Mesh... what am I doing wrong?!?!?

[DigiManTX]

i had a thought yesterday after i was dripping on a bridge-less atty (usually what i get the most flavor from)...

i guess my thought is simple really... not enough juice directly on the coils...

keep in mind, this is all my experiences... ymmv

in cartos... the coils are surrounded by juice, pretty much at all times... when it gets low it has a diminished flavor, and when it gets too low... burnt taste

vivi novas... i notch out the grommet around the wick to increase juice flow to the coil area... with a tilt right before i vape = flavor awesome... no tilt/chain vape/etc, not enough juice = diminished flavor... too low juice = dry burn taste

atty's... over drip on bridged = flavor awesome... just a couple drops = diminished flavor... just a few drops (so that it's a tiny pool on the coils) de-bridged = flavor awesome... as it dries of course flavor diminished and then burn

so... to me it seems not necessarily a "wicking" issue, but rather a juice quantity to coil ratio issue... cause with 500, i can pretty much go thru a whole tank on a single burn, and the wick will keep up, but only enough to keep the coils from glowing...

maybe i'll have to build a wick (with a hole) specifically to create the "volcano action" to increase the level of juice that might overflow out of the top back down directly onto the coils... idk... thoughts?

 

[DigiManTX]

another thought on this... idk if i can explain this right but here goes:

with carts = coils completely surrounded in juice
with my novas mentioned above = coils pretty much covered by the level of juice that is in the wick (bottom/sides/and possibly even the top of the coil depending on how soaked it is)
with bridge-less atty = covered pretty much completely (sits in a pool, so top/sides/bottom all covered)

with ss mesh wrapped with coil = essentially only the bottom portion of the coil is touching the liquid...

maybe something like sandwiching the coils in between 2 wicks would increase the juice content around the coil... ie. create a small wick - wrap coils around it - then wrap another wick around that... i know you would prolly have all kinds of shorting issues and whatnot... but like i said, just a thought...

 

[Big Screen D]

I think you are spot on. Fine line sometimes between flooding, and not quite enough juice for optimal flavor.

Try making your wraps much closer together, and concentrate at the bottom half of the wick. That's how I build mine, though on a much thinner wick. I find this to work extremely well.


Wrong img lol

 

[DigiManTX]

I think you are spot on. Fine line sometimes between flooding, and not quite enough juice for optimal flavor.

Try making your wraps much closer together, and concentrate at the bottom half of the wick. That's how I build mine, though on a much thinner wick. I find this to work extremely well.


Wrong img lol

i was thinking maybe making a mesh wick (to get the good wicking properties of mesh) and then wrapping the top with some silica wick and then coils over top that... would eliminate the need to oxidize... or maybe even make wick, oxidize, then wrap silica wick in between the coils, so that it covers the coils on essentially 3 sides... just don't know how to go about making the silica stay in place... or a 3rd option possibly... mesh wick, cover top in silica, then coils, then another layer of silica over top of the coils...making a coil sammich... lol

 

[Big Screen D]

I have seen that done. Can be done with cotton as well.

 

[DigiManTX]

I have seen that done. Can be done with cotton as well.

i was not happy with the flavor that came off of the cotton when i attempted using it as a wick...

 

[Big Screen D]

Yeah, I prefer mesh over cotton as well. Still say try a lower, more. Compact coil.

 

[DigiManTX]

Yeah, I prefer mesh over cotton as well. Still say try a lower, more. Compact coil.

can you attempt that pic again, so i can see what you're talkin about?

 

[Big Screen D]

I figure the closer to the juice source, the better. Plus, having extra wet wick above the coils adds another avenue for juice to reach the coils as it's consumed. Now funny thing is I filled and drilled a top cap with the new hole lower to be directly adjacent of the low coil. Oddly, I didn't car for it as much as with the hole in it's normal position, and have just been using normal dud 1.5mm hole top caps.

Sorry for the wrong pic. Stupid work.

 

[gdeal]

I figure the closer to the juice source, the better. Plus, having extra wet wick above the coils adds another avenue for juice to reach the coils as it's consumed. Now funny thing is I filled and drilled a top cap with the new hole lower to be directly adjacent of the low coil. Oddly, I didn't car for it as much as with the hole in it's normal position, and have just been using normal dud 1.5mm hole top caps.

Sorry for the wrong pic. Stupid work.

Seems like most gennys have the air hole positioned to hit the center of a coil. Interesting result for you when you moved the center point. I m thinking that there is some relationship to the air mass above the hole opening to the air mass below and the ability to optimize the mix of air with vape. I just cant figure it out....

Edit: Very nice set up!

 

[gdeal]

another thought on this... idk if i can explain this right but here goes:

with carts = coils completely surrounded in juice
with my novas mentioned above = coils pretty much covered by the level of juice that is in the wick (bottom/sides/and possibly even the top of the coil depending on how soaked it is)
with bridge-less atty = covered pretty much completely (sits in a pool, so top/sides/bottom all covered)

with ss mesh wrapped with coil = essentially only the bottom portion of the coil is touching the liquid...

maybe something like sandwiching the coils in between 2 wicks would increase the juice content around the coil... ie. create a small wick - wrap coils around it - then wrap another wick around that... i know you would prolly have all kinds of shorting issues and whatnot... but like i said, just a thought...

You can also take the hybrid route. Using mesh around a cotton, bamboo, etc.. A number of examples are in the Vivi Nova Tutorial thread and elsewhere on the forum. Sorry dont have a link on hand, but I was able to get good results with some vivi set-ups and some SRT sets up. There are some entertaining videos there by MISTer E as well. Worth the watch.

 

[DigiManTX]

You can also take the hybrid route. Using mesh around a cotton, bamboo, etc.. A number of examples are in the Vivi Nova Tutorial thread and elsewhere on the forum. Sorry dont have a link on hand, but I was able to get good results with some vivi set-ups and some SRT sets up. There are some entertaining videos there by MISTer E as well. Worth the watch.

i think the coil being wrapped around the mesh itself is the issue... IMO it's the fact that the juice is not touching enough of the surface area of the coil... picture it like this:

juice = | and __
coil = 1


so in a "dripping" mode as well as cartos... the coil is covered on all sides by the juice:
____
|_1_|

in a soaked silica/cotton/bamboo/yarn/etc wick... it's covered on at least 3 sides:

|_1_|

but in mesh... the coil is only touching the juice on the bottom side of the coil (where it meets the mesh):

_1_

hence, why i feel the flavor is thinned... but again... i'm only talking about flavor here and this is just my opinion and my experience... the flavor is not bad mind you... it's just not as sharp or defined as with other methods...

 

[gdeal]

Yes I hear ya on vaporization surface. Wicking velocity (how fast the juice can travel through the material) is slower with mesh too (IMO). That and the surface area contact you describe above are key factors. I'm not sure if you can get the carto experience with a pure coil on SS mesh. Its all about trade-offs right now. When I switch back to a Vivi with cotton, it can be like night and day, but my Vivi coils last about 3-4 days and then they are done.

 

[DigiManTX]

ok... so did a little experiment this morning... took the wick and rolled the top portion in some cotton... has about a mm thick all the way around... wrapped a 6/5 coil of 32awg a1 (netted me 3.3ohms)... at 5.2 volts right now... and aside from the nasty cotton flavor i can't stand, it is a noticeable improvement in flavor... still not "carto/dripping sharp", but better flavor...the cotton is so swelled up right now, you can't even see the coils... LOL

 

[spraintz]

Hey brother, what part of Texas are you in? If you are in the North Dallas area or close to it I have a some different genesis style atomizers to compare to and a bunch of different gauges of resistance wire, I would be more than willing to meet up and see if we can't find a combination that will get optimal results. PM me.

 

[DigiManTX]

Hey brother, what part of Texas are you in? If you are in the North Dallas area or close to it I have a some different genesis style atomizers to compare to and a bunch of different gauges of resistance wire, I would be more than willing to meet up and see if we can't find a combination that will get optimal results. PM me.

PM sent...

 

[DigiManTX]

I think I found my win in my nova's... cheesecloth... about 5 draws of off flavor and it's almost identical to dripping... now to figure out how to incorporate this on/in a mesh setup... i saw the strand method by quiqs on utube, but i don't want a hole... but i think i'm on the right track here...