Yes, you was. As I understand from data circulating on this forum a vaper consumes only about 50% of nicotine.
From the other hand nicotine is mostly harmless, but it is completely different story.
My town is trying to add Ecigs to it's smoking ordanance, College Station Tx
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Yes, you was. As I understand from data circulating on this forum a vaper consumes only about 50% of nicotine.
From the other hand nicotine is mostly harmless, but it is completely different story.
alien Traveler" data-source="post: 14067497" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">alien Traveler said:
I'm not sure if you actually can't read, or just pretending. Try again please, this time, try to not quote half sentences out of context, and grasp the true interpretations of the research as a whole. Lest we start thinking you have an agenda contrary to public health.
Along with DrMA's links here's a few more:
Second Hand Vapor - Project:Vape
the study:
http://clearstream.flavourart.it/site/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/CSA_ItaEng.pdf
The amount of nicotine in second-hand vapor is "< 0.001**"
**below the instrument sensitivity to the 1000ths of mg/m3
alien Traveler" data-source="post: 14069213" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">alien Traveler said:
You seem to be quite good at ignoring inconvenient facts, so go right ahead.
I, however, will be keeping my eye on you and will make sure you don't continue to spread false claims or ignorant propaganda.
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If this turns any more ugly please close this tread, all I asked was for ya'll to go check out the link and comment if you had any good info, If you think I am wrong in my comment then say so,but without the attitude please.
I'm kind-of with you... expect for the fact that visible clouds of vapor, even if not as harmful as second-hand smoke, do create a level of annoyance to a lot of people. Even as a smoker, if I pay $10 to see a movie, I don't want some guy in front of me smoking or vaping and clouding up the place. Haze-filled restaurants and other indoor venues, I can completely understand following the no-smoking ordinances and laws. Sure, it's worth a discussion, but personally, I'm pretty sure it's reasonable to expect laws about indoor vaping to be nearly the same as indoor smoking (again, in places where there are lots of people). It's not just about health, but inconvenience and odor.
Now, if we're talking about more private indoor spaces like hotel rooms, sure! It should be discussed before anyone just blanket-bans vaping on the basis of "it look like smoking"... just like with outdoor venues.
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Unfortunately, the link leads only to an abstract. The abstract states, "We generated e-cigarette vapor from 3 various brands of e-cigarette using a smoking machine." A smoking machine does not replicate human lungs. I hate to make assumptions, but it appears likely that the vapor they measured contained higher levels of nicotine than the vapor exhaled by humans. In contrast, I've read a lab study which measured the levels of various substances in vapor exhaled by humans. I can't lay my hands on it at the moment, but perhaps someone here can. I believe the study found that the levels of nicotine in the exhaled vapor were either zero or trivial.
The study that shows zero level is in my link above. No need to 'assume' that smoking machines would show more nic. Were it not for the nic replacement that takes place in the lungs, most of us wouldn't vape. (minus the zero nic crowd).
Politicians aren't likely to draw the line where you'd like to see it drawn. Would it be OK with you if I allow people to vape in my office reception area? Annoyance, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. What annoys you in a restaurant may not annoy you in a dive bar. The possibility of annoying someone isn't a valid reason for passing blanket prohibitions of harmless activities on private property. Every venue is different. As long as an activity doesn't harm others, can't we let the property owner decide? For example, most restaurants and many convenience stores have somehow managed to ban sleeveless shirts without governmental assistance.
Yes, that's the one. Five vapers puffed on e-cigarettes for 5 hours in a closed room about the size of a single-car garage, with no ventilation.
"Results During the smoking session, 19 cigarettes were smoked, administering 11.4mg of nicotine
(according to cigarette pack information). During the e-CIG session, 1.6 ml of liquid was consumed, administering
17.6mg of nicotine. During the smoking session we found: TOC=6.66mg/m3, toluene=1.7 μg/m3,
xylene=0.2 μg/m3, CO=11 mg/m3, nicotine=34 μg/m3, acrolein=20 μg/ml and PAH=9.4 μg/m3. No glycerin,
propylene glycol and NOx were detected after the smoking session. During the e-CIG session we
found: TOC=0.73 mg/m3 and glycerin=72 μg/m3. No toluene, xylene, CO, NOx, nicotine, acrolein or
PAHs were detected on room air during the e-CIG session."
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1438463913001533
Does e-cigarette consumption cause passive vaping? - Schripp - 2012 - Indoor Air - Wiley Online Library
These works show that nicotine in present in exhaled vapor.
It should be so. Nicotine is dissolved in (aerosol) particles (droplets) of vapor. Some of these particles are sticking to lungs/mouth, but others are exhaled and are visible as a smoke or vapor. And these exhaled particles do contain nicotine. If a droplet contact lung surface, it will stick to it and provide nicotine for vaper. If it does not stick, it cannot provide nicotine, it cannot make magic.
Refusal to accept the truth is not punishable. Agitating for freedom of vaping by providing a public with false statement is extremely counterproductive and should be a subject to capital vaping punishment: abolishing from vaping from 2 days to 1 week.
Does e-cigarette consumption cause passive vaping? - Schripp - 2012 - Indoor Air - Wiley Online Library
These works show that nicotine in present in exhaled vapor.
It should be so. Nicotine is dissolved in (aerosol) particles (droplets) of vapor. Some of these particles are sticking to lungs/mouth, but others are exhaled and are visible as a smoke or vapor. And these exhaled particles do contain nicotine. If a droplet contact lung surface, it will stick to it and provide nicotine for vaper. If it does not stick, it cannot provide nicotine, it cannot make magic.
Refusal to accept the truth is not punishable. Agitating for freedom of vaping by providing a public with false statement is extremely counterproductive and should be a subject to capital vaping punishment: abolishing from vaping from 2 days to 1 week.
Burnstyn on the 'Schripp study' linked above, by A.Traveler - like in "fellow traveler"?? Although this is in relation to formaldehyde, it is the same junk science environment (immediately and priorly used by smokers) where the concentrations of nicotine were higher than other studies that focused on second hand vapor.
http://publichealth.drexel.edu/SiteData/docs/ms08/f90349264250e603/ms08.pdf
"Finding of an unusually high level of formaldehyde by Schripp et al.[4] – 0.5 ppm predicted vs. 15-minute TLV of 0.3 ppm (not given in Table 2) – is clearly attributable to endogenous production of formaldehyde by the volunteer smoker who was consuming e-cigarettes in the experimental chamber, since there was evidence of build-up of formaldehyde prior to vaping and liquids used in the experiments did not generate aerosol with detectable formaldehyde. This places generalizability of other findings from [4] in doubt, especially given that the only other study of exhaled air by vapers who were not current smokers reports much lower concentrations for the same compounds [6] (Table 2). It should be noted that the report by Romagna et al.[6] employed more robust methodology, using 5 volunteer vapers (no smokers) over an extended period of time. Except for benzene, acetic acid and isoprene, all calculated concentrations for detected VOC were much below 1% of TLV in exhaled air [6]. In summary, these results do not indicate that VOC generated by vaping are of concern by standards used in occupational hygiene."
And from NIH:
Comparison of the effects of e-cigarette vapor and cigarette smoke on indoor air quality.
McAuley TR1, Hopke PK, Zhao J, Babaian S.
Comparison of the effects of e-cigarette vapor... [Inhal Toxicol. 2012] - PubMed - NCBI
"CONCLUSIONS:
For all byproducts measured, electronic cigarettes produce very small exposures relative to tobacco cigarettes. The study indicates no apparent risk to human health from e-cigarette emissions based on the compounds analyzed."
http://publichealth.drexel.edu/SiteData/docs/ms08/f90349264250e603/ms08.pdf
"Finding of an unusually high level of formaldehyde by Schripp et al.[4] – 0.5 ppm predicted vs. 15-minute TLV of 0.3 ppm (not given in Table 2) – is clearly attributable to endogenous production of formaldehyde by the volunteer smoker who was consuming e-cigarettes in the experimental chamber, since there was evidence of build-up of formaldehyde prior to vaping and liquids used in the experiments did not generate aerosol with detectable formaldehyde. This places generalizability of other findings from [4] in doubt, especially given that the only other study of exhaled air by vapers who were not current smokers reports much lower concentrations for the same compounds [6] (Table 2). It should be noted that the report by Romagna et al.[6] employed more robust methodology, using 5 volunteer vapers (no smokers) over an extended period of time. Except for benzene, acetic acid and isoprene, all calculated concentrations for detected VOC were much below 1% of TLV in exhaled air [6]. In summary, these results do not indicate that VOC generated by vaping are of concern by standards used in occupational hygiene."
And from NIH:
Comparison of the effects of e-cigarette vapor and cigarette smoke on indoor air quality.
McAuley TR1, Hopke PK, Zhao J, Babaian S.
Comparison of the effects of e-cigarette vapor... [Inhal Toxicol. 2012] - PubMed - NCBI
"CONCLUSIONS:
For all byproducts measured, electronic cigarettes produce very small exposures relative to tobacco cigarettes. The study indicates no apparent risk to human health from e-cigarette emissions based on the compounds analyzed."
Do not even try to understand.
Study was funded by CASAA
Anyway, it was not about nicotine.
Are you denier of nicotine exhalation? Do you believe in everyday miracles?
I'm probably in the minority on this, but when it comes to state-mandated restrictions on legal behavior in private establishments, I think smoking and vaping should be treated the same, in that it's not government's business to restrict either one. If they want to ban it on public/government property, then they're perfectly within their rights in doing so. But I strenuously oppose any government policy that intrudes on the ability of business owners to run their businesses in the manner they see fit. It should be a proprietor's decision alone whether to allow smoking or vaping within their premises. If a customer doesn't wish to be around people who are smoking or vaping, they have every right not to patronize establishments that allow it.
...like in "fellow traveler"??
"Do not even try to understand."
"Are you denier...."
You just answered my question. Have a nice life.
"Do not even try to understand."
"Are you denier...."
You just answered my question. Have a nice life.
This is not worth arguing about. The levels of nicotine detected are so small they might as well be zero. The second study you linked detected 7/1,000 of a mg of nicotine in a cubic meter of air. An adult breathes about 0.1 cubic meters per hour. In order to inhale one mg of nicotine, a bystander would have to spend about 1,400 hours (58 days) in the room.
Educate yourself on the real scientific studies that have been conducted--go to the CASAA site. Visit with all the the council members and the Mayor. Have other vapors contact all the Council and Mayor. Be sure to have as many vapors as possible attend the first reading of the city ordinance and sign up to speak. You need to work fast and hopefully you have a supportive vape store (or hopefully more than one) that will encourage their customers to attend the meeting. Ask the Vape store if they will hold a meeting at the store and give each person that will attend the Council Meeting a different point to hit. Good Luck. I hope you have supportive vape stores in the area.
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