Obama Receiving an E-Cig For Valentines Day
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The easiest way to squash the freedom of a people is to do it in tiny steps. Who'd have though talking on a cell phone while driving would become illegal in many areas? Who'd have thought smoking analogs (regular cigarettes) in your own home would become illegal in that city in California? (i forget the name of the city) Who'd have thought they'd ban carrying nail clippers onto airplanes? The list goes on and on.
Never ever trust your govt. And, as Benjamin Franklin said, "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Never ever trust your govt. And, as Benjamin Franklin said, "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."
Good ol' Ben... sucked on a few tampons back in his prime too, if I remember my history correctly.
Good ol' Ben... sucked on a few tampons back in his prime too, if I remember my history correctly.
Good ol Ben--may he rest in vapor land-----Sun
@Skull. The point I am trying to make is this BP and BT and BB already know about the electronic cigarette, if BB wanted to ban this device they would have done so already long before it becomes a problem or maybe I am wrong, personal I think they have much bigger fish to fry.
I hear many arguments on this forum as to why BT or BP want us out of the big picture, I for one do not believe that is the case entirely, lets just back track here we use nicotine, nicotine comes from tobacco,
tobacco plantations are owned by you guessed it Big Tobacco, they maybe selling less cigarettes but now they selling more tobacco.
I am only one of possibly two or more supplies in South Africa that is selling the e-cig, I can also tell you that out of every 10 people that buy the e-cig 3 to 4 people will continue to us the device and most of those 3-4 people will return to the real thing after 4 -6 months, people do not always have what it takes to keep batteries charged and make sure they have a spare atomizer or enough juice, lets be honest e-cigs are work.
Yes e-cigs are getting popular, and yes they are selling well, but to most users it's a slight reprieve form the real thing, you just know the real thing is always just a hope skip away, the day you atomizer dies and you do not have a backup.
Another thing, there is nothing in this world that can make you quit smoking, I am afraid thatt is something you will need to do all by yourself.
I hear many arguments on this forum as to why BT or BP want us out of the big picture, I for one do not believe that is the case entirely, lets just back track here we use nicotine, nicotine comes from tobacco,
tobacco plantations are owned by you guessed it Big Tobacco, they maybe selling less cigarettes but now they selling more tobacco.
I am only one of possibly two or more supplies in South Africa that is selling the e-cig, I can also tell you that out of every 10 people that buy the e-cig 3 to 4 people will continue to us the device and most of those 3-4 people will return to the real thing after 4 -6 months, people do not always have what it takes to keep batteries charged and make sure they have a spare atomizer or enough juice, lets be honest e-cigs are work.
Yes e-cigs are getting popular, and yes they are selling well, but to most users it's a slight reprieve form the real thing, you just know the real thing is always just a hope skip away, the day you atomizer dies and you do not have a backup.
Another thing, there is nothing in this world that can make you quit smoking, I am afraid thatt is something you will need to do all by yourself.
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I'm not so sure about that, I believe the duty on tobacco raises something like £8bn p/a and then on top of that there's the VAT, the tax on the profits of the retailers and the tax on the profits of the manufacturers (IIRC, 2 out of the 5 big tobacco companies are British).
Let's call it £10bn all in which is about 2% of the total tax take of the UK government. This is a very large amount of money to raise quietly. 2% onto income tax is a political non-starter. Perhaps when VAT goes back to 17.5%, they'll just stick it right up to 20% (closer to the EU average). That would go some way to recovering the tax.
Then we have the fact that smokers tend to die early but after retirement (the probability of dying from smoking under the age of 35 by-the-way is zero and the probability of dying from smoking under the age of 50 is still very low). If e-cigs take off, the government's actuaries will be having a fit about adjusting for longer life expectancy and how to pay for all these cumulative years' pension liabilities (on top of the existing liabilities which are underfunded to start with).
The places to watch are countries that do not rely on tobacco tax revenue because these are the countries that have nothing or not much to lose.
You only need to check the Whitehouse website to find that they do not accept unsolicited gifts without prior arrangement and that is extremely difficult to obtain. Even writing a letter will only get you a polite reply if you are lucky. Anyways, he likes his EVO too much to be bothered with impersonators. Oh damn! There goes the confidentially agreement!
Cheers.
John.
Cheers.
John.
The UK government does take in a little over £8bn in tobacco taxes per year according to ASH. But they also say that smoking costs the NHS £1.5bn, so they're only making £6.5bn.
Smoking also costs the government money in other areas (anti-smoking campaigns in the media, sick days off work), but before you come to that, there are 60,975,000 people in the UK. If every single smoker quit using tobacco, they'd only need to raise everyone's annual taxes by £106.60 per person. But that's certainly not going to happen, at least not any time soon. Of the 10 smokers I know, see regularly and have shown my e-cig to only 2 have expressed a real interest in possibly acquiring one. So if we imagine that one third of all British smokers switch, the government only loses a third of that 6.5bn. That brings everyone's increased annual taxes to £71 to make up for the loss. And it won't even need to be that high, because they will be free to raise tobacco taxes on people who don't switch (and are even less likely to quit). £71 per person per year is easily done just by spreading it around (booze, road tax, income tax, VAT, petrol, estate tax, etc).
The VAT on cigarettes isn't lost because people will be taking the money they spent on smoking and buying other VAT-applicable things with it. The tax income from the tobacco companies is not so much an issue because they are global companies making the lion's share of their profits outside the UK. And their lost revenue means other companies where former smokers spend their money will see their incomes (and tax-bills) rise. The government will get that same money, but from different sources.
UK politicians do a lot of stupid things for stupid reasons, but they're not conspiring to keep people hooked on cigarettes just for the money. If they were, they would have left in an exception to the smoking ban for pubs and nightclubs--where people used to do most of their smoking. As it stands now, smokers are almost certainly smoking less than before, and the government is losing alcohol-tax (and income tax and VAT) from the ban-related loss of business that pubs are experiencing. (And they wouldn't make Zyban and other stop-smoking therapies available on the NHS.)
Smoking also costs the government money in other areas (anti-smoking campaigns in the media, sick days off work), but before you come to that, there are 60,975,000 people in the UK. If every single smoker quit using tobacco, they'd only need to raise everyone's annual taxes by £106.60 per person. But that's certainly not going to happen, at least not any time soon. Of the 10 smokers I know, see regularly and have shown my e-cig to only 2 have expressed a real interest in possibly acquiring one. So if we imagine that one third of all British smokers switch, the government only loses a third of that 6.5bn. That brings everyone's increased annual taxes to £71 to make up for the loss. And it won't even need to be that high, because they will be free to raise tobacco taxes on people who don't switch (and are even less likely to quit). £71 per person per year is easily done just by spreading it around (booze, road tax, income tax, VAT, petrol, estate tax, etc).
The VAT on cigarettes isn't lost because people will be taking the money they spent on smoking and buying other VAT-applicable things with it. The tax income from the tobacco companies is not so much an issue because they are global companies making the lion's share of their profits outside the UK. And their lost revenue means other companies where former smokers spend their money will see their incomes (and tax-bills) rise. The government will get that same money, but from different sources.
UK politicians do a lot of stupid things for stupid reasons, but they're not conspiring to keep people hooked on cigarettes just for the money. If they were, they would have left in an exception to the smoking ban for pubs and nightclubs--where people used to do most of their smoking. As it stands now, smokers are almost certainly smoking less than before, and the government is losing alcohol-tax (and income tax and VAT) from the ban-related loss of business that pubs are experiencing. (And they wouldn't make Zyban and other stop-smoking therapies available on the NHS.)
I just saw this on wiki
just thought it was interesting how clearly they point out e-cigs ..when talking about the nicotine inhaler
" A nicotine inhaler allows cigarette smokers to get nicotine without using tobacco, much like nicotine gum or a nicotine patch. Nicotine inhalers that are marketed as nicotine replacement therapy should not be confused with electronic cigarettes, which produce vapor and which are marketed mainly as devices that smokers can use in nonsmoking areas"
Metered-dose inhaler - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
just thought it was interesting how clearly they point out e-cigs ..when talking about the nicotine inhaler
" A nicotine inhaler allows cigarette smokers to get nicotine without using tobacco, much like nicotine gum or a nicotine patch. Nicotine inhalers that are marketed as nicotine replacement therapy should not be confused with electronic cigarettes, which produce vapor and which are marketed mainly as devices that smokers can use in nonsmoking areas"
Metered-dose inhaler - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Misty -- Great find. Glad to see correct information about our devices being posted as they clearly state "[n]ot to be confused with" Id. Thanks for the research--Sun
@stephenrowley
Yes, you made some good points. I think the best point of all was about your atomizer dying and being a hop skip and jump away from going back to tobacco. I shouldn't be that close to tobacco! I should be a hop skip and jump away from a new atomizer! I should be able to go to Wal-Mart, the drugstore, even a gas station for an atomizer, juice or even a brand new starter kit. Also, I don't want to stop vaping. Yes I'm addicted to nicotine, but I also get pleasure from smoking/vaping!
We're getting off subject, as this was originally about the uncaring distributors. But it has definitely given me a lot of thought.
This is kind of like the gun control debate here in America. I don't own guns, I don't hunt. But if you do, and enjoy it, that is your right. I enjoyed target practicing, the bigger the gun the better! But I don't own any, and rarely go out with my buddy shooting. But if others want to, that is their right!
Well, I probably overstated and overextended my welcome. Thanks all!
Yes, you made some good points. I think the best point of all was about your atomizer dying and being a hop skip and jump away from going back to tobacco. I shouldn't be that close to tobacco! I should be a hop skip and jump away from a new atomizer! I should be able to go to Wal-Mart, the drugstore, even a gas station for an atomizer, juice or even a brand new starter kit. Also, I don't want to stop vaping. Yes I'm addicted to nicotine, but I also get pleasure from smoking/vaping!
We're getting off subject, as this was originally about the uncaring distributors. But it has definitely given me a lot of thought.
This is kind of like the gun control debate here in America. I don't own guns, I don't hunt. But if you do, and enjoy it, that is your right. I enjoyed target practicing, the bigger the gun the better! But I don't own any, and rarely go out with my buddy shooting. But if others want to, that is their right!
Well, I probably overstated and overextended my welcome. Thanks all!
Have you already tried e-cigarettes? Pros and cons
February 16, 2009 - 2:51pm | author: ayny | Articles | Other themes
Have you already tried e-cigarettes? Pros and cons
Sometimes very conventional things obtain quite unusual shapes. Usually they turn to better however sometimes that “better” is very questionable. Today when almost all the developed countries ban smoking in public places, e-cigarettes, a modern analog of the conventional cigarettes becomes more and more popular.
Electronic cigarettes have been invented by Chinese scientist Hon Lik. The first cigarettes of the new generation have come into the market in May 2004 and became very popular at once. According to Ruyan, a Beijing based company where Hon works; only in 2008 the company has sold nearly 300 thousand e-cigarettes.
So, what is it that e-cigarette? The definition of this item is as follows: an alternative to smoked tobacco products, such as cigarettes, cigars, or pipes. It is a battery-powered device that provides inhaled doses of nicotine by delivering a vaporized propylene glycol/nicotine solution. In addition to nicotine delivery, this vapor also provides a flavor and physical sensation similar to that of inhaled tobacco smoke, while no tobacco, smoke, or combustion is actually involved in its operation.
Actually e-cigarettes are similar in appearance with ordinary cigarettes. However instead of tobacco it contains a battery and an LED. Besides battery and LED the so-called cigarette also contains an atomizer and a cartridge. The principle of operation of such e-cigarette is pretty simple: when a user inhales through the device, air flow is detected by a sensor, which activates a heating element that vaporizes a nicotine solution stored in the mouthpiece, called cartridge. It is this vapor that is inhaled by the user. An LED on the opposite end of the device is also activated during inhalation, which serves as an indicator of use, and also to simulate the glow of actual burning tobacco. There are several types of cartridges: high, medium, low and zero-nicotine strength. According to New Scientist magazine the strongest cartridge contains about the same amount of nicotine as a regular-strength cigarette, but lasts for about 300 puffs in comparison with a regular cigarette that lasts for about 15. The average price for such cartridge is $1.50. Each cartridge contains material that is moistened with a flavored propylene glycol/nicotine liquid solution. When the liquid in the cartridge has been depleted, it can either be refilled by the user, or replaced with another pre-filled cartridge.
According to Murray Laugesen, a scientist from New Zealand who currently studies the impact of e-cigarettes to human health even the strongest cartridge only delivers around one-third the amount of nicotine delivered by a puff on a normal cigarette.
Actually the e-cigarettes were marketed as a smoking quit solution. There were lots of various studies which showed that e-cigarettes are less harmless than the ordinary cigarettes since they do not contain tobacco and tar, and hence are not harmful for the so-called passive smokers. However, being sold as a treatment for the smoking nicotine people e-cigarettes do not solve the main problem - addiction. Today there is great variety of drugs, including plasters and pills that help people to quit smoking. E-cigarettes imitating the smoking are said to be less philologically harmful for those who decided to put an end to pernicious habit, however the whole process of smoking that cigarettes is so similar to the conventional one that the final result becomes very doubtful. And if considering e-cigarettes as a move to make smoking safer here there are some nuances as well. According to the smokers e-cigarettes can not be compared to the ordinary ones since smoking is not just a process bringing the dose of nicotine to the organism. Smoking the smokers get the odor and taste that are a part of that habit as well, hence e-cigarettes are not a good alternative for the ordinary things.
Besides there is not exact legislation regarding those e-cigarettes. In September 2008, the World Health Organization issued a release proclaiming that it does not consider the electronic cigarette to be a legitimate smoking cessation aid, stating that to its knowledge, "no rigorous, peer-reviewed studies have been conducted showing that the electronic cigarette is a safe and effective nicotine replacement therapy."
Some countries are still hesitating about approving those e-cigarettes. The reason of this is absence of a clear examination and survey before the manufacturing of those devices. So, according to open sources:
• In Australia, the sale of electronic cigarettes containing nicotine is illegal.
• In Austria and Denmark, electronic cigarettes are considered medical devices, and nicotine cartridges medicinal products. Therefore electronic cigarettes need to be CE-marked, and nicotine cartridges registered as medicinal products, before either can be legally sold.
• In Finland, cartridges containing nicotine are illegal to sell, or to purchase with intent to sell, but are not illegal to purchase from overseas sources for personal use only.
• In The Netherlands, use of electronic cigarettes is allowed, but advertising is forbidden pending European Union legislation.
• In New Zealand, the Ministry of Health has ruled that cartridges containing nicotine fall under the requirements of the Medicines Act, and cannot be sold except as a registered medicine.
• In the United Kingdom, electronic cigarette use is currently unrestricted, with celebrity nightclub Chinawhite allowing use of the devices indoors, where traditional cigarette smoking is prohibited.
• In the United States, electronic cigarettes are currently unrestricted, but are also not approved as a smoking cessation product. Electronic cigarettes are currently not subject to restriction under the Nevada Clean Indoor Air Act.
So, as we can see e-cigarettes raise contradictory talks and opinions. People have been smoking cigarettes for several hundred years; e-cigarettes have appeared just a several years ago. May be that makes a sense to look closer to that new invention that is intended to make smoking less harmful, to decrease the number of people suffering from various diseases caused by smoking, including cancer. Today the picture of our society is not very bright. The number of smoking women is constantly rising; the number of children with inborn diseases is also increasing. Smoking has become a real problem, and it should be solved. So, may be e-cigarettes are the panacea?...
Have you already tried e-cigarettes? Pros and cons | Ecommerce Journal-more about virtual economy|e-commerce and money news|articles|forex and stocks news|banks|investment|gambling
February 16, 2009 - 2:51pm | author: ayny | Articles | Other themes
Have you already tried e-cigarettes? Pros and cons
Sometimes very conventional things obtain quite unusual shapes. Usually they turn to better however sometimes that “better” is very questionable. Today when almost all the developed countries ban smoking in public places, e-cigarettes, a modern analog of the conventional cigarettes becomes more and more popular.
Electronic cigarettes have been invented by Chinese scientist Hon Lik. The first cigarettes of the new generation have come into the market in May 2004 and became very popular at once. According to Ruyan, a Beijing based company where Hon works; only in 2008 the company has sold nearly 300 thousand e-cigarettes.
So, what is it that e-cigarette? The definition of this item is as follows: an alternative to smoked tobacco products, such as cigarettes, cigars, or pipes. It is a battery-powered device that provides inhaled doses of nicotine by delivering a vaporized propylene glycol/nicotine solution. In addition to nicotine delivery, this vapor also provides a flavor and physical sensation similar to that of inhaled tobacco smoke, while no tobacco, smoke, or combustion is actually involved in its operation.
Actually e-cigarettes are similar in appearance with ordinary cigarettes. However instead of tobacco it contains a battery and an LED. Besides battery and LED the so-called cigarette also contains an atomizer and a cartridge. The principle of operation of such e-cigarette is pretty simple: when a user inhales through the device, air flow is detected by a sensor, which activates a heating element that vaporizes a nicotine solution stored in the mouthpiece, called cartridge. It is this vapor that is inhaled by the user. An LED on the opposite end of the device is also activated during inhalation, which serves as an indicator of use, and also to simulate the glow of actual burning tobacco. There are several types of cartridges: high, medium, low and zero-nicotine strength. According to New Scientist magazine the strongest cartridge contains about the same amount of nicotine as a regular-strength cigarette, but lasts for about 300 puffs in comparison with a regular cigarette that lasts for about 15. The average price for such cartridge is $1.50. Each cartridge contains material that is moistened with a flavored propylene glycol/nicotine liquid solution. When the liquid in the cartridge has been depleted, it can either be refilled by the user, or replaced with another pre-filled cartridge.
According to Murray Laugesen, a scientist from New Zealand who currently studies the impact of e-cigarettes to human health even the strongest cartridge only delivers around one-third the amount of nicotine delivered by a puff on a normal cigarette.
Actually the e-cigarettes were marketed as a smoking quit solution. There were lots of various studies which showed that e-cigarettes are less harmless than the ordinary cigarettes since they do not contain tobacco and tar, and hence are not harmful for the so-called passive smokers. However, being sold as a treatment for the smoking nicotine people e-cigarettes do not solve the main problem - addiction. Today there is great variety of drugs, including plasters and pills that help people to quit smoking. E-cigarettes imitating the smoking are said to be less philologically harmful for those who decided to put an end to pernicious habit, however the whole process of smoking that cigarettes is so similar to the conventional one that the final result becomes very doubtful. And if considering e-cigarettes as a move to make smoking safer here there are some nuances as well. According to the smokers e-cigarettes can not be compared to the ordinary ones since smoking is not just a process bringing the dose of nicotine to the organism. Smoking the smokers get the odor and taste that are a part of that habit as well, hence e-cigarettes are not a good alternative for the ordinary things.
Besides there is not exact legislation regarding those e-cigarettes. In September 2008, the World Health Organization issued a release proclaiming that it does not consider the electronic cigarette to be a legitimate smoking cessation aid, stating that to its knowledge, "no rigorous, peer-reviewed studies have been conducted showing that the electronic cigarette is a safe and effective nicotine replacement therapy."
Some countries are still hesitating about approving those e-cigarettes. The reason of this is absence of a clear examination and survey before the manufacturing of those devices. So, according to open sources:
• In Australia, the sale of electronic cigarettes containing nicotine is illegal.
• In Austria and Denmark, electronic cigarettes are considered medical devices, and nicotine cartridges medicinal products. Therefore electronic cigarettes need to be CE-marked, and nicotine cartridges registered as medicinal products, before either can be legally sold.
• In Finland, cartridges containing nicotine are illegal to sell, or to purchase with intent to sell, but are not illegal to purchase from overseas sources for personal use only.
• In The Netherlands, use of electronic cigarettes is allowed, but advertising is forbidden pending European Union legislation.
• In New Zealand, the Ministry of Health has ruled that cartridges containing nicotine fall under the requirements of the Medicines Act, and cannot be sold except as a registered medicine.
• In the United Kingdom, electronic cigarette use is currently unrestricted, with celebrity nightclub Chinawhite allowing use of the devices indoors, where traditional cigarette smoking is prohibited.
• In the United States, electronic cigarettes are currently unrestricted, but are also not approved as a smoking cessation product. Electronic cigarettes are currently not subject to restriction under the Nevada Clean Indoor Air Act.
So, as we can see e-cigarettes raise contradictory talks and opinions. People have been smoking cigarettes for several hundred years; e-cigarettes have appeared just a several years ago. May be that makes a sense to look closer to that new invention that is intended to make smoking less harmful, to decrease the number of people suffering from various diseases caused by smoking, including cancer. Today the picture of our society is not very bright. The number of smoking women is constantly rising; the number of children with inborn diseases is also increasing. Smoking has become a real problem, and it should be solved. So, may be e-cigarettes are the panacea?...
Have you already tried e-cigarettes? Pros and cons | Ecommerce Journal-more about virtual economy|e-commerce and money news|articles|forex and stocks news|banks|investment|gambling
Don't worry, Skull! You did not overstate or overextend yourself at all. It is obvious that Stephen isn't worried about the status of e-cigs or his distributorship's future in his country. I feel he is lucky to live in a country where his government will not impose themselves on his wish to e-vape or sell his vaping equipment. What is sad is that us here in the U.S. do have some reason to worry. This country hates smoking, and it also tends to hate anything that might even be associated with smoking. That is why I like discussing this issue, because I am determined to find a way to keep my gear regardless of what the anti-smokers in this country think about it or try to do about it. I guess they just don't have that problem in South Africa, therefore, they think we are just paranoid. Maybe we are, but I believe we have reason to be.
Controlling the population may be a necessary thing for the people in power but in recent years it has taken on a whole new level.....it's now come down to controlling almost every little details of our lives............ and their favourite word these days seems to be 'BAN'.......I have become sick and tired of hearing the word 'BAN' I think I would be happy if I never ever, ever, heard that word used again.
(Sorry that's not much to do with the thread, just a bit of a personal, crazy rant going on here)
(Sorry that's not much to do with the thread, just a bit of a personal, crazy rant going on here)
I must say it is going to be interesting to see what the future holds for the electronic cigarette in the USA, I can just picture it now all the e-smokers in USA migrating South.
I think worst case scenario is they ban the e-cig nicotine and not the device, until nicotine production is regulated and proven to be a safer alternative
Given that this is a real possibility I am pretty sure some manufactures are working on this as we speak, I don't think any board of directors is just going to sit back and hope that someone does the research for them, I am sure they are investing large amounts of money for research into the safety of there nicotine such as Ruyan and others.
Should they ban the device any day now you could always email me and I will put it in cute little aromatherapy bottle and ship it to you..jokes..but you get my point.
Were there is a will there is away
Good luck to you all.
I think worst case scenario is they ban the e-cig nicotine and not the device, until nicotine production is regulated and proven to be a safer alternative
Given that this is a real possibility I am pretty sure some manufactures are working on this as we speak, I don't think any board of directors is just going to sit back and hope that someone does the research for them, I am sure they are investing large amounts of money for research into the safety of there nicotine such as Ruyan and others.
Should they ban the device any day now you could always email me and I will put it in cute little aromatherapy bottle and ship it to you..jokes..but you get my point.
Were there is a will there is away
Good luck to you all.
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