the past year or so. Perhaps regarding this particular piece of work. But lead! Really? What were they using for atomizers…horseshoes?
These may be informative…
Debunked: Toxic Metals In E-Cig Vapor Study
Leading Doctor Questions ‘Metals Found in Vaping’ research
Good luck.
p.s. My take on equipment and methodologies of studies I've perused is that none are using or vaping what I am or in the manner that I do it. If they were, and honestly, they'd have to be for it.
p.s.s. And btw, no weak hitter I.
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Under-vaporization is our nemesis. Accretion and oxidation of the device its primary cause (assuming it's not the design of the wind itself, no short failure or disparity of output from asymmetry of the coil and/or its installation).
Weak hit? Clean your coil/s and mod. Start there. Be happy.
Good luck.
TIP: A needle-nose micro dropper and distilled water is your friend. It will allow you to vape off accretion from coils at low power levels. Balance uneven duals (by ......ing fire of the warmer side). Same thing with single coils if individual turns expand or separate in use and need to be coaxed back in line. Save the red hot pulse for final confirmation. This will help greatly extend life of wind done routinely but judiciously.
Weak hit? Clean your coil/s and mod. Start there. Be happy.
Good luck.
TIP: A needle-nose micro dropper and distilled water is your friend. It will allow you to vape off accretion from coils at low power levels. Balance uneven duals (by ......ing fire of the warmer side). Same thing with single coils if individual turns expand or separate in use and need to be coaxed back in line. Save the red hot pulse for final confirmation. This will help greatly extend life of wind done routinely but judiciously.
Propaganda, be it pro or anti, is present with many industries. It is an unfortunate reality. Given I am not a metallurgist, nor involved in the medical field, I try ignore the propaganda and focus on the facts with an open mind. In this case I feel both arguments lack specifics which means there is still a level of uncertainty. I am open to the fact that the levels of toxins are below a safe median. But given the lack of testing details I am also open to the fact that those levels could be greater or even lower that what was displayed within that study.That is of course assuming there is any fact to the study. There is a large absence of definition as to when, or how these toxins are produced.
Lead is not used in Stainless Steel, Kanthal, Ni80 or…. But these metals are not fabricated in lab type environments which exposes them to other contaminates. The “May contain nuts” warnings on food that does not contain nuts is a good example. The content of lead within our vape supplies may not be at a level of concern, but with detailed analyses it can be revealed.
Lead is not used in Stainless Steel, Kanthal, Ni80 or…. But these metals are not fabricated in lab type environments which exposes them to other contaminates. The “May contain nuts” warnings on food that does not contain nuts is a good example. The content of lead within our vape supplies may not be at a level of concern, but with detailed analyses it can be revealed.
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