So in theory...

[eHuman]

This Electrical curriculum: watts, ohms, volts, and amps
and this "Electricity" Misconceptions Spread By K-6 Textbooks cleared up my misconception of the role that wattage plays in all electrical circuits.

Current is not doing what I first thought it was, (I thought that current was the flow of energy that was doing all of the work in an electrical circuit. Current is a flow of electrical charge but does zero work by itself.
Joules (watts) are the flow of energy actually doing the work.

The way military electronics is taught, maintaining, troubleshooting and repairing advanced eletronic equipment is easy. I have found that they severely dumb down the physics behind why and how things actually work.

The two links above are just a sampling of the info that is available out there on the subject. Having a background in Navy "advanced electronics" made it an easy to read and understand theory.

The reason for the original discussion:
Using an LR atty and a single cell (18650 2400maH) battery for a small Variable Voltage seemed logical because the currents used in HV PVs could be duplicated.

This discussion has aided me in understanding the error in that thinking, even though said system would work better than a standard PV, (3.7v normal atty ~280-380mAh batt).

There are benefits to the higher voltage system that cannot be duplicated with a 3.7v unit.

 

[bigblue30]

eHuman,
Those two links are very good and should be a sticky. Thanks for putting "your" post back on track. Sorry if I was part of sidetracking it.

 

[eHuman]

BigBlue,

No need to appologise. You played are a part in convincing me that I may have indeed be missing something, and caused me to research a little deeper. Thanks to all for your points of view, correct or not they pushed me to the truth.

Buzz had it right (sort of) when he said just dial it till it's right. I want to build it the first time with the sweet spot in the middle of range not pegged on one end. Understanding how/what/why allows me to do it myself. If I'm copying someone else that becomes less important, until I run into a snag I that is.

I consider the whole thread a a necessary evolution of info, no real sidetracking at all. I understand the thought process behind the "Amperage is king" idea, I was there for years. Plenty of others may benefit from the thread especially when the error of their existing understanding is explained. With the way that I was taught, you didn't need to know alot about wattage other than "is it in the range that it should be?" I didn't need to understand the fine points in order to make an adjustment to dial in an engineered set-point.

There are many others out there that maintain the same faulty belief that I started with and with good reason. Electronics theory can be taught on different levels depending on the career application. A technician, an engineer, and a physicist have three differing levels of needs of understanding.

It's not until this unique but simple application that caused me to need to seek to understand the difference between what I accepted and what actually is. The journey is not needed in most cases. For me, to be able to spend time and thought on design removes most of the trial and error that must be gone through in order to end up with what you envisioned in the first place.

That being said. I will end up with a single cell VVV, they are small and have a nice coolness factor.

Now that HR attys are available in 5.2 ohms, I can see also building a 3 cell mod limiting the range from 7.7v-10.4v variable regulated, at 1.5 -2 amps and giving ab 11w - 21w adjustable range. Frankenstein's monster? Maybe, but we still do things just because we can. I can fit that in a 1" diameter "can/tube" under 3" long including recessed atty connector. Now if I can just justify buying six 3000maH batts (three for standby)...

Igor come here I need you!

 

[BuzzKill]

so far you guys have been talking in LINEAR terms I.E. linear regulators etc. , there have been huge advances in PWM buck/boost regulators that will work in our application . the same old EIR theory still applies but the application can now change dramatically .

Heat is what we are after , after all ??? weird sentence . and that comes down to POWER we have 2 fixed parts of the equation 1. the atty resistance 2. the battery voltage , we can control the system by either 1, changing the voltage or changing the current ( yes you can change the res. but that is not practical in this app. IMO )
there are current regulators and voltage regulators so either one will give you the desired effect ( some differences )

however a PWM regulator allows you to use a single fixed voltage source and it either BUCKS ( lowers ) or Boosts the voltage from a single voltage source like a 18650 etc.

there are hidden effects of atomizers also , I have found through testing that the resistance of the atomizer changes with the amount of juice that is on / near the coil and that it changes throughout the hit !! ( I used a voltage / current test bed to measure this ) weird BUT it happens .
I(n this case a current regulator might be better suited to the job ? it would track the current and vary the voltage .

My 2 cents

 

[duby]

so far you guys have been talking in LINEAR terms I.E. linear regulators etc.

I don't believe so. If it matters any BigBlue and I are both fans of switching variable voltage regs for both efficiency and performance reasons.
PWM's are also an option.

there are hidden effects of atomizers also

I am really interested in your test setup and what you used. This is an important point, but we need to rule out voltage sag and battery internal resistance.
Sadly batteries aren't perfect and don't provide a fixed voltage.

In this case a current regulator might be better suited to the job ? it would track the current and vary the voltage .

I'd have to give it more thought than I want to at the moment.
In either case (regulated current or voltage) we are going to suffer from the inconsistency of atomizer resistance and juice.
All this just comes back to the need for variable voltage (or current as you suggested) in order to get the perfect hit off the atomizer/juice of the day.

 

[BuzzKill]

I don't believe so. If it matters any BigBlue and I are both fans of switching variable voltage regs for both efficiency and performance reasons.
PWM's are also an option.
I ment switching regs , Linear regs are easier to design and setup and are cheaper in the design , the new switching regs are very good for the package size these days

I am really interested in your test setup and what you used. This is an important point, but we need to rule out voltage sag and battery internal resistance.
Sadly batteries aren't perfect and don't provide a fixed voltage.

I used a linear regulated voltage supply and a voltmeter and current meter to monitor the circuit under vaping loads with airflow and NO airflow , when there is airflow the resistance was much more stable

I'd have to give it more thought than I want to at the moment.
In either case (regulated current or voltage) we are going to suffer from the inconsistency of atomizer resistance and juice.
All this just comes back to the need for variable voltage (or current as you suggested) in order to get the perfect hit off the atomizer/juice of the day.

Cool !! In the case of regulated current it would account for resistance variations