Official update post for PIF

[keyzygirl]

The PIF thread is the center of this group.If your thinking about changing anything about it at all,you better think long and hard.What gives you the right to do that?PIF is the reason we all got together.Scale down the other stuff if you want,dont do co ops,Whatever.BUT DONT TOUCH THAT PIF THREAD!!

 

[warlike36]

i understand what the concept of PIF is, i am not an idiot....what i am trying to say, is the original thread of the group, which ever direction it takes, THATS the direction the members have taken and thats the direction it should continue to go in...shutting it down at post 3000??? thats just ignorant, need me to link many many threads that are longer than 3k posts??? as far as co-ops being what the PIF is about, a co-op is nothing more than a way to try and save a little money on shipping...if anything, its being cheap, not anything to do with the PIF spirit... do members benefit? yes, is it cheaper?yes is it PIF? not at all...

apparently we both want the PIF to continue, maybe for different reasons, and thats fine...I can live with that...sitting here arguing back in forth is definitly not in the spirit at all...we can both agree on that...

changing the original PIF thread, or closing down the PIF thread will be the downfall of this entire subforum.

Again I agree with muttsrt a 1000%. And if its o.k. I say we have found a MOD. PIF stays!

 

[autumnbreeze]

This is the concept of PIF: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/pay-forward/94838-who-needs-why.html

not this:http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/pay-forward/85629-pay-forward.html
and that shouldn't be called PIF...what I'm suggesting is closing it at the 3,000 post mark as is ecf tradition and if it's restarted doing so under a different thread title that more accurately reflects what it has become...
And a group that is called PIF should be based on the concept of PIF....otherwise might as well just close down the whole thing and start a group called swaps or something....

I've been around since the originial PIF thread and maybe what you're writing makes sense as far as terminology goes, but the original PIF thread WAS a swapping thread and that's how it should stay. The idea is that there are some of us hanging on to things we don't care for or don't use. We give those things away to someone who loves it or might want to try it. The swaps don't have to be of equal value and many times they aren't.

That original PIF thread that you keep saying isn't what this is about IS what created this whole subforum. Everything else that came along evolved from that thread. So, it should stay. Regardless of whether or not YOU feel it's not a true PIF.

And now that I'm thinking about it, the whole concept of PIF in general, not just on this thread, is that one person does something for someone and that person does something for someone else and that person does something for someone else. So yes, our PIF thread IS named correctly.

Arguing over the name of the PIF is silly. It is what it is. My vote is to keep the PIF thread.

 

[warlike36]

PIF must stay,name and all. Its been said and PROVEN. Leave it be. Wipe out all the others. (after the co-ops) Then you may do whatever you like. But the original PIF must always be here. Jules is gone,so out of respect for the one that started it,LEAVE PIF ALONE !! PLEASE and THANK YOU !!

 

[vleath]

I've been around since the originial PIF thread and maybe what you're writing makes sense as far as terminology goes, but the original PIF thread WAS a swapping thread and that's how it should stay. The idea is that there are some of us hanging on to things we don't care for or don't use. We give those things away to someone who loves it or might want to try it. The swaps don't have to be of equal value and many times they aren't.

That original PIF thread that you keep saying isn't what this is about IS what created this whole subforum. Everything else that came alone evolved from that thread. So, it should stay. Regardless of whether or not YOU feel it's not a true PIF.

The whole concept of PIF in general, not on this thread, is that one person does something for someone and that person does something for someone else and that person does something for someone else. So yes, our PIF thread IS named correctly.

Arguing over the name of the PIF is silly. It is what it is. My vote is to keep the PIF thread.

I am with that also. Jules was is truly special and gave from her heart as well as so many others but that does not mean that all of a sudden it is fine to go changing the name the concept or anything else. There are so many things on here from Jules trying to please everyone. We have a swap thread, a place for someone who needs something, a place for someone who wants something, and a place to Pay it forward. Leave those 4 things as they are. And no I dont think you should go and sell the stuff you get from PIF but rather keep PIF going and relist items. If you need to sell something you might should just sell what ever you were thinking of trading on PIF in the first place.

 

[keyzygirl]

VOTE,take a vote on these issues.Any idiot can see that theres only one or two people trying to make waves and feel powerful.THAT is not how this group should be run.This is like a corporate takeover!Run in and cause confusion and change everything to suit your purpose.I vote leave PIF thread ALONE,as is!!

 

[mendnwngs]

VOTE,take a vote on these issues.Any idiot can see that theres only one or two people trying to make waves and feel powerful.THAT is not how this group should be run.This is like a corporate takeover!Run in and cause confusion and change everything to suit your purpose.I vote leave PIF thread ALONE,as is!!

Sigh..

Im sorry you feel that way.

As far as I can see it, Jules made a choice to step down (We love you Jules!) and someone stepped in to fill the vacuum, (blaze) who has an established track record of trying to help in the PIF forum. it appears to me, this was done out of necessity, not greed.

I saw / read (read into?) that blaze was looking for help, so I have offered to help.

Blaze himself has stated he will hand over control to anyone more to the liking of the PIF'ers.

If this means a vote, or a ballot system, or whatever so everyones comfortable, so be it.

I really dont see a power grab, or hostile takeover, or whatever else going on here.. Just someone trying to keep the whole thing together in light of the recent, and (frankly shocking) turn of events.

-Jason

 

[warlike36]

I agree ! Blaze should make,start one of those pole threads and all PIF members vote on name,and whether PIF stays. I would be willing to say we wont need to worry about PIF going anywhere or being changed in anyway. And really that's the right and fair thing to do. Let the members decide ! Jules maybe gone for now,but not forgotten

 

[keyzygirl]

Sigh..

Im sorry you feel that way.

As far as I can see it, Jules made a choice to step down (We love you Jules!) and someone stepped in to fill the vacuum, (blaze) who has an established track record of trying to help in the PIF forum. it appears to me, this was done out of necessity, not greed.

I saw / read (read into?) that blaze was looking for help, so I have offered to help.

Blaze himself has stated he will hand over control to anyone more to the liking of the PIF'ers.

If this means a vote, or a ballot system, or whatever so everyones comfortable, so be it.

I really dont see a power grab, or hostile takeover, or whatever else going on here.. Just someone trying to keep the whole thing together in light of the recent, and (frankly shocking) turn of events.

-Jason

Im talking ONLY about the PIF thread alone.I mean about name changes and the like.Its our main thread and shouldnt be changed.I dont care who wants to be in charge but I do care that they put the wishes of the group ahead of thier own.Its about helping and caring.Right??

 

[warlike36]

I too am speaking about the original PIF thread.

 

[mendnwngs]

Okay. I apologize if I misread you there, keyzygirl. I guess im a little raw right now. so much going on, so little info..

-Jason

 

[JimStanmore]

As others have said, this is distressing news. As far as the PIF thread, I think it should stay named the way it is. Many people feel uncomfortable just asking for something and getting it for nothing. As a student of psychology, I know that for everyone that speaks up there could be up to 10 or more who remain quiet and just go back to analogs.

For example, I just read a series of posts on the PIF thread surrounding an individual that "needed" to get some other items, but had nothing to offer in trade. Many members explained that they could even offer just a piece of polyfil and that is not about what you give, but about need. It took a few posts to explain that it is not about what you offer or get, it is about the sharing.

One of the reasons many shelters are not filled and people are out on the street is that everyone has pride and dignity. Read some of the posts in the want area and you will see the guilt many feel about asking for something. Keep in mind how many there are who need stuff, but are embarrassed to ask. The PIF thread lets you trade an empty 30ml bottle for the juice you need to stay off of analogs until payday AND keep your pride AND feel like you are contributing. A lot of PIF "trades" are done for others by others. It is very difficult, if not impossible, to ask for a hand out.

PIF has a meaning and a reputation. It lets you hold your head up while getting what you need. It lets you feel like you are making a contribution even if you felt as if you had nothing anybody wants. Please don't take it away...

Also, there are many of us that would be willing to help and haven't had time to digest or respond. I, myself, do my obligatory 4 or 5 hours daily on PIF/ECF but, have been wrestling for the last day-and-a-half with my first major trojan attack in a couple of years. I get back on this AM to check up on my favorite place to be and it is in a shambles. It has been over an hour and I still haven't figured out exactly what happened...

 

[FrankR]

PIF is a concept that allows people the opportunity to help / get help with items. Its not WHO mods it, but how WE all conduct ourselves.

It's sad that we as adults express so much anger in simply agreeing how to keep a good thing going that was working just fine.

PIF is such a strong concept that we have been able to sustain a social group from it. Not just any social group, but one strong enough to build friendships, feel good about giving and sharing with others. Why ruin a good thing?

I want to thank Blaze for stepping to the plate. I'm sure he will make good decisions for us - and if we disagree, I don't think he's so full of himself that he wouldn't accept our input and do the right thing.

I want to thank everyone for their contributions and hope that this continues for a long time to come. And of course, I want to thank Jules for everything she has done for us. Out of respect for her, and everyone who has made PIF what it is, I refuse to post anything negative.

 

[autumnbreeze]

It appears that most people don't agree with what Drozd has said. I'm sure there are a few, but definitely not the majority.

The PIF thread is the foundation of this entire subforum. Many of us give to others outside of the PIF thread in the NEED/WANT, etc. threads. I know that I've given to several people without getting anything in return, just as many of us have. The spirit of this entire subforum is that of GOOD.

Unfortunately there are a few people who, by nature, are selfish, greedy, conniving jerks who see our kindness and take advantage of it. We should not let those people ruin our foundation. I truly believe that those people, while they may benefit in the short-term, will get theirs in the long run. The world has a way of taking care of those people all on it's own.

I also do not think that people should be able to sell what they've received from anyone in PIF. Our intentions when we give something away is for that person to try something new or something they love. If that person doesn't like it, they should not financially benefit from what someone gave them. That's not in the spirit of this subforum. They should give it away, which is VERY easy to do.

I wasn't trying to cause problems when I used the word "vote". I only meant to get my point across that I think if anything, the original PIF thread needs to stay.

 

[keyzygirl]

To Jimstanmore

The only person who truely knows what happened and why is Jules.This drama has been going on for a while and everyone is just left to sit and wonder.I dont think anyone of us really knows anything.And Jules isnt explaining it.So sorry I dont have an answer for you.

 

[JimStanmore]

keyzgirl, thanks for the reply. I really am not seeking/expecting an answer. I can possibly understand the frustrations because I got so upset at some of the attitudes on the FDA thread a few months ago that I didn't come to ECF for a few days and have a supplier that I will NEVER purchase from (the only one that will probably ever be in that category for me) because of the attitude towards people that they revealed.

It is just that I believe PIF fills a need on ECF and in the general scheme of things. I agree with autumnbreeze about the connivers, but they are always around us. Unfortunately, we are generally powerless to really impact them because it violates our sense of values to use effective tools to combat them (i.e., the blanket parties from olden military/boarding school days...)

I support continuing on with the spirit, intent and functionality of the PIF thread. There are many aspects to this subforum and we do not all use everything. I look at the co-ops and had a great experience with the bottles one. I decided against doing the HG and 510 carto co-ops,, though. That does not mean that they don't belong here, it just means they are not for me at this time. i do not want to stamp them out because someone else may need them. I am very good now at finding deals - 6 months ago I wasn't and the co-ops would have saved me a lot of money.

I firmly believe that for a new person reading the FDA thread, spurious complaints about suppliers and esoteric comments about HV mods, this forum is a breath of fresh air. It is people being people. Caring, supportive, and interested in each other. In short, a thriving community. Let us not throw about the baby with the bath water if, indeed, any throwing out needs to be done in the first place.

PIF has become my "feel good place" at the end of long, frustrating days...

 

[muttSRT]

Again I agree with muttsrt a 1000%. And if its o.k. I say we have found a MOD. PIF stays!

Not a chance...but thank youi

 

[VRubin]

So has there been any new developments, or are we still lost and confused lol

 

[Blaze]

Hey all, just want to post to keep everyone apprised of the situation.

As of right now, there will be no changes made to PIF, either threads or the group as a whole. I may reorganize some things, but no major changes of any kind. I'm going to make a poll for moderator vote, and we'll take it from there. Anyone that has been "nominated" for a mod position, PM me and make your intentions known as to whether or not your interested in such a position.

After (and ONLY after) we get an established mod team in place to run PIF, I will then be taking nominations for HEAD moderator. muttsrt has a damn good point, and a good night's sleep has only re-affirmed this in my head. As much as I have the need/desire to help and make sure this group stays running, I've got entirely too many obligations to be lead moderator. It's not fair to my family (both "real life" and my PIF family ), and I see it becoming very overwhelming very quickly. I did not step up with the offer to take over for any "power struggle" or "hostile takeover", I simply wanted to help.

After that, if the community AND the moderator team should so decide to allow me to stay on as a SUB moderator, I will do so happily, as was my original offer to Jules.

Much love goes out to you guys and gals. I hope from here going forward we can bring PIF back to what it was originally intended to be

 

[skydragon]

This is the concept of PIF: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/pay-forward/94838-who-needs-why.html

not this:http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/pay-forward/85629-pay-forward.html
and that shouldn't be called PIF...what I'm suggesting is closing it at the 3,000 post mark as is ecf tradition and if it's restarted doing so under a different thread title that more accurately reflects what it has become...
And a group that is called PIF should be based on the concept of PIF....otherwise might as well just close down the whole thing and start a group called swaps or something....

Drozd, I can see part of your point, but what about all the people who chip in when someone doesn't have enough or anything in particular that anyone really wants. That is pay it forward even if it is to the person who didn't have much to offer but in turn did get something they needed. Ummm, if that made sense.