Noob build questions.

[jmarsala]

My first post! Ok here goes...

im old to vaping but new to rebuilding attys. I just recently purchased a Tobh V2 Atty and all the necessary tools to start building my own coils. The tutorial my friend gave me at our local shop here in Santa Rosa, CA. Used a 24g Kenthal 4-5 wraps on I believe 1/16 bit. It registered I believe around a .28 ohms. I noticed that it got way to hot to the point where after 3 seconds I would have to stop. I would get a semi pinned cloud (like super minimal) and The atty got very warm to the touch let alone I started to feel it in my lips lol. My question is what's a good guage size to work with where I can chase clouds but not have to worry about burning my lips. The Atlantis tank mod imho is perfect but I wanna stick with rdas for the taste and fun.

my question in is lower guage Kenthal like 24-26 better or higher guage like 28? What's the difference between the wires I know more surface area with lower guage but wouldn't higher guage heat quicker? Also should I build my coils closer to the posts and down lower? Lastly what's the difference between a bigger and smaller drill bit and would .4 to .5 ohms be better for what I wish to achieve?

I did purchase some A1 26g Kenthal and I have also just recently ordered 28g tripple twisted Kenthal as well.

Sorry for the noob questions and thank you guys.

 

[Das Auto]

First off what mod are you using? What are its capabilities and limits?

Use this calculator for wire building - Coil wrapping | Steam Engine | free vaping calculators very useful

Larger wires will be able to handle "more" heat than smaller wires (known as Heat Flux) but basically what that means is that if you have a 1 ohm coil of 24 ga and a 1 ohm coil of 26 ga, it will take longer for the 24 ga to get as hot as the 26 ga, BUT the 24 ga will be able to get Hotter than the 26 ga ( so basically you will be able to pull longer on the 24 ga than you would on the 26 ga) thus producing more Vapor. This is too try to simplify it (not too overly technical) and all the numbers above are for "examples sake".
And the lower the ohms the "Hotter" your atty & mod will get, that is natural. But if the battery itself starts to heat up - that's trouble.

 

[Thrasher]

Yes , the more wire the slower the actual response time in heating up, with same voltage and resistance applied. On my mechs single coil I usually dont go below 28g , dual coil 30g

 

[DingerCPA]

A 1/16" bit is pretty small. I use those for my Kanger PT heads with 30g kanthal.. I've been using 3/32 and 1/8 (mostly this) for my rebuildables (and typically 28g). I'm not going super-low - nothing less than 0.5ohm, but more like 0.8 or higher. Been playing with parallel and twisted wire....

Do make sure your battery can handle the build.

Vape on

 

[jmarsala]

Oops sorry I have two cartel mech mods and a nemesis clone. I also have efest batteries 18650 2500mah 35a (supposedly). I have 26 a1 kanthal and I believe 28 gauge twisted kanthal incoming. What size but would be comparable and ideal? And what wraps roughly for 26? I just want a nice not too hot or hit

 

[nyiddle]

Howdy, welcome to the ECF!

all the necessary tools to start building my own coils.

Does this include an ohm reader? If yer gonna start building, I highly suggest scooping up one (or even two, as some of them are known to go wonky).

The tutorial my friend gave me at our local shop here in Santa Rosa, CA. Used a 24g Kenthal 4-5 wraps on I believe 1/16 bit. It registered I believe around a .28 ohms. I noticed that it got way to hot to the point where after 3 seconds I would have to stop.

Yeah that's gonna be a pretty hot build by default. Additionally, you mentioned that you had a Tobh V2. Are you using a chuff cap/"deep throat" (I heard it the other day)/wide bore top cap? I've noticed with those, even .4 or .5 ohm builds are gonna be pretty harsh, you really gotta adjust to the heat. It helps to have a VW mod in this scenario, because you can avoid spit-back. This is all assuming you're using a wide bore top cap/chuff cap situation. Alternatively, is your drip tip metal? I have never had a metal drip tip that didn't get hot. I switched to delrin and never really looked back. There is some negativity with high temps and delrin, some possibilities of melting, but those are temperatures I'd never be getting the drip tip to (and neither should anyone really, lol).

The atty got very warm to the touch let alone I started to feel it in my lips lol.

The body of the atty is gonna always get pretty gosh-darn hot. Even my tanks, built at .7+ ohms, will get pretty damn hot if I'm putting it through its paces. Sometimes it'll surprise me when I put my mod back in my pocket how warm the atomizer part is. I'll feel it through my pants and for a second think, "I FORGOT TO LOCK IT" only to realize it's just residual warmth from a fresh vape sesh.

my question in is lower guage Kenthal like 24-26 better or higher guage like 28? What's the difference between the wires I know more surface area with lower guage but wouldn't higher guage heat quicker

I use primarily 24, 26, and 28 gauge. I'm not into crazy fancy clapton coils or anything (if you do that, you're gonna need a variety of different wires to try out -- but that's more complicated). I mostly build macro/micro coils. On my VW devices, I like to build huge surface area coils using 26 or 28 gauge. I usually wrap around a decent sized screwdriver (I actually am not sure how big it is, but I wanna guess 3/16th? maybe 1/16th?) and go for 9-14 wraps. Most people I know, building for mech mods, go for 4-6 wraps because 14 wraps on a mech mod -- given nominal voltage of a battery, that drop over time, minor voltage drop through the mod itself (potentially) -- will probably take a damn long time to heat up. Clocking 6V through a .6 ohm 14-wrap heats up like a beast, and is surprisingly on the "less hot" side.

That also, of course, depends on what kinda wire you're using. I prefer to deal with 24 or 26 gauge, thicker just seems easier to work with. They also tend to last longer (they're sort of easier to bend into place, they have less tensile strength? I don't actually know if that's the right term).

Also should I build my coils closer to the posts and down lower?

You want to line your coils up with the airflow holes as best you can. I recommend making it so that your coils are slightly above the airflow holes, but are still within view from the airflow holes. Or in simpler terms, when you put the top cap on, you should be able to see as many coils as possible. I find positioning them a TINY bit above the airflow holes makes sense, because the air should be going up in the end (to your face). I dunno. Seems to produce better clouds and, because better airflow, a cooler vape.

would .4 to .5 ohms be better for what I wish to achieve?

Simply put, yes. I found 6-wrap .4 ohm coils to be my favorite on mech mods (back when I used 'em). It was a nice warm vape, but still produced nice thick clouds if you gave it a tug. Additionally, it seemed a good resistance where it was sort of difficult to burn the cotton unless your wicks were absolute bone dry. Lower ohms than that, and I find you're forced to take 1-3 second pulls because the juice can't possibly reach the coils in enough time for it to vaporize; ultimately, you end up burning your wicks. Which is naarsty (and probably not good for you).

I did purchase some A1 26g Kenthal and I have also just recently ordered 28g tripple twisted Kenthal as well.

Ohm reader, for sure. Get one. Also, as Das Auto mentioned, Steam Engine is great for coil calculations. You can put in how many wraps you plan on doing, and with what type of Kanthal. You can figure out what kind of amperage you'll be drawing given a single coil vs. dual coil, and what kind of vape it'll be like (if I recall correctly, there's a little temperature indicator that'll say "cool" "warm" or "HOT") when you're calculating your builds.

Lastly:

I also have efest batteries 18650 2500mah 35a (supposedly)

Those are 20A LG HE2's. Baditude, a popular user here, covers it in one of his many extensive blog posts on batteries/battery safety. Definitely worth a read.

Anyway, welcome to the ECF, enjoy your stay (and this wall of text!)

 

[Foggyroomz]

I have built the Tobh V2 with every thing from 20 gauge to twisted 32 gauge the thing is a cuff top made a big difference on mine I run it on a Hades and on my Sigelei 150 here's my latest build at .12 ohms

 

[Susan~S]

Hello and welcome to the forum. Glad to have you here!

I highly recommend you spend some time with Baditude (one of our resident battery experts) and visit his blogs. You are now 100% in control of your own safety (and others around you). Make sure you purchase an ohm reader and a voltmeter or DMM so you can measure your builds, check for shorts and measure the remaining charge on your batteries.

Baditudes Blogs. The blogs that address battery safety, Ohm's Law, CDR (continuous discharge rating/Amps) and how they all work together are detailed below:

BATTERIES

Battery Basics for Mods: IMR or Protected ICR?
* Another essential read to understand which batteries are safe to use in mechanical and regulated mods. Includes a frequently updated list of recommended safe-chemistry, high-drain batteries with their specifications.

Purple Efest Batteries not as Advertised
* A cautionary blog that reveals that the purple Efest batteries may not have the specifications advertised. Also includes a commentary on "continuous discharge ratings" vs "pulse discharge ratings" of battery specs.

OHM'S LAW

Ohm's Law for Dummies (Vapers)
* My attempt at explaining Ohm's Law in layman terms and how it relates to vaping.

Explain it to the Dumb Noob: Ohm's Law Calculations
* As simple as it is to use, some people have a tough time grasping the concept. Warning: Includes graphic photos of mod explosions.

BATTERIES - WHERE TO BUY

Only buy batteries from a reputable supplier (not ebay or Amazon) as there are many counterfeit batteries being sold. Here are several reputable battery suppliers in the US.

* RTD Vapor
* Illumination Supply
* Lighthound
* Orbtronics

 

[Foggyroomz]

It is a hot vape for sure 4.2 volts is 147 watts on my mechanical mod. But positioning the coils in the front of the airflow and making sure the coil is wicked properly helps keep the coils from getting unbearably hot. Give me a couple minutes I'll post a video of it in action.

 

[nyiddle]

.12 ohms

I don't suggest OP attempt a build this low, considering he's already not a fan of the high heat from a low ohm build, and he'd be doing it on a mech mod with an 18650 battery with a 20A limit..

Just sayin'.

 

[v1k1ng1001]

I'd start building with 26g. I'd shoot for 2 coils at 1 ohm--collectively .5 ohms. Use a wider drill bit so you can stuff more cotton in the coil.

One of the keys here is getting your coils to work with your airflow. I try to get the coils right up next to the airflow, as close as possible.

Make sure you get a bunch of cotton in there and then plenty of juice.

 

[Foggyroomz]

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here's a demo of my v2 Tobh it will chase trust me.

 

[nyiddle]

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here's a demo of my v2 Tobh it will chase trust me.

Again, you're using a 26650 battery in this video, advising OP to build a .12 ohm coil isn't a good idea man. You're demanding a ton of amps out of your battery, amps which his 18650 just doesn't have. It's not advisable.

 

[Foggyroomz]

Here's a couple more pics of my build notice my coil doesn't have cotton directly under it this allows air to go around the entire coil and helps to cool it I place the air holes directly in front of the negative lead side of the coil so the air is coming directly at the coil .View attachment 420041View attachment 420042View attachment 420043

 

[Foggyroomz]

I'm not telling anyone to build at the level I did I'm showing that the atty he has when airflow is aligned properly and the wick is positioned a certain way will cloud chase very nicely I don't encourage anyone to build that low I am a consultant at a B&M store and tell everyone to stay at .25 and above for safety sake what I personally do is on me. I build for competitions and compete but I don't build lower than .25 for customers and that's only if they are on a regulated box that will accommodate such a build .30 is as low as I will build for a client on a mechanical. Just so we are clear that safety is always the first and foremost in my book. Thank you for showing concern but I would never have this gentleman build that low especially on a panzer 18650 mod

 

[nyiddle]

I'm not telling anyone to build at the level I did I'm showing that the atty he has when airflow is aligned properly and the wick is positioned a certain way will cloud chase very nicely I don't encourage anyone to build that low I am a consultant at a B&M store and tell everyone to stay at .25 and above for safety sake what I personally do is on me. I build for competitions and compete but I don't build lower than .25 for customers and that's only if they are on a regulated box that will accommodate such a build .30 is as low as I will build for a client on a mechanical. Just so we are clear that safety is always the first and foremost in my book. Thank you for showing concern but I would never have this gentleman build that low especially on a panzer 18650 mod

Just making sure that's clear, thanks.

 

[Foggyroomz]

I have seen a battery vent on a guy at a local competition it wasn't pretty by any means he was using a vamped 40 battery in an AR mech with a little boy built at 0.04 ohms I have to ask why anyone needs to be that low. My .12 is low enough why go below .1 is completely beyond me my build is 147 watts his was 441 watts and 105 a.mp load my build is a 35 amp load so yeah I don't encourage people to build lower than 0.25 solely to the fact that their are too many rewrappped cells and Sony vtc authentics are hard to come across. The VTC4'S and VTC5'S are 30A CDR and 150A pulse rated. The clones that I've come across are 15A CDR and 25A pulse this is a scary discovery when so many people have come to know the Sony 18650 cells as the king of subohm cells. So how many people will find out the unfortunate way that they have a clone cell Ora rewrappped trustfire thinking they had that 150A pulse rating and would be OK pulling a pulsed 105A load.


PS I suggest a Samsung 25r anymore as a good Subohm battery or a MNKE too many Sony fakes floating around.

 

[jmarsala]

Thanks for the love guys. I appreciate you all getting back to me. Something's to consider and a lot to learn.