Newbie: Why don't we only talk about power (watts)?

[rshields]

I am a vaping newbie, but I am already interested in the variable voltage PVs out there. Even more, I am thinking I would like to make my own high voltage, or even better, variable voltage PV.

But while I am somewhat familiar with DC electricity, I think I am probably in the category of knowing just enough to be dangerous. But I am risk averse and will research a lot before actually building anything. To that end, I have a basic theory question. .

First, I see lots of options out there for voltages (3.3V, 3.7, and 5V, and VV) and atty resistance (I have seen anywhere from 1.5-3.0 ohms). As I understand the math, we can change volts, amps, and resistance and get varying final outputs. But the atty is the load and it seems to me that ultimately the only concern is how much power is being applied (watts) to the atty.

So we could say that vaping a given liquid is best at X watts. Then we would have several options to get the power (change the voltage and/or change the resistance).

But from all the conversations I have seen, the focus is not on the power. It seems to me this would ultimately be the only important number (even though there may be several other variables to tweak to get to that power).

So why is power not the end all be all of e-cig discussion (I assume I am missing something fundamental here)?

Why is that (I assume that I am missing something, maybe lots of somethings)?

 

[Scottitude]

Not really variable or adjustable but it's relative to your point so you might be interested in this:
10-11 watts on 5v GLV no matter what resistance carto.

 

[clavit]

I think you're right Rshields, watts should be the main focus.
Imeo (the GG-guy) has tried a couple of times to educate the masses, but it doesn't seem to stick. People seem to be stuck in their ways and firmly believe that more volts=more power. I guess the voltage is easier to understand.
For a DIY vv-device it's a lot easier to vary and display the voltage than dissipated power. Ebay can provide you with a $3 voltage display, whereas a power display will take a bit more fiddling.

 

[Lightgeoduck]

I think it is just easier to discuss in terms of voltages and ohms because that is the easiest thing for most people to measure with a multimeter. so if they see that x voltage with y ohms is 'the sweet spot' they are happy (the watts is still there even if it's unknown). The purists do talk about the power (discussions planted through out the forum) and the curious do soak it in.

Recently mods have been made to cater to the Watt-seekers, like the Darwin, which display the watts. Provape has a chart on their site for the provari, which provides the data for voltage amps and watts so the math-handicap can quickly check for the right combination.


LGD

 

[Java_Az]

I dont know watts is pretty dangerous. I drove threw there once when i lived in LA and almost got my car jacked while i was in it. But on the serious side watts are a factor but really all four are important. voltage, amps. resistance and power should all be talked about and used in mod making

 

[WillyB]

... People seem to be stuck in their ways and firmly believe that more volts=more power. I guess the voltage is easier to understand.

Unless Ohm's Law no longer applies, more volts most definitely = more Power (watts).

Power is the amount of current times the voltage level at a given point measured in wattage or watts.

But the atty is the load and it seems to me that ultimately the only concern is how much power is being applied (watts) to the atty.

Ultimately the only concern is what folks like. I don't need to figure the watts to know what I like.

And "power is being applied (watts) to the atty" makes no sense.

 

[Gummy Bear]

In theory perhaps we should be talking in watts but,,
We mix and match parts. a battery here, an atty there, so the atty manfs need to talk in oHms to separate their product form their competition's attys. and then the same juice at the same watts will taste different with an atty of the same manf but with a different oHms. I have tested CE2s of different oHms with my VV by setting them to the same watts yet they do taste different. It's all about taste and that is something different for each of us. You know the old saying " One man's trash is another man's treasure" So it would be imposable for a juice manf to rate their juice to be best if vaped at a given wattage.

 

[N2rock]

as mentioned above- the Darwin displays the wattage in big bold numbers, and in smaller numbers shows the volts, amps and ohms. With this method, you set the wattage to what you like, and then every atty you put on (regardless of the atty's ohm) will vape at the same watts. Much better method IMHO as once you set it to what you like, you don't have to tinker with it (if you don't want).

Right now I'm vaping at 7.0 watts, and my display shows that to be 4.5V, 1.6A, 2.8Ohm

 

[jufreese]

constant current power supply

 

[Gummy Bear]

Hey Rock, do you have a link to the Darwin? are they being sold to the gen public yet?

 

[Nomoreash]

Hey Rock, do you have a link to the Darwin? are they being sold to the gen public yet?

nhaler is carrying them

 

[ZoSo15]

Shoshin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Heh.

 

[N2rock]

Gummy Bear- as mentioned, nhaler sells them. Currently out of stock as they sold out the last round of them within a day. They expect to have more within a week. Best bet is to stalk the website and as soon as they are in stock, grab one. They don't last long.

 

[Gummy Bear]

Thanks,,,,,,,,

 

[rshields]

then the same juice at the same watts will taste different with an atty of the same manf but with a different oHms.

Okay, I think this is zeroing in on what I am confused about here (remember, I originally admited to knowing just enough to be dangerous). In this example, if you change the atty resistence then the volts must have been adjusted also to keep the watts constant. I would have guessed there would be no difference in the performance of the atty (i.e. how the juice tastes) in this case.

But if there is a difference under this example, then it implies to me that the really important factor then is not watts but amps. It seems from what I am reading that it is amps drawn by the atty that ultimately impacts juice flavor. Does this seem right, or am I still totally missing the point?

 

[Gummy Bear]

I have been saying for some time now that any change at all will have an effect on taste.
IE:voltage, oHms, Amps, diameter of the wire, diam of the coil winding, number of coil wraps and on and on. All of the changes could be made in such a way as to maintain a given wattage. I think that the change in taste is caused by changing the droplet size. Smaller droplet size = longer hang time before the vapor re-condenses. or like having a thick, heavy wet vapor (great throat hit but not so much vapor or hang time) or a light dry vapor. (not so much of a throat hit but you can exhale a ton of vapor)

 

[rshields]

I have been saying for some time now that any change at all will have an effect on taste.
IE:voltage, oHms, Amps, diameter of the wire, diam of the coil winding, number of coil wraps and on and on. All of the changes could be made in such a way as to maintain a given wattage. I think that the change in taste is caused by changing the droplet size. Smaller droplet size = longer hang time before the vapor re-condenses. or like having a thick, heavy wet vapor (great throat hit but not so much vapor or hang time) or a light dry vapor. (not so much of a throat hit but you can exhale a ton of vapor)

Hmmm, as newbie I certainly will not argue your opinion. But if you are right, it surely bugs my outlook on life where I like things to boil down to simple variables when at all possible. For example, when I buy a tank water heater, I can look at BTUs and have a simple point of comparison (of course various designs may provide x number of BTUs with varying efficiency, but it is mostly just BTUs that tell me how well it heats water). I was expecting that I could find that similar single variable by which to compare how a given atty will perform (and it would be okay to change the value of that specific variable for different juices, but it would still be a single variable that ultimately mattered).

Sigh! From what you are telling me it isn't that simple. Thank you for destroying my simplistic outlook on life.

 

[Gummy Bear]

Sorry,,,, here have a

 

[rshields]

Sorry,,,, here have a

Ahhh, much better now. Thank you.

 

[jufreese]

P=IV so if you have a constant current constant voltage power supply, it won't matter what atty you have hooked up, it will be the same power. As for taste, they probably all have different optimal power ratings.