Message to e-Liquid vendors: This is what we want from you!

[Racehorse]

I want to know exactly what I'm vaping. I'm sure a few sites qualify there, here is one I found so far (I'm still a newbie):

Annette's site Virgin Vapors qualifies on this, and also ships in glass amber bottles to boot:

Frequently Asked Questions | Virgin Vapor | Electronic Cigarette Organic e-Liquid | Electronic Cigarettes

They tell the ingredients, the quality control, what their VG-only liquids have, the differences in their lines, etc.

 

[Racehorse]

Also, have you guys ever looked in PIF ? 1/2 the information you need is NOT on the lables--- because the customer just doesn't have it.

Must have:
Nic %
PG/VG ratio (70/30, 0/100, 50/50)
Amt. liquid in bottle in ml
Name of flavor/juice
Expiration date

This should be standard.

 

[Racehorse]

Here's what I want from CUSTOM MIXERS. (I don't mind paying you more, if you can tweak my vape and help me find what might work for me with your product).

Lets say you mixed something and it's "not quite right" for me....but almost. Would more flavoring help me? Less? Higher or lower nic? More or less alcohol? If you have a mostly PG juice that I liked, would it "taste" okay if we made it all VG, or would doing that totally ruin the recipe? Can you customize my 100% VG so it flows a little better in a cartomizer/clearo?

and, are you willing to help me...... "refine" one of your products this way......... so that I may buy from you and therefore send you lots of $$$ for many years to come?

All I want to know is if this or that tastes a little alcohol-y for ME, or a little perfumy for ME, what might we change in my next order to see if we can correct it? (Otherwise, sending you $50 every week isn't really gonna work for me.)

If you say you say you are a custom mixer, and can make stuff "to order" ----then you should know the answers to all these questions. If you don't, then I can just become a DIY and do it myself, but I'd rather pay you because you're supposed to be the *expert*.

(I don't have the room, the time to become DIY, and I actually am not even interested in mixing my own juice).

 

[Mr.Mann]

Also, have you guys ever looked in PIF ? 1/2 the information you need is NOT on the lables--- because the customer just doesn't have it.

Must have:
Nic %
PG/VG ratio (70/30, 0/100, 50/50)
Amt. liquid in bottle in ml
Name of flavor/juice

This seems like it would be common place, but it's not. I won't mention who, but one vendor sent me bottles of liquid that came in little boxes with a small computer generated print that had the name of the juice on it. When you opened the box, the only thing on the bottle was a tiny sticker with the mg. Most of the juices were the same color and also smelled very similar. The little boxes were a hassle to open, so of course I kept them out. Me, having to label their product is super silly.

My bottles from Ahlusion I got today, all came printed with the flavor, the pg/vg ratio (selected by the consumer*), nicotine level, and date of birth.

* Their Premium line is the only line that cannot be self-adjusted for pg/vg ratios, and there are only about 4-5 of those juices out of their whole line-up. A side note: Ahlusion has differing suggested ratios already set on the ratio selector, so if you want to try their juice the way they feel is best, just leave it as is.

 

[billherbst]

This is a great thread. I really hope vendors will read it and take some of these requests seriously.

As customers, we're not asking for the moon or the keys to the secret lab. All we want is the information necessary to help us feel moderately well-informed when making purchases.

Less hype. More info.

And for heaven's sake, please ditch all the cutesy but indecipherable little stories that pass as "descriptions" of juices but offer nothing about the flavors used in the recipe or the overall taste of the juice. That's not wry cleverness, it's bad business. If you're a vendor who can't write well or describe juice flavors adequately, find someone who can.

 

[Racehorse]

BTW, many of my thoughts in this topic are really just for custom mixers.

I fully realize some people can vape anything and are happy with a budget-priced juice, and that is fine. They may not have health problems/allergies. I think custom mixers are a niche group and it appears that they do a very good business, and can charge more, which many people don't mind paying.

MrMann, I just edited that post to add expiration date.

Yeah, all that has to be on the label. Samples might be too small, but anything 6ml it needs to be on there.

Last thing:

I'd like to know where the flavoring comes from (Lorann's etc.)

Is juice gluten-free? Do you use artificial sweetners? (many of us are allergic to these things just like some people are allergic to PG).


I dislike receiving cheapo plastic bottles with labels that are already starting to peel off when I recieve them, and are glue-sticky when I pick them up because of that. Or the colored ink starts to bleed onto my hand. (yes, I've received some like that already---there are printers, ink, and paper labels made for businesses, that don't bleed.......so stop using your teenager's home computer, you're in business now, right? Get a decent set up!)

LAST BUT NOT LEAST: a new customer spenda $50 or + with you. Send a little love/lagnniappe. Include a little sample of something. The ones that have are trying to make a good first impression....... and they did. This new customer might be one for life. and you get ONE chance to make the first impression.

 

[Mr.Mann]

This is a great thread. I really hope vendors will read it and take some of these requests seriously.

As customers, we're not asking for the moon or the keys to the secret lab. All we want is the information necessary to help us feel moderately well-informed when making purchases.

Less hype. More info.

And for heaven's sake, please ditch all the cutesy but indecipherable little stories that pass as "descriptions" of juices but offer nothing about the flavors used in the recipe or the overall taste of the juice. That's not wry cleverness, it's bad business. If you're a vendor who can't write well or describe juice flavors adequately, find someone who can.

Bill, I know you get probably 1,000 likes a day, but I had to give you another one.

To vendors: Billherbst has spoken!

 

[EleanorR]

I would looooove to see some upfront and forthcoming information on how long the vendor suggests each particular flavor should steep. I've seen some say a sort of general catch-all "let steep for 1 to 2 weeks" for an entire line, but each juice is different, and we all know it. Many vendors have started putting "born on" dates on the bottles, and this is a big step in the right direction. Why not take it one step further?

Can I get an "Amen"?

 

[Mr.Mann]

Can I get an "Amen"?

Amen, sister!

To vendors: if you suggest shaking and pg/vg ratios (or won't allow it due to flavor alteration), that tells me that you have a thought in your mind about how a juice should taste. Like Tez said (and Eleanor applauds), if you mixed the juice, when did the flavor sing? How long did it take for you to trust that it should be sold? I am only reiterating what Tez said, so you can stop reading this post now.

 

[happy harry]

MsMacgyver,

Have you tried Liberty Flights? They clearly show in their shop the VG and PG ranges, and split them nicely in to tobacco and other flavours. I use their UK site and they are great. Fantastic delivery and amazing flavours. On another note, they also have a really good loyalty programme and affiliate scheme. Go on give 'em a go, you can use this code for your first order and get 10% off if you want. lfec10. Good luck.

 

[iowajosh]

I would like more vendors to list the top six juices that repeat customers buy. That's really all I want to look at when I'm at their store.

 

[Mr.Mann]

To vendors: It would be nice if your websites all contained juice categories e.g. tobacco, fruit, adult drink, smoothie, tea, candy, mystery etc.

 

[ksmith]

PG/VG ratio is good to know, but I've had thinner 100%Vg's and some thicker blends. A viscosity rating might help people know how the juice will perform in their setup (easy test too): http://www.stanford.edu/group/cpima/education/EDKIT/other lessons/viscosity.pdf

Good point!!! Would rank on the top of the list of things I'd like to see.

 

[Darthvong]

This is a great thread. I really hope vendors will read it and take some of these requests seriously.

As customers, we're not asking for the moon or the keys to the secret lab. All we want is the information necessary to help us feel moderately well-informed when making purchases.

Less hype. More info.

And for heaven's sake, please ditch all the cutesy but indecipherable little stories that pass as "descriptions" of juices but offer nothing about the flavors used in the recipe or the overall taste of the juice. That's not wry cleverness, it's bad business. If you're a vendor who can't write well or describe juice flavors adequately, find someone who can.

Burgundy's Bliss: A tasty little juice with large plumes of vapor smelling of rich mahogany. This juice is a big deal with bits of real panther in it so you know it's good.

 

[bjannr]

There is one vendor that I will not order from again due to shipping. The juice was all in glass dropper bottles and my order was shipped in a manilla envelope. One bottle was completely snashed and of course had leaked through the packaging. I was offered a replacement with my next order, which will never happen. If you, read vendor, are shipping glass bottles please ship in a box, even if the customer does not choose priority shipping.

 

[candimccann]

I am on a vaping budget, and spending my weekly juice money on a "mystery" juice is a gamble. A description like this: "a delicious medley of fruits" or "a blend of blueberry and other fruits" just irritates me. Some vendors are worse offenders than others. One that I am thinking of repeatedly has descriptions like "another melange of delicious fruit", "another unique blend of fruits".

Think about a restaurant. They wouldn't say, "It's chicken and a bunch of other secret things we don't want to tell you." The menu gives you a good idea of what is in a dish. The server will give you more info if you ask. And if they aren't sure, they will ask the chef. Why? Because if you know what you are ordering you more likely to be pleased with your purchase.

Also, you avoid unhappy customers who ordered a juice because it said blueberry, the picture was of a blueberry, but SURPRISE it actually tastes like pineapple. Apparently, pineapple was one of the "other fruits".

If you are secure in the fact that your customer service, flavor sources, bases, and gourmet blends are top notch, you shouldn't be afraid to list a full flavor profile.

 

[lasttango]

My pet peeves:

If you are going to give pg/vg, menthol strength options or double flavor, please recommend what you think is most suited for the juice or at least what is most popular... I am uneasy about buying juices with these options because I don't want to make something that deviates too far away from what should be good.

If your create your own tobacco flavors through absolutes or extraction... please disclose... I have wasted too much money buying juices that contain flavourart tobacco flavorings that I no longer buy tobacco flavored juices until the vendor confirms how they make their tobacco flavor etc... I don't want your recipe... or even your flavor vendor... I just don't want to buy something I can easily make myself or thatI know I don't like.

Even though FA are high quality and popular with some consumers... I can't stand the flavourart tobacco flavorings - and I don't appreciate being told I am buying something unique and wonderful when it's less exciting than a bag of old ham sandwiches.

I know you want to put a good face on your product... but after vaping this long, I can identify where many of your flavors came from and I can anticipate what the juice may taste like and whether I'b be interested in it or not...

 

[digunderground]

I would love to be able to get larger bottles from some vendors. A few of the quality vendors I buy from only sell 30ml glass bottles as their largest. It drives me crazy having to buy 3 or 4 of the same flavor just so I can have enough to keep in rotation for a while. Plus, im sure the multiple bottles adds to their cost and my cost. It would be much more convient if we could buy 60 or 120 ml+ bottles from vendors.

This goes in line with many people commenting that vendors should do smaller or larger samples, i think larger bottles would make it a better experience for the customer and vendor alike.

I like all the comments regarding vendors being transparent about the sources of their liquids and whats in them, but not their secrets. I like ordering from vendors that are adamant that their juice is lab mixed and tested per batch. I like glass bottles so you know its not going to leech any plastic chemicals into the liquid. Most of us did this as a healthier alternative, vendors taking steps to validate the safety of their products gets my business.

 

[MaxUT]

I would looooove to see some upfront and forthcoming information on how long the vendor suggests each particular flavor should steep.

Good idea. Many new vapers don't know that a premium tobacco flavored juice could need significant steeping time before it reached its peak flavor. They might try and like a sample bottle of a particular juice that had been steeping, then find the taste lacking in the big fresh bottle they subsequently ordered.

Maybe something like this:

Born On: 8/5/12
Best After: 8/26/12
Expiration: 8/5/13

I would also like having the option of pre-steeped juices and could accept paying a bit higher price for them.

Speaking of information: too many vendors do not clearly display Quantity/Price info.
See Gourmet Vapor for a format that I think works well.

 

[skelley]

Gourmet Vapor layout is awesome.
I wish all vendors would list their nicotine provider!