My Plea
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You know, I don't come here much any more. There is a reason for that. It's interesting to see this thread.
If I were criticized for the way I post and how I interact, and I were intelligent, I would find a way to continue helping, but maybe in a slightly different way. I'd still be able to share my knowledge and not insult people in the process. It's interesting how someone can possess a good deal of useful knowledge but be unable to deliver it effectively. When we talk down to people they don't listen.
I think deciding, "I'm going to show them", and posting in a mocking version of happiness and joy, rainbows, unicorns & hello kitty, is the immature reaction of someone who's unwilling take criticism or suggestion & use it to their advantage. It may seem clever & funny, but really, it's just insulting.
I'll be the first to admit that I don't like criticism. If I get it from 1 person, they may just be unreasonable. If I get it from a number of people, I need to look at what I'm doing and why. I think those of you who have interacted with me here, know I'm fairly reasonable and that I like to have fun. I can get caught up in a heated discussion now & then as well. This forum ceased to be fun for me a while back. I stop by now & then and try to give a bit of info. to someone needing help, but that's about it these days. I hope things get back to being about helping, having fun and not smoking. I'll probably get lambasted for this post, because I dared to call the behavior of beloved old timers into question. I'm okay with that. I've said what I feel I needed to say. If you don't see me here, & want to, you can find me elsewhere.
JD
I hope things get back to being about helping, having fun and not smoking.
JD
Three cheers, brother. That's why I am here.
I haven't been blessed with the huge brain of some here, but I'm not sure why some choose to gloat that they have been blessed with something others haven't? We all have our paths.....
I don't think anyone was gloating..... ?
Everyone....let this thread disappear...per Mark's request.
*shrugs*
I'm another who isn't around here much at all anymore, because the atmosphere is just toxic at times.
But to me, it's not toxic because of 'Lynn, or because of reasonable people who disagree with or don't get along with each other. To be honest about my bias: 'Lynn is, truly, one of my best friends now. I personally rarely take a caustic approach on forums, but her horseplay doesn't bother me in the slightest. Nor does it bother me that say, jdvorr (who I also rather like--beaglebeagle!) doesn't care for her style.
It's a shame that Mark's been harassed over this and the time of the ECF admins and moderators is being eaten up by people wanting others personalities to be policed. It's just silly. This didn't even start over a true 'Lynn zinger, lol. *lovingly recalls being called smart as a bag of wet hair by 'Lynn* *laughs* *shakes head*
I too will stay out the line of fire here for a long while and contribute only occasional information and facts--I just wanted to say that y'all are making this so much more ridiculous than it's gotta be. Relax, ffs.
eta: er, by horseplay I meant unicornplay, of course.
I'm another who isn't around here much at all anymore, because the atmosphere is just toxic at times.
But to me, it's not toxic because of 'Lynn, or because of reasonable people who disagree with or don't get along with each other. To be honest about my bias: 'Lynn is, truly, one of my best friends now. I personally rarely take a caustic approach on forums, but her horseplay doesn't bother me in the slightest. Nor does it bother me that say, jdvorr (who I also rather like--beaglebeagle!) doesn't care for her style.
It's a shame that Mark's been harassed over this and the time of the ECF admins and moderators is being eaten up by people wanting others personalities to be policed. It's just silly. This didn't even start over a true 'Lynn zinger, lol. *lovingly recalls being called smart as a bag of wet hair by 'Lynn* *laughs* *shakes head*
I too will stay out the line of fire here for a long while and contribute only occasional information and facts--I just wanted to say that y'all are making this so much more ridiculous than it's gotta be. Relax, ffs.
eta: er, by horseplay I meant unicornplay, of course.
I think we all have to ask ourselves why we post here.
I guess perhaps I am defective, in that I fail to see the humor in some things...and I pride myself on having a warped sense of humor.
In that, I bid you well. I'll surely pop in from time to time, but enjoy the bed you make.
I guess perhaps I am defective, in that I fail to see the humor in some things...and I pride myself on having a warped sense of humor.
In that, I bid you well. I'll surely pop in from time to time, but enjoy the bed you make.
I guess I'm defective also. I fail to see humor in hurtful words or using words to make others feel silly, stupid or inadequate. It serves no purpose, IMO
To all the people who are posting that they will be leaving or not posting as often.....why "take your toys and go home"? Some whiners come in here and chase us all away? Will that help this forum? I spend a lot of time each day reading this forum, and feel I have come to know several of you. Please don't leave.
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Yeah Sally, I'm another one who is going on permanent hiatus. I had become disgusted with the way this forum has "devolved" into solving repetitive problems for a bunch of airhead children who can't seem to figure out where the welcome mat is or how to even conceive of using the forums's excellent search engine. I had already drifted away only to be drawn back by Lynn herself, who has singlehandedly (sorry for the big word airheads), talked me into coming back to participate. (BTW, she has been a thankless, unbiased, technically savvy resource to HUNDREDS of vapers in the last year, myself included.)
I took a couple weeks off due to personal commitments and to fish (hey JD, I was on the Chippewa Flowage the last week catching walleye), and come back to find you idiots had finally put Lynn and Darri over the edge.
The funny thing to me is how "insulting" you find their approach, yet they are only mimicking the BS that has consumed this once-fine board; if you are all insulted, now you know exactly how they feel.
In the end, it is up to Mark and Steve to decide what kind of board they want to have; either:
1. Have one of their in-house CS reps cut and past the same token response to all vapid mindless questions on a two week cycle - enjoy all your new customers (for a time)
2. Start responding to the air head vapers with direct links to previous threads or V4L wiki, or stickies
3. Or get some balls and chime in to support some of your most loyal and tech savvy supporters on this forum, to whom you owe some allegiance since they have diffused and prevented a great deal of negative press you could have received throughout the entire ECF forum network by HELPING others with MEANINGFUL and LEGITIMATE questions that are posted AFTER they have done their own due diligence in investigating their problem.
Mark and Steve, do you really want a forum that does the following:
Q: "How do I tie my shoe"
A: Pull both strings tight, then cross the left string over the right etc...
Q: OK, but now how do I tie my other shoe? Wow! I just noticed my shoe is blue! Should I change my name to Blue Rainbow Shoe! Also, someone was being mean to me, please ban them from the forum!
Have you ever caught yourself absolutely despising parents of horribly annoying children acting out in public places? This is what you have become, and Mark you said it yourself; "I don't want to babysit the forum". You are missing the point; do you want the forum to be a useful discussion among adults, or a preschool?
I used to love coming here and interacting with SO many people; now they have been driven away and replaced by a revolving door of vapid questions. As I stated in a previous post from May (#49 in http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/vapor4life/89889-clear-topic-headings-new-threads-please.html), many of the legacy members are gone; it's not hard to see why (here's a great homework assignment for some of the newbs; see if you can find my actual post). What bothers me the most is how V4L has thrown them under the bus, when they are quite possibly one of the biggest reasons V4L has become a storybook success.
Happy vaping to all, another one bites the dust. Don't be sad, or patronize me by saying "Good bye and good luck"; the sad part is, I no longer care to help V4L because they no longer care for me.
Addy, Darri, Thanks for standing up for the rest of us
Mary Kay, Keyzygirl, Jeffree, PawPaw, and Born, good luck; you will need it; I hope you all enjoy your new friends!
Sunshine, Rainbows, Koala Bears (Addy and Darri, you missed a key animal!), etc. BS, on and on.
I took a couple weeks off due to personal commitments and to fish (hey JD, I was on the Chippewa Flowage the last week catching walleye), and come back to find you idiots had finally put Lynn and Darri over the edge.
The funny thing to me is how "insulting" you find their approach, yet they are only mimicking the BS that has consumed this once-fine board; if you are all insulted, now you know exactly how they feel.
In the end, it is up to Mark and Steve to decide what kind of board they want to have; either:
1. Have one of their in-house CS reps cut and past the same token response to all vapid mindless questions on a two week cycle - enjoy all your new customers (for a time)
2. Start responding to the air head vapers with direct links to previous threads or V4L wiki, or stickies
3. Or get some balls and chime in to support some of your most loyal and tech savvy supporters on this forum, to whom you owe some allegiance since they have diffused and prevented a great deal of negative press you could have received throughout the entire ECF forum network by HELPING others with MEANINGFUL and LEGITIMATE questions that are posted AFTER they have done their own due diligence in investigating their problem.
Mark and Steve, do you really want a forum that does the following:
Q: "How do I tie my shoe"
A: Pull both strings tight, then cross the left string over the right etc...
Q: OK, but now how do I tie my other shoe? Wow! I just noticed my shoe is blue! Should I change my name to Blue Rainbow Shoe! Also, someone was being mean to me, please ban them from the forum!
Have you ever caught yourself absolutely despising parents of horribly annoying children acting out in public places? This is what you have become, and Mark you said it yourself; "I don't want to babysit the forum". You are missing the point; do you want the forum to be a useful discussion among adults, or a preschool?
I used to love coming here and interacting with SO many people; now they have been driven away and replaced by a revolving door of vapid questions. As I stated in a previous post from May (#49 in http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/vapor4life/89889-clear-topic-headings-new-threads-please.html), many of the legacy members are gone; it's not hard to see why (here's a great homework assignment for some of the newbs; see if you can find my actual post). What bothers me the most is how V4L has thrown them under the bus, when they are quite possibly one of the biggest reasons V4L has become a storybook success.
Happy vaping to all, another one bites the dust. Don't be sad, or patronize me by saying "Good bye and good luck"; the sad part is, I no longer care to help V4L because they no longer care for me.
Addy, Darri, Thanks for standing up for the rest of us
Mary Kay, Keyzygirl, Jeffree, PawPaw, and Born, good luck; you will need it; I hope you all enjoy your new friends!
Sunshine, Rainbows, Koala Bears (Addy and Darri, you missed a key animal!), etc. BS, on and on.
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I agree! As a newbie, but one who has been lurking for almost 2 months, I would be really sad to have some of the long-timers leave (ole-timers doesn't sound right to me!
)I feel so much hope now that I will finally get off analogs, and I also feel an incredible amount of gratitude for this forum and the folks who take the time to post here.
I'm not sure why it is so hard for some people to be civil about expressing their opinions, but from what I have seen on this forum, the folks here have enough grace and good sense to focus on what is really important about this forum.
And Born...if you 'dip (as my son would say), I will seriously shed a tear, 'cuz you are a real help on this forum, and your sense of humor and humanity is really wonderful.
Jam,
I'm not going to reply point by point, because I'm trying to enjoy my holiday weekend. And I was certainly not asking Darrigaz or Adrenalynn to leave, as they are both very important members of the community, and I consider them to be friends. But some of the things that were posted, crossed the line in my opinion. We've had new users asking lots of questions before you were here, and we'll have them after you are gone as well. And we encourage that. I would never discourage anyone to ask questions here, even if it has been discussed ad nauseam. I'm obviously sorry anyone feels like they have to leave over this. I just posted to try to get the forum back on track.
I'm not going to reply point by point, because I'm trying to enjoy my holiday weekend. And I was certainly not asking Darrigaz or Adrenalynn to leave, as they are both very important members of the community, and I consider them to be friends. But some of the things that were posted, crossed the line in my opinion. We've had new users asking lots of questions before you were here, and we'll have them after you are gone as well. And we encourage that. I would never discourage anyone to ask questions here, even if it has been discussed ad nauseam. I'm obviously sorry anyone feels like they have to leave over this. I just posted to try to get the forum back on track.
Back on what track? It is clear this is going a very different direction than when I joined at the beginning of Feb (when I converted to being a V4L disciple and standing up for your company many times on this and other forums, after suffering with another product line since 10/09 - also note that I had spent the entire months of Dec 09 and Jan 10 researching threads throughout the forums before I even dared to ask questions).
Hey Mark, it's your show, and I know you are in a tough spot. How to keep loyal good customers (like me for example) without alienating an inrush of newbs. A little advice for you to take or leave from a dreaded, evil scientist / nuclear physicist: Update your welcome information and stickies; Update and make visible links on your website for new users; Copy and paste / condense product user information into html pages for new users to access from both the V4L website and the subforum. This way, we the "unwanted no-longer-significant" customers won't have to dig to page 9 of the forum to catch up on a legitimate question we asked the day before.
Or, screw us and do whatever the hell you want; I am really past caring. FYI, I don't react like Lynn and Darri, I just fade away - and I speak for many others that are long gone. In closing, to quote Tim and Eric, "Great Job, Awesome Show!"
Hey Mark, it's your show, and I know you are in a tough spot. How to keep loyal good customers (like me for example) without alienating an inrush of newbs. A little advice for you to take or leave from a dreaded, evil scientist / nuclear physicist: Update your welcome information and stickies; Update and make visible links on your website for new users; Copy and paste / condense product user information into html pages for new users to access from both the V4L website and the subforum. This way, we the "unwanted no-longer-significant" customers won't have to dig to page 9 of the forum to catch up on a legitimate question we asked the day before.
Or, screw us and do whatever the hell you want; I am really past caring. FYI, I don't react like Lynn and Darri, I just fade away - and I speak for many others that are long gone. In closing, to quote Tim and Eric, "Great Job, Awesome Show!"
See the thing is, it's really not my show. I like to try to let the users and consumers of this forum dictate it's direction. The only time I'm forced to take action is when there are disruptions. That's really the way we've always run things here. Like I said, I would hate to lose you (or ANY of our veteran members). So if you do decide to leave, I am saddened by your decision, because you have contributed a lot here as well.
I'm gonna close this thread. Obviously everyone will not agree with me, but such is life.
I'm gonna close this thread. Obviously everyone will not agree with me, but such is life.
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