My daughter's class was given this article in science class

[Anjaffm]

@Traver:

We have evidence and studies. Furthermore, we do not "believe" - we know.
Whereas the opponents have blathering of "we don't know".. and no intention of finding out
They prefer to resort to crying "for the children!" and to indoctrinating precisely these oh-so-precious children with their nonsense.

Well, if I had not learned to think for myself, I would now be forever afraid of eating pickles (thanks LDS714, I will gladly add that to my "scientific proof" about the "horrible addiction" caused by Oreo cookies)

Actually, I have no idea why you are defending that one-sided political propaganda "article".
And .. to be honest... I am not interested in finding out. Neither am I interested in discussing anything with anybody whose idea of "freedom of the press" is the "freedom" to spread lies, misinformation, FUD and propaganda.

Have a nice day.

 

[Traver]

This was an in-class assignment in which they needed to write a prompt summary of the assigned article. It is a state/federal common-core standard that every subject a student attends has an attached writing assignment. This is the first of such in this particular class but she did say she even has to fulfill this requirement in her band class. My child is an honor society student and very much concerned with her grades and how her teachers perceive her. I have to respect her wishes to not be singled out on this issue and address it just as a parent to teacher conversation.

Would your daughter be comfortable writing the required summery then adding something like this was an interesting article so I did a little more research and found they left some things out etc. etc. etc.?

The whole point of my posts was to find a way to respond to this in a manner that would be acceptable to to you, your daughter and her teacher.

 

[jpargana]

Look at this in another way. We look at this article and dismiss it because it misrepresents what we believe.
The other side looks at us in the same way. So what would you listen to from the other side?
What can we say that they would listen too? What can the OP say?

Sorry, but this is not about what we believe... it is about scientific truth and proper science... in a science class!

I may believe the Earth is flat... but my beliefs will not make it any flatter...

 

[Orb Skewer]

I think I'm seeing your point Traver, Lindens daughter could come out 'top of the class' by gathering evidence based on up to date science and presenting it to 'counter' some of the rubbish in the subject article.

 

[Susaz]

http: //articles.latimes.com/2013/sep/06/science/la-sci-e-cigarettes-20130906

My daughter's 7th grade SCIENCE class was given this article for a writing assignment (they had to write a synopsis).

My daughter, who is 12, knows these devices saved her mother from tobacco-related disease/death. She also knows more about them than the person who wrote this article because she is regularly listening to my rants LOL. Anyways, she was absolutely LIVID but too timid to cause a stink in class.

I will probably be highlighting and indexing all of the inaccuracies in this article, attaching relevant studies, and giving it back to the teacher with MY synopsis. It will probably be something along the lines of: "I would expect a SCIENCE class to utilize science-backed articles, not opinion pieces full of faulty information."

Anyways, we just got home and I had to share this with you all right away. I'm pretty irritated.

It reminds me to an old saying here "......... is the entry drug to harder drugs"... When will people get smart? The private actions of men that don't affect others are to be kept private. My body, my choice...

 

[Traver]

I think I'm seeing your point Traver, Lindens daughter could come out 'top of the class' by gathering evidence based on up to date science and presenting it to 'counter' some of the rubbish in the subject article.

Yes. Since the article was factually right as far as it goes I think she can do it.

 

[AgentAnia]

I think I'm seeing your point Traver, Lindens daughter could come out 'top of the class' by gathering evidence based on up to date science and presenting it to 'counter' some of the rubbish in the subject article.

In the best of all worlds, this would be the case. However, I suspect (by the mere fact that the teacher assigned *this* particular article), that there's ideological bias involved and that countering facts or discussion would not be welcome. From Linden's comments, I infer this is her daughter's belief...

Reaction to this is the family's judgment call, IMO, and the important thing for us is to support them however they decide to procede.

 

[Orb Skewer]

There is support here, of course, there are a lot of things we dont know re this situation, maybe Lindens daughters teacher is a vaper-it's possible ?

 

[Traver]

In the best of all worlds, this would be the case. However, I suspect (by the mere fact that the teacher assigned *this* particular article), that there's ideological bias involved and that countering facts or discussion would not be welcome. From Linden's comments, I infer this is her daughter's belief...

Reaction to this is the family's judgment call, IMO, and the important thing for us is to support them however they decide to procede.

You may be right or it may be the school and the teacher just doing what he has to. Perhaps with a response he will look at we can plant a seed of doubt in his mind. Maybe just the mother and daughter will feel better if she can say something and not get into trouble.

I'm also pretty sure that other parents and kids will be facing situations like this. So think about. How should they respond? Anger rarely works to convince people of anything.

Most of all I am hoping that the daughter can find ways to ask questions and respond to things like this.

 

[DC2]

If the OP is going to criticize this to the teacher or the school she should not say the article is wrong or inaccurate because they will not see it that way. To say it incomplete or that it is cherry picking the facts would get a better reception.

Good point.

What really disturbs about this is not the article but the fact that her daughter's teacher in a science class hasn't taught her to be comfortable with questioning something that she doesn't believe to be true. Regardless of my opinion or his this about article.

And another good point.

 

[DC2]

This is the worst kind of sophistry -- willful ignorance dressed up as conscientious altruism. A reporter doesn't get to claim that his story is accurate on the basis that only his sources lied. And anyone defending that reporter isn't morally superior to the rest of us.

Also a good point.

 

[DC2]

Politics are being sneaked into classrooms under the guise of teaching...

That has been a tried and true part of the political playbook since the caveman days.
That is why the governed must stay educated and aware.

Unfortunately the governed are rarely, if ever, educated and/or aware...
Which is exactly why this process works so well for those in power.

 

[Rabbit Chaser]

I read that article a while back and could only think the following:

What about enticing children to eat fat causing, diabetes provoking sugary cereals by putting colorful happy cartoon characters on the boxes? What about replacing sugar in sodas with man-made chemicals known to cause joint inflammation and soft tissue inflammation (hello...heart tissue is soft tissue). What about ignoring the war on childhood obesity by putting vending machines with cakes and candies in elementary schools? My nephew actually has a Burger King in his cafeteria! What about desensitizing children against violence by overlooking the countless video games that are based on very real appearing murder, reckless driving and showing commercials for said games during prime time hours? What about the fact that children of parents who smoke or friends who smoke are FAR more likely to smoke analogs than to go spend a couple of hundred dollars on gear and juice? What about "enticing" teens to drink by promoting flavored alcohol such as peach, chocolate, watermelon, raspberry, etc.? Has the media completely forgotten this generations wonderful role models such as Miley Cyrus, Britney Spears. Amanda Bynes? Oh, stop me now.

I could go on and on with what I see in our society that encourages kids to grow up faster than they used to, try things their parents would not have even considered at their age, but the fact is that vapes are the new kid on the block - efforts to squash childhood obesity and underage drinking have apparently failed so let's not talk about that in the news...let get something new and sensational, hype it up and create all kinds of drama.

One more rant and I am done. Media seems to do a lot more "parenting" than some parents these days and unfortunately history has shown that media blowout creates more curiosity than discouragement. If my kids teacher presented an article like that without discussing it with me first, I would question the boundaries between school and parenting my own child. Teach history, math, grammar, but keep unsupported myths out of the classroom.

 

[Vocalek]

This is from the article the class was asked to write about:

In addition, e-cigarettes are sold with cartridges that give them enticing flavors such as mint or chocolate, and health advocates fear they have the potential to turn teens on to regular cigarettes.

Can anyone explain the logic to me? If kids were enticed by mint or chocolate flavors, why would teens be attracted to regular cigarettes that a) don't come in mint or chocolate flavors, since flavors have been outlawed in regular cigarettes, and b) taste really horrible if you are used to pleasant tasting vapor?

Once I became accustomed to vapor that tasted better, the smoke tasted much worse than it did to me when I first began smoking and had nothing to compare it to.

 

[Vocalek]

Regarding the CDC's allegations, you might find these two analyses helpful:

CDC director misleads Medscape | Anti-THR Lies and related topics

CDC lies about kids using e-cigarettes | Anti-THR Lies and related topics

 

[rothenbj]

This is from the article the class was asked to write about:



Can anyone explain the logic to me? If kids were enticed by mint or chocolate flavors, why would teens be attracted to regular cigarettes that a) don't come in mint or chocolate flavors, since flavors have been outlawed in regular cigarettes, and b) taste really horrible if you are used to pleasant tasting vapor?

Once I became accustomed to vapor that tasted better, the smoke tasted much worse than it did to me when I first began smoking and had nothing to compare it to.

Awe Elaine, I felt the same way for the last 4 years, but a funny thing happened. I picked up some American Cigarette from Wholecigs that uses a naturally extracted tobacco flavor and their tobacco alkaloids and it gives a tobacco taste that I haven't found since quitting smoking and I like it.

I'm sure the flavor will wear off since I fall in love with a flavor, vape it for awhile and it ends up in my wine chiller for months until I have an urge to use it again. However, I'm amazed how much I missed a real cigarette type taste. That being said, I always liked cigarettes other than the coughing and the wheezing.

 

[LDS714]

Well, plenty of studies have been done, if not published, on butting heads with the beliefs of ignorant, crusading or indoctrination-minded teachers and professors.

Studies show it seldom works out well for the student.

This is the opportunity for you to take the lead in your child's education. Maybe have that talk about good intentions not always being a saving grace, and the diplomacy required to deal with said ignorant, crusading, indoctrination-minded teachers. It could mean the difference between a successful college career and frustration/being brainwashed.

 

[Grammie]

Glad this didn't happen to my girls (now, 35 and 33). I tended to be the only parent that actually went to school to get things figured out, fought for the kids, fought for the teachers. My father once told me a (a long long time ago) that once I got my education no one could take it away from me. So, from that I figured I'd better stay on top of my children's education. I ended up staying on top of my kids and the kids in their classes education too. It's a parent responsibility to make sure their children get a real education based on history, science, facts and truth.

That said, I've been known to make teachers cry. I've been known to go to the principals. I've been known to go to the school superintendent and to the state superintendent of schools. I never lost one discussion/fight at any level.

OP how best to go about this problem will be your choice. I think many here have provided exceptional ways to approach this problem. Please, keep us informed as to how this plays out.

 

[AgentAnia]

This is from the article the class was asked to write about:

In addition, e-cigarettes are sold with cartridges that give them enticing flavors such as mint or chocolate, and health advocates fear they have the potential to turn teens on to regular cigarettes.

Can anyone explain the logic to me? If kids were enticed by mint or chocolate flavors, why would teens be attracted to regular cigarettes that a) don't come in mint or chocolate flavors, since flavors have been outlawed in regular cigarettes, and b) taste really horrible if you are used to pleasant tasting vapor?....

No one can explain the logic, because there is no logic in that statement. It's anti-logic. But how many people reading that statement will pick up on the anti-logic? The only people who could even conceive of making that statement (let alone utter it) are people who have never smoked and/or never vaped and who have never bothered to talk to smokers or vapers on the subject. Do they even realize to what extent their ignorance is showing? I doubt it...

 

[Kent C]

This is from the article the class was asked to write about:

In addition, e-cigarettes are sold with cartridges that give them enticing flavors such as mint or chocolate, and health advocates fear they have the potential to turn teens on to regular cigarettes.

Can anyone explain the logic to me? If kids were enticed by mint or chocolate flavors, why would teens be attracted to regular cigarettes that a) don't come in mint or chocolate flavors, since flavors have been outlawed in regular cigarettes, and b) taste really horrible if you are used to pleasant tasting vapor?

There is nothing logical about it. All experience says that it's exactly the reverse - smoking to vaping - and not the other way around. Not that there hasn't been some recidivism, but many of those have come back more determined to quit. But it's 'anti-gateway' to smoking. Or it's the gate from smoking.

I haven't surfed the New Members forum in quite a while but most of my post count is from there or general as a vet with advice. One thing that was never tolerated even to the point of shunning from replying at all, was if someone who never smoked came on 'asking about ecigarettes'. This is something that will never be reported in any story, but it is part of the self-governing aspect of ECF. It's been important in teaching safety aspects and also in seriously stopping the type of behavior that the article suspects/purports as being 'rampant'.