NiMH batteries for vaping

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edyle

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This thread is for information about using NiMH batteries for vaping, as an alternative (not a replacement) for Lithium type batteries.

What batteries are available.
Examples of ways to use NiMH batteries for vaping.
How to mod common hardware to use NiMH batteries.
Using a kick with NiMH batts.

Cost effectiveness of using NiMH batteries.
 

edyle

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Description
Description
Upgrade your boring 3.7V without stacking batteries with these new Nickel Metal 4.8V batteries. This battery is the same size as a 18650 so it will fit any mod using a 18650 currently.
Sold as singles
mAh: 600
Approx Charge Time (hrs): 3 -5
These require a special charger 4.8 volt NiMH Battery Charger.


At $3 each, worth try;

Bottom line: an alternative does exist.
 

edyle

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So they are Four 1.2 Cells in Series. What amps can a Battery like this Provide? And do they Need to be Protected?

Yes they would be 4 1.2 volt stacked one on top the other.

It says 600 mAh; don't know the rated power; but using the 600 mAh as 600mA for 1 hour
that works out to be about
3 watts for 1 hour continous;
6 watts for half hour
12 watts for 15 minutes


there's an old thread from 2011 about them

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/216349-4-8v-18650-batts.html
 
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Burnie

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So they are Four 1.2 Cells in Series. What amps can a Battery like this Provide? And do they Need to be Protected?

No idea on amps, can't find that info anywhere, which is why I was asking. I run around 2 ohm coils +/- .3 ohms, depending on the coil, so not a high amp draw like sub-ohms.

As for protection, I could be wrong, but shouldn't the built in protection in the SVD work? I know I can't use protected batteries in it, I tried, won't fire.

Will it last as long as my INR 18650-20R, which are not protected, heck no, not even close. But around the house with extra batteries, no big deal.

Li-ion are not going away anytime soon, but I was just wondering if someone had Actually USED these and what type of performance they got from them. More out of curiosity, and I may order some and a charger just to play with and test out. But I was hoping to get input from others that had used them first.

Vape On
Burnie
:vapor:
 

edyle

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edyle

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4.8NI-MHbattery_LRG.jpg


4.8volt NiMH MOD Battery 600mah
1 Review(s)

$5.45 $4.91
Save: 10% off

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4.8volt NiMH Battery 600mah for 5 Volt Vaping. This battery is approximately the same size as a 18650 battery. Battery is typically used in our F-30 MOD, or similar 18650 size MODS (sold separately) for High Voltage Vaping. Not recommended for use with atomizers or cartomizers below 2.0 ohm resistance.

4.8volt NiMH MOD Battery 600mah : L Js E-Smokes, Electronic Cigarettes
 

Nikkel

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Just passing along a tip for a poorman's version of a variable voltage device that I read about though haven't tried.
Battery holders for 4xAAA and 4xAA NiMH batteries that produce 4x1.2=4.8 volts are popular with modders. They say you can remove one battery and replace it with a dummy battery, something like a piece of wood covered in aluminum foil, and the result will be 3x1.2=3.6 volts. Higher voltage for higher resistance atts and lower for lower.
 

Nikkel

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Of course, there are 3xAAA and 3xAA battery holders available.
A modular system:
One box containing a 510 connector, a pushbutton switch, and optionally a LED. This would essentially be an unregulated, batteryless passthrough.
This module could be attached/detached to a 5v USB adapter, or any kind of battery box.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-mods/290016-some-nimh-battery-configurations.html
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modding-forum/371357-cheap-vaping-low-cost-mod.html
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modding-forum/512235-long-term-results-low-cost-mod.html

The quickest, easiest way to NiMH vaping might be this:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-portable-usb-battery-packs-3.html#post137972
http://www.batteryspace.com/battery...ndbeltcliponoffpowerswitch-rohscompliant.aspx
https://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=22874846
A USB passthrough plugged into a 4xAA battery box which has a USB connector. The tape is optional. I call it the "nomod". No soldering, cutting, drilling, gluing, no modding.
The second easiest might be to cut the cord on a USB passthrough and splice on a 9 volt type connector.
https://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062219
Attach this to a 3or4AAA or 3or4AA box with the 9 volt snap connector.
https://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062239
 
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I 'liked' your post , then unliked it.

Nothing there I wanted to know.

I want to know what places have 18650 4.8V NiMH batteries

It's always wise to understand the limitations, abilities, and potential risks of any new technology you'll be using. The lack of doing so can be...unpleasant. Or worse.

I've only ever seen that one 4.8 V model and, frankly, I'm unimpressed by that particular battery. At 600 mAh it's of very limited capacity and Baditude already gave it a poor review for longevity.
 
Just passing along a tip for a poorman's version of a variable voltage device that I read about though haven't tried.
Battery holders for 4xAAA and 4xAA NiMH batteries that produce 4x1.2=4.8 volts are popular with modders. They say you can remove one battery and replace it with a dummy battery, something like a piece of wood covered in aluminum foil, and the result will be 3x1.2=3.6 volts. Higher voltage for higher resistance atts and lower for lower.

Just FYI, "dummy" AA and AAA batteries are available. They're shaped like a battery, but have copper wire inside.

Aluminum foil is...not a good idea when trying to carry significant amperage. The foil is very thin and, hence, has a relatively high resistance. At best, it's going to cause a voltage drop. At worst, it could (theoretically) melt if the contact point is too thin or if the foil rips.
 
Data sheet here shows curve for 3C discharge (3 x 2450 mAh = 7.4 amps)
http://ww2.duracell.com/media/en-US...eet/NA_DATASHEETS/DC1500 NiMh- 2450mAH-AA.pdf

Minor quibble: running NiMH under 1 volt per cell isn't recommended. Under load, I see why they're choosing 0.8 V as that's the load voltage, not the relaxed voltage. I don't have any particular objections running load voltage down even a bit lower than that, so long as relaxed voltage is 1 V or greater.

That's for the Duracell DC1500 battery (fairly high quality) only. Just like lithium, different manufacturers will have different curves--and projecting this onto a no-name cheap battery would be a bad idea.


I wish we had the discharge curve on that battery at 10C. Well, no matter, it should perform well in the 5A range. Please note it's a 2/3 A size, so kind of hefty in terms of diameter but by no means extremely large.


If that thread weren't ancient...

One word of warning. NiMH aren't protected batteries, but are protected in the sense that they have vents just like LiMn (but neither require protective circuitry). And they will vent hydrogen gas if you push them too far.

Hard short any commercial off-the-shelf battery and things will get very interesting.

Really, the only perfectly safe battery is...er, maybe zinc-air, and I still wouldn't swallow them. :) But output is so low it couldn't be used for vaping. In all cases, any battery from alkaline to lead-acid to NiCd to NiMH to lithium packs a punch--that's what they're built to do.

Warning two: Using a fifteen minute charger is a very quick way to encourage your battery to vent, reduce service life, and destroy a battery that should last years in a year or so. Fast chargers are fine, I use one myself, but fast in this case is 3-4 hours. Most of the time I just leave it on slow setting and let them charge in 5-6 hours. Most hyper-quick chargers don't top the cell very well either, so you never charge to full capacity (which, as with lithium, does no harm, but why give up capacity?)

Interesting note: Most batteries have no memory effect. Even NiCd, which gave rise to this fallacy, only has it under extremely specific circumstances and we only ever saw it in our satellite batteries. In the normal person world, NiCd's memory effect never comes into play.
 
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Ryedan

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I wish we had the discharge curve on that battery at 10C. Well, no matter, it should perform well in the 5A range. Please note it's a 2/3 A size, so kind of hefty in terms of diameter but by no means extremely large.

I Googled 2/3 A and found it measures 17mm dia x 28.5mm long. So two of them end to end are 57mm. A unprotected 18650 is 65mm long. So two MiMHs are 8mm shorter than the 18650 (0.315", or 5/16" for those who think in inch). No problem at all for a telescoping mech mod. Not much of an issue for a 18650 only mech mod with an appropriate spacer, or long spring installed.

5A at 2V (with some V drop) and a 0.4 ohm coil is 10 watts. I figure two 1600 mAh cells should give vape time roughly equivalent to a single 1050 mAh Li-ion cell at 10 watts, unless the discharge curve for the NiMHs is short at 5A. Morpheus, is this correct?

At $2 per cell, cost is in line with Li-ion and chargers are the same.

Very interesting.
 
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I Googled 2/3 A and found it measures 17mm dia x 28.5mm long. So two of them end to end are 57mm. A unprotected 18650 is 65mm long. So two MiMHs are 8mm shorter than the 18650 (0.315", or 5/16" for those who think in inch). No problem at all for a telescoping mech mod. Not much of an issue for a 18650 only mech mod with an appropriate spacer, or long spring installed.

5A at 2V (with some V drop) and a 0.4 ohm coil is 10 watts. I figure two 1600 mAh cells should give vape time roughly equivalent to a single 1050 mAh Li-ion cell at 10 watts, unless the discharge curve for the NiMHs is short at 5A. Morpheus, is this correct?

Correct. Plus sub-ohming that far isn't going to be an issue with NiMH. If the voltage drops, you'll notice it.

Towards the end of the charge life, battery voltage will drop further so I wouldn't expect a perfect vape through the entire range of the battery. That's liveable, and it's not going to be a vast issue.

About the only thing I'd do would be to wrap the batteries in a twist of paper towel or something to keep them from rattling due to their slightly small diameter. Rattling to me sounds cheap.

1,500 mAh is a bit trim in terms of capacity but it's not difficult to toss two extra batteries in a plastic holder and carry them along (like lithium or alkaline, never carry NiMH without protection and electrical isolation--damage or shorts aren't fun).
 
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