Well...I replied, but didn't mention ECF by name. Just said a large forum. Didn't want to lose the guy since it is getting late in the day...so couldn't wait for ECF to give official OK to be mentioned as a media outlet.
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I really think there should be some kind of organized ban among the members of this and other e-cig forum of the companies that are reported to sell e-cigs and related products to children. Kind of a self-regulation movement. Just because something isn't legally regulated, it doesn't mean it's right. Nicotine is not for kids. Period. The law might not yet say a minor can't buy an e-cig, but common sense does. Maybe we could start a thread where we list those vendors and kiosks that sell these products to kids and collectively stop using them ourselves. (Of course, the downside is we'd have to be 100% sure that sales to minors have occurred, as I would not want to disparage anyone's business because of hearsay.)
Thoughts? Would that be too extreme? Feel free to shoot me down if I'm being overzealous.
Thoughts? Would that be too extreme? Feel free to shoot me down if I'm being overzealous.
Well this is total BS....
I know it is against forum rules and etiquette to copy/paste an email from a third party...but I have to break it for this. His reply:
Well, WTF. This is the person that made the quoted statement! Why move me to someone else?!
I know it is against forum rules and etiquette to copy/paste an email from a third party...but I have to break it for this. His reply:
Well, WTF. This is the person that made the quoted statement! Why move me to someone else?!
Hmmm... RVT is a Registered Veterinary Technician. MPH is a Master of Public Health degree. What does one really have to do with the other?
Apparently this individual is qualified to speak only to the press but if you are not a member of the press you have to contact the Main Press Office.
Apparently this individual is qualified to speak only to the press but if you are not a member of the press you have to contact the Main Press Office.
Some side effects of quitting smoking: mouth ulcers, heartburn, coughing and sore throat
Some side effects of nicotine use: racing pulse, dizziness, slurred speech and ........
FDA doesn't need any reports or studies to scare the public, all it has to do is restate the obvious using tricky language.
Well, even though I failed to get very far, perhaps this person will be more careful in the future now that they know people will call them out on their words. It's what I meant earlier when I said we should get personal. You can't beat the FDA, but you can get to some of the people inside it, maybe. Try to target individuals instead of faceless organizations. Even professionals have Facebook accounts now and can be gotten to.
Quote from the article: "At the very least, it's not smart to intentionally inhale substances which have been proven to cause irreversible lung disease that has and can kill you." Huh? What? Hello? They could much more easily be talking about tobacco. Incredible. And this "for the children" bs thats become so common? I am so sick of it all. Adults do not matter in this country anymore, as to the so-called powers that be we are all nothing but children. Parental responsibility has also gone the way of the dodo, they will take care of our children for us someday. I stocked up on e-juice over a year and a half ago or so, expired or not I WILL keep it around and worst comes to worst, I WILL vape expired juice as I have no funds really to restock again. I will never let these kill-joy types make me have only the choice of "go back to smoking cigarettes or let us revel in your attempts to once again quit cold turkey and suffer". They see people enjoying themselves and hate them because they are genetically built to not experience any joy other than to control others and attempt to make people just like they are. These anti's get their o-gsms off nanny control. Really sad, but e-cig industry, in my personal opinion, is screwed, esp. with the new news about fda and such. All in good time, at this point, we will all be quit or smoking nasty excessively overtaxed cigarettes, neither is good. Sorry for the long post .
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What a load of crap. I'm sure teenagers are taking trains from Philly to DC with "tan envelopes" stuffed with cash to buy e-cigs.
Well this is total BS....
I know it is against forum rules and etiquette to copy/paste an email from a third party...but I have to break it for this. His reply:
Well, WTF. This is the person that made the quoted statement! Why move me to someone else?!
Want me to copy paste your FDA query and email it from my work address? I work for Village Voice Media. I'd have to clear it with my boss (HR rules), but we have 14 newspapers and a ton of online media. I think we qualify as "press".
No need to copy my message....but maybe if you were to send your own to the address asking similar points? Might get further than me. I already told them I am not media or press, so can't really send the same message. Fact is....I think we all know there is no study or report. The FDA is just cherry-picking. Thousands of people saying they quit smoking because of e-cigs is anecdotal and useless information to the FDA. But a few scattered reports of questionable side effects...and all of a sudden the FDA considers anecdotal information relevant. I just wanted to point that out to this spokesperson by asking for something I know he doesn't have...and demonstrate the double standard.
Maybe Mr. Schneider just has an 8th grader stalking habit. They turned down the candy he offered...but fell for the e-cigs apparently....
In another thread I posted an Email I sent to the reporter. His email is andrew.schneider@aolnews.com. I think we need to light up his inbox. Not in a hostile way as that just gives him more ammunition. But perhaps if enough people write him, it may force him to take another look and perhaps a more objective one at that.
And the good news is that the story has been lambasted by Tobacco Harm Reduction News & Opinions, and CASAA was mentioned!!
Worst e-cigarette article to date? And from a two time Pulitzer winner « Tobacco Harm Reduction: News & Opinions
Worst e-cigarette article to date? And from a two time Pulitzer winner « Tobacco Harm Reduction: News & Opinions
I wrote to the reporter on behalf of CASAA, inviting him to do a follow-up article that tells the other side of the story -- especially the disinformation campaigns regarding any product that can be used for Tobacco Harm Reduction.
I received a reply I posted this elsewhere in the forums, I will give him respect for at least responding:
Mr. Casey,
Thank you so much for the well-thought-out note.
I appreciate your position and would never suggest, you, nor I, nor anyone else start smoking again.
You and I will differ on how I approached the stories and I won't waste your time trying to debate the topic.
Just one point, if I may. For example, I did discuss that the Canadians had banned the devices. I never suggested FDA do the same.
Again, thanks
Andrew Schneider
I then replied back with this:
Mr. Schneider,
Thank you for your quick response to my email. My concern Mr. Schneider is the very one sided reporting that I am see regarding E-cigarettes. Again I am not going to tell you they are 100% safe, nor would I want my 13 year old daughter ever to use one. But if you actually talked to some E-cigarette users you would see that, what you saw was NOT the norm. I would like to see the FDA grilled a little more as to why they are so against these, with little proof of any harmful effects. The effects you mention are common to anyone who uses Nicotine and or Nicotine withdrawl. How can they pinpoint E-cigarette usage as the cause of these effects.
One more point, I will agree that you did not out right call for a ban per say however and I qoute"
"Health Canada had no more information than the FDA does on these products, but last year the Canadian agency ordered that "persons importing, advertising or selling electronic cigarette products in Canada must stop doing so immediately" because they "may pose health risks and have not been fully evaluated for safety, quality and efficacy" by the agency.
"The prohibition on these electronic cigarettes still stands," Health Canada spokesman Gary Scott Holub told AOL News this week.
If the Canadians could do it, why not U.S. regulators?"
If you were objectively reading that, wouldn't you think the person writing wanted a ban? Again I want to thank you for taking the time to reply. My hope is that you might take a second look at this industry and press the FDA a little more, so that all of us can have facts. As long as it is fair and objective I will take good or bad.
Sincerely
James T Casey Jr.
Mr. Casey,
Thank you so much for the well-thought-out note.
I appreciate your position and would never suggest, you, nor I, nor anyone else start smoking again.
You and I will differ on how I approached the stories and I won't waste your time trying to debate the topic.
Just one point, if I may. For example, I did discuss that the Canadians had banned the devices. I never suggested FDA do the same.
Again, thanks
Andrew Schneider
I then replied back with this:
Mr. Schneider,
Thank you for your quick response to my email. My concern Mr. Schneider is the very one sided reporting that I am see regarding E-cigarettes. Again I am not going to tell you they are 100% safe, nor would I want my 13 year old daughter ever to use one. But if you actually talked to some E-cigarette users you would see that, what you saw was NOT the norm. I would like to see the FDA grilled a little more as to why they are so against these, with little proof of any harmful effects. The effects you mention are common to anyone who uses Nicotine and or Nicotine withdrawl. How can they pinpoint E-cigarette usage as the cause of these effects.
One more point, I will agree that you did not out right call for a ban per say however and I qoute"
"Health Canada had no more information than the FDA does on these products, but last year the Canadian agency ordered that "persons importing, advertising or selling electronic cigarette products in Canada must stop doing so immediately" because they "may pose health risks and have not been fully evaluated for safety, quality and efficacy" by the agency.
"The prohibition on these electronic cigarettes still stands," Health Canada spokesman Gary Scott Holub told AOL News this week.
If the Canadians could do it, why not U.S. regulators?"
If you were objectively reading that, wouldn't you think the person writing wanted a ban? Again I want to thank you for taking the time to reply. My hope is that you might take a second look at this industry and press the FDA a little more, so that all of us can have facts. As long as it is fair and objective I will take good or bad.
Sincerely
James T Casey Jr.
You got more from Schneider than I got from Siobhan DeLancey....so congrats on that....
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