Michigan No Smoking Ban and Fox News

[chrisl317]

I have for the past twenty minutes been searching the 'net to find the exact verbiage of the ban with absolutely no sucess. I've found articles, opinions and such, but cannot find the bill! My main reason is I don't trust politicians, or Fox news for that matter. The wife and I were watching the 10 o'clock news on channel 2 (Fox News) the other night. They were talking about the ban and showing video clips of people smoking both inside and outside. Then for about 2 seconds they showed someone's hand. In this hand was a visible half of a 510! Even my wife caught that one. I exclaimed, "Hey, that was an e-cig, a 510 at that!". My wife said, "Yea, I caught that too!" You could see the cart and atty sticking out from the person's hand. Mumbling and cursing under my breath about dirty tricks and presenting false information, it's still burns me that they tried to slip that by.

 

[Darmeen]

I have for the past twenty minutes been searching the 'net to find the exact verbiage of the ban with absolutely no sucess. I've found articles, opinions and such, but cannot find the bill! My main reason is I don't trust politicians, or Fox news for that matter. The wife and I were watching the 10 o'clock news on channel 2 (Fox News) the other night. They were talking about the ban and showing video clips of people smoking both inside and outside. Then for about 2 seconds they showed someone's hand. In this hand was a visible half of a 510! Even my wife caught that one. I exclaimed, "Hey, that was an e-cig, a 510 at that!". My wife said, "Yea, I caught that too!" You could see the cart and atty sticking out from the person's hand. Mumbling and cursing under my breath about dirty tricks and presenting false information, it's still burns me that they tried to slip that by.

I found this: [Title]

and this: Michigan Legislature - House Bill 4377 (2009)

 

[oldlady]

I am not a lawyer, but vaping does not seem to be included in the definition of "smoking" used in this bill.

 

[roxics]

Yeah my girlfriend saw it on Fox 2 and she said they banned e-cigs as well and I replied, no they didn't. She said "yes they did, they showed video of people with e-cigs on the news". I told her they must have messed up because I haven't read anything about e-cigs being banned along with smoking.

Maybe we should both write the channel a letter.

 

[chrisl317]

Yeah my girlfriend saw it on Fox 2 and she said they banned e-cigs as well and I replied, no they didn't. She said "yes they did, they showed video of people with e-cigs on the news". I told her they must have messed up because I haven't read anything about e-cigs being banned along with smoking.

Maybe we should both write the channel a letter.

Uh,oh! Now you owe her an apology kind of, and with Christmas coming, dude...

 

[chrisl317]

I am not a lawyer, but vaping does not seem to be included in the definition of "smoking" used in this bill.

Here is a vagueness I picked out, which might or could include nicotine, copied from the bill.

(P)​

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​

​

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(n) "Smoking" or "smoke" means the carrying by a person​

24 BURNING​

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​

​

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of a lighted cigar, cigarette, pipe, or ANY other lighted​

25 ​

​

​

​

​

smoking device MATTER OR SUBSTANCE THAT CONTAINS A TOBACCO PRODUCT.​

 

[Darmeen]

Here is a vagueness I picked out, which might or could include nicotine, copied from the bill.




(P)

(n) "Smoking" or "smoke" means the carrying by a person

​

​

24 BURNING ​

​

of a lighted cigar, cigarette, pipe, or ANY other lighted

​

​

25 ​

​

smoking device MATTER OR SUBSTANCE THAT CONTAINS A TOBACCO PRODUCT.
​

Well, a PV does not burn or combust the juice, and it is not lit like anything on that list. There may yet be hope for you.
​

 

[Paranoyed]

I know I will not be popular for this but I would rather see more instances of PVs being lumped in with tobacco so it furthers drives the point that it is not a medical device. I think we are doomed if it gets classified as a medical device, whereas if it is classified as tobacco we will just have to sacrifice comfort. I know this is a lesser of two evils attitude but that is the corner I feel we are in.

 

[535cheetah]

I know I will not be popular for this but I would rather see more instances of PVs being lumped in with tobacco so it furthers drives the point that it is not a medical device. I think we are doomed if it gets classified as a medical device, whereas if it is classified as tobacco we will just have to sacrifice comfort. I know this is a lesser of two evils attitude but that is the corner I feel we are in.

can you elaborate your opinion please?? if it were classified as a medical device, then you would still be able to vape anywhere, and not get the dirty looks from the general public, and parts and such would be readily available correct? as long as you didnt need a prescription for the e-cig it really wouldnt make a diff. ~ unless you have another theory?

ya that was my hand you saw on the news!!! ~ kidding

i have searched a while back on vaping in michigan, and any bills passed or waiting to be passed, also searched my .... off for jennifer granholm's point of view on the e-cig and turned up nuthin! nothing on her site,mich.gov site or any other i looked at.

at this point as far as vaping goes we are still in the clear i do believe..... besides michigan is top 3 poorest and worst state to live in for jobs right now = i think they have bigger and better things to worry about right now lol.
i have and am vaping pretty much everywhere... walmarts ect.. in public even in front of cops sittin at the local gas station/coffee shop and no one has said anything so far in terms of "you cant do that" type thing.

but im sure its only a matter of time before they follow suit as other states are trying to do!!

until then vape on fellow michiganders!!!!

 

[Paranoyed]

can you elaborate your opinion please?? if it were classified as a medical device, then you would still be able to vape anywhere, and not get the dirty looks from the general public, and parts and such would be readily available correct? as long as you didnt need a prescription for the e-cig it really wouldnt make a diff. ~ unless you have another theory?

ya that was my hand you saw on the news!!! ~ kidding

i have searched a while back on vaping in michigan, and any bills passed or waiting to be passed, also searched my .... off for jennifer granholm's point of view on the e-cig and turned up nuthin! nothing on her site,mich.gov site or any other i looked at.

at this point as far as vaping goes we are still in the clear i do believe..... besides michigan is top 3 poorest and worst state to live in for jobs right now = i think they have bigger and better things to worry about right now lol.
i have and am vaping pretty much everywhere... walmarts ect.. in public even in front of cops sittin at the local gas station/coffee shop and no one has said anything so far in terms of "you cant do that" type thing.

but im sure its only a matter of time before they follow suit as other states are trying to do!!

until then vape on fellow michiganders!!!!

My opinion is that if it is classified as a drug device then several things will happen.
1. It will have to be pulled off the market as it has not been tested and approved via current drug standards.
2. Someone will have to front the money to get all of the tests run.
3. It will have to go through the various phases of approval process.
Years from now vapers might be able to vape anywhere (no garauntee on the findings). What will vape while it is pulled. If it is regulated as a tobacco product then it will fall under current tobacco regulations and will still be available for use with minor inconveniences (i.e. no flavoring, high taxes, can not vape anywhere you can not smoke.)

That is my opinion. I might be wrong but I think if it classified as a medical device it will end the PV as we know it unless BT or BP decide to buy the patent and foot the research bill.

 

[535cheetah]

i dunno if while they tested it, it would be pulled from the "shelf" so to speak. any findings or proof that this would happen?? i think it would be as it is now, while we wait to hear if they are going to ban it or not or whatever, we are allowed to do it. also i dont believe testing would take that long at all. as far as footing the bill ~ testing the product since the FDA would take the reigns of control over this, they would be footing the bill for testing i would believe. other wise if someone else did tests on it... it would be like chevy company doing crashed tests on their on cars and trucks and giving themselves the best crash test awards lol. the test would be biast.

really i think it could go 50 50 if it went to medical device use, could go well or could be worse.
either way there will be pros and cons to both.

if its labled tobacco.. minor inconveniences like no juice flavors = thats a major inconvenience to alot of people ( i usually only vape mar-bro though) and no vaping in public/anywhere would really piss alot of people off too .. including me. it would make me feel like a analog smoker again lol.
as far as taxing goes ~ well of course uncle sam has to dip his greedy digits into it, which reallllly tics me off. thats prolly half the reason the are having fits about e-cigs right now... because they are not seeing any $$$ from it. the only thing i can see that they could tax would be the juice.. being it contains nicotine, if that happens ill be grownin my own tobacco plants making my own nic juice TOTALLY from scratch lol. just to screw uncle sam outa a few bucks

 

[Paranoyed]

i dunno if while they tested it, it would be pulled from the "shelf" so to speak. any findings or proof that this would happen?? i think it would be as it is now, while we wait to hear if they are going to ban it or not or whatever, we are allowed to do it. also i dont believe testing would take that long at all. as far as footing the bill ~ testing the product since the FDA would take the reigns of control over this, they would be footing the bill for testing i would believe. other wise if someone else did tests on it... it would be like chevy company doing crashed tests on their on cars and trucks and giving themselves the best crash test awards lol. the test would be biast.

really i think it could go 50 50 if it went to medical device use, could go well or could be worse.
either way there will be pros and cons to both.

if its labled tobacco.. minor inconveniences like no juice flavors = thats a major inconvenience to alot of people ( i usually only vape mar-bro though) and no vaping in public/anywhere would really piss alot of people off too .. including me. it would make me feel like a analog smoker again lol.
as far as taxing goes ~ well of course uncle sam has to dip his greedy digits into it, which reallllly tics me off. thats prolly half the reason the are having fits about e-cigs right now... because they are not seeing any $$$ from it. the only thing i can see that they could tax would be the juice.. being it contains nicotine, if that happens ill be grownin my own tobacco plants making my own nic juice TOTALLY from scratch lol. just to screw uncle sam outa a few bucks

The FDA does not foot the bill for testing the company has to pay an independant research lab. Also as the nuice contains a known narcotic (nic) I see the FDA requireing a ban on all e-cigs and juice at least until they can figure a way to tax it. If there is no valid way to tax it the e-cig will become the next marijuana. I think long term as much as I hate to say it the best chance for the industry is if BT buys it. There will be no more online vendors which would really suck but under the blanket protection of BT e-cigs would be able to survive. I know what you mean on the flavors but as long as we call it a smoking alternative they will say then why do you need it to taste different. I am angry that greed and corruption is winning over common sense and ethics as well.

 

[Antha]

I posted this in the Michigan Vapers forum:

State Legislature passes smoking ban -- from The Detroit News

Excerpts from the article:

"Michigan is poised to become the 38th state to ban smoking in public places in May, following passage of the prohibition by the House and Senate today. Gov. Jennifer Granholm has indicated she will sign the bill."

"The Michigan bill bans smoking in workplaces and bars and restaurants. It will take effect May 1, 2010."

Here is the link to the original article:

http://www.detnews.com/article/20091210/POLITICS02/912100463/State-Legislature-passes-smoking-ban

 

[535cheetah]

ill take a looksie antha, as far as testing FDA have already done their own testing on this .... hence their lab results, who footed the bill for the already done tests??

 

[chrisl317]

ill take a looksie antha, as far as testing FDA have already done their own testing on this .... hence their lab results, who footed the bill for the already done tests??

I believe it was ruyan. If you search the forum, there was a lengthy discussion about it, because they (FDA) found trace amounts of DEG in two samples out of 18 (I believe) tested. Also, if I'm not mistaken, I think the FDA has classified nicotine as a pesticide. Could be wrong though. Anyone want to clarify?

 

[MatrixXx]

I saw it too, didn't notice the 510.
Mich. Lawmakers Pass Smoking Ban; Casinos Exempt

No video =[

 

[cliff5550]

Seems we, at least temporarily, lucked out in Illinois. Our no-smoking legislation states the following:
"Smoke" or "smoking" means the carrying, smoking, burning,
inhaling, or exhaling of any kind of lighted pipe, cigar,
cigarette, hookah, weed, herbs, or any other lighted smoking
equipment."