Ontario Ministry of Labour called upon for a ruling of unsafe work.
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https://www.amapceo.on.ca/health/kingston/background/index.php
I looks like it was from 2003, but apparently is still ongoing.
I especially like the part that states "It is important to note that the Employer has stated that individual employees may make arrangements to work off-site by speaking with their managers."
I would ask your manager to make arrangements for you to work off-site under the threat of the Gas Works by-production contamination. Hey, maybe they'll let you work from home where you can vape all day long!
I looks like it was from 2003, but apparently is still ongoing.
I especially like the part that states "It is important to note that the Employer has stated that individual employees may make arrangements to work off-site by speaking with their managers."
I would ask your manager to make arrangements for you to work off-site under the threat of the Gas Works by-production contamination. Hey, maybe they'll let you work from home where you can vape all day long!
Nothing to do with fairness. Fairness is when you give some one a break. This is about truth/lies, understanding/ignorance and bullies.
Old news for the U.S., maybe just making it's way up here. They use substances that are legal and can be changed easily to bypass the laws, although of course the lawmakers are clamping down anyway. Saw a documentary on it. At any rate can't compare a mind altering substance to vaping.
SloHand, a friend suggested using examples from the past, like when people were afraid of electricity and electrocuted an elephant to prove that it was dangerous. There are so many examples of hysteria around the new and unknown in our history I'm sure you can come up with some good ones
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Old news for the U.S., maybe just making it's way up here. They use substances that are legal and can be changed easily to bypass the laws, although of course the lawmakers are clamping down anyway. Saw a documentary on it. At any rate can't compare a mind altering substance to vaping.
SloHand, a friend suggested using examples from the past, like when people were afraid of electricity and electrocuted an elephant to prove that it was dangerous. There are so many examples of hysteria around the new and unknown in our history I'm sure you can come up with some good ones
Thanks Oriana That's the Tesla versus Bell example (I think). Love it. Maybe a free screening to the movie Hysteria too LOL. Great movie.
sorry if a repost
http://casaa.org/uploads/ECA_The_Facts_About_Electronic_Cigarettes.pdf
interesting extract from the pdf
Dr. Laugesen’s tests also provided these conclusions, emphasizing the safety of electronic cigarettes over
tobacco products:
• “On a daily dose basis, TSNAs in the 16 mg nicotine e-cartridge are 1,200 times less than in the tobacco
of 20 manufactured cigarettes, and 3,000 times less than the daily dose in a can of Swedish moist snuff.
erefore, the Ruyan® e-cigarette cartridge does not contain carcinogenic levels of TSNAs, in that no
product containing these trace levels has been shown to cause cancer.”
• “e Ruyan E-cigarette cartridge liquid does not behave like a tobacco extract. e absence of a
monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitor effect means the e-cigarette has no detectable addictive potential
beyond that of nicotine.”
• “e e-cigarette shows no increase in expired CO. e absence of any such effect from the e-cigarette
shows that combustion does not occur—as confirmed by the lack of flame or smoke. As nicotine has a
low vapor pressure, the piezoelectric ceramic element in the e-cigarette is needed to cause vaporization
of the nicotine-propylene glycol solution. Cigarette smoke is produced by combustion at temperatures
of up to 1,000 degrees Centigrade, which is highly destructive, breaking up tobacco into free radicals
and many small harmful gas molecules such as carbon monoxide, butadiene, and benzene. us, mist
from the e-cigarette is created by vaporizing a liquid, whereas smoke is created by incinerating plant.”
• rough an analysis of published data on nicotine absorption, informal comments of bystanders, and
the observation of e-cigarette smoking indoors, it was found that the e-cigarette generates no
sidestream smoke from its (artificially lit) tip, as opposed to cigarette smoke, which is a mixture of
sidestream smoke and exhaled mainstream smoke. In e-cigarettes, any exhaled PG mist visibly
dissipates to vapor within seconds. Non-smoking bystanders do not find the mist unpleasant. e mist
is odorless, and those close by quickly realize it does not have the odor of smoke or the irritating
quality of tobacco cigarette smoke.”
In contrast to the inhaled nicotine in cigarette smoke, the e-cigarette’s exhaled PG mist most likely contains
little to no nicotine and absolutely no carbon monoxide. It is therefore not harmful to bystanders because it
does not have a lit flame or produce combustion of tobacco smoke.
http://casaa.org/uploads/ECA_The_Facts_About_Electronic_Cigarettes.pdf
interesting extract from the pdf
Dr. Laugesen’s tests also provided these conclusions, emphasizing the safety of electronic cigarettes over
tobacco products:
• “On a daily dose basis, TSNAs in the 16 mg nicotine e-cartridge are 1,200 times less than in the tobacco
of 20 manufactured cigarettes, and 3,000 times less than the daily dose in a can of Swedish moist snuff.
erefore, the Ruyan® e-cigarette cartridge does not contain carcinogenic levels of TSNAs, in that no
product containing these trace levels has been shown to cause cancer.”
• “e Ruyan E-cigarette cartridge liquid does not behave like a tobacco extract. e absence of a
monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitor effect means the e-cigarette has no detectable addictive potential
beyond that of nicotine.”
• “e e-cigarette shows no increase in expired CO. e absence of any such effect from the e-cigarette
shows that combustion does not occur—as confirmed by the lack of flame or smoke. As nicotine has a
low vapor pressure, the piezoelectric ceramic element in the e-cigarette is needed to cause vaporization
of the nicotine-propylene glycol solution. Cigarette smoke is produced by combustion at temperatures
of up to 1,000 degrees Centigrade, which is highly destructive, breaking up tobacco into free radicals
and many small harmful gas molecules such as carbon monoxide, butadiene, and benzene. us, mist
from the e-cigarette is created by vaporizing a liquid, whereas smoke is created by incinerating plant.”
• rough an analysis of published data on nicotine absorption, informal comments of bystanders, and
the observation of e-cigarette smoking indoors, it was found that the e-cigarette generates no
sidestream smoke from its (artificially lit) tip, as opposed to cigarette smoke, which is a mixture of
sidestream smoke and exhaled mainstream smoke. In e-cigarettes, any exhaled PG mist visibly
dissipates to vapor within seconds. Non-smoking bystanders do not find the mist unpleasant. e mist
is odorless, and those close by quickly realize it does not have the odor of smoke or the irritating
quality of tobacco cigarette smoke.”
In contrast to the inhaled nicotine in cigarette smoke, the e-cigarette’s exhaled PG mist most likely contains
little to no nicotine and absolutely no carbon monoxide. It is therefore not harmful to bystanders because it
does not have a lit flame or produce combustion of tobacco smoke.
Can you clarify for me what constitutes a stage one, as it states that the three were not satisfied with the results of the stage one and are continuing their work refusal. Just trying to get a handle on the basis for their continued work refusal. What is stage one?
Not trying to be the devil's advocate, but, if the company has issued a directive stating that you can't vape in the workplace, why would there be a need to clean, disassemble and refill your gear? I realize that the nic levels we are using for vaping are fairly safe if there is skin contact (wash area with water) and the second hand vapor is harmless, but these points are almost mute if there is already a workplace policy in place. I'm not saying that their work refusal is right or just. I do believe they are milking this. But at the end of the day the labor board is going to expect the company to live up to their directive regarding vaping IMO. These three vaping rebels are going expect the company to stand by their own directive as well. There is no question in my mind that these rebels have taken this to the nth degree and made a big mess of things for the vapors at your work place. I know if I was one of those three, I'd be saying to the company "it's your policy, stand by it". Personally I don't believe the labor board is going to find this be an issue of employee health, and the work refusal is not warranted (I could be wrong, I hope not). It's the workplace policy issue you have a problem with.
This is obviously either a get-out-of-work ploy or a witch hunt by the anti-vapers... were there any pre-existing personal problems between you and the refusers? Not to say that would justify what they are doing, but I can't believe they are actually serious about the safety concerns. This just sounds ludicrous! They have put in place a no-vaping policy in the workplace, no mixing or cleaning policy, and these refusers are still thinking they are in danger?
I think you are right, no matter what facts or studies you present, these PITA's are going to keep it up. I would also say that your managers and the MOL know the difference but have to go through all the right steps as to avoid a possible lawsuit from the refusers.
Keep your cool, follow the polices. Don't give them any reason to dismiss you... I wouldn't doubt the refusers are going to be targeted for dismissal after this crap. It wouldn't surprise me that unofficially, management will be looking for a reason to dismiss the refusers more so that looking at the vapers.
I think you are right, no matter what facts or studies you present, these PITA's are going to keep it up. I would also say that your managers and the MOL know the difference but have to go through all the right steps as to avoid a possible lawsuit from the refusers.
Keep your cool, follow the polices. Don't give them any reason to dismiss you... I wouldn't doubt the refusers are going to be targeted for dismissal after this crap. It wouldn't surprise me that unofficially, management will be looking for a reason to dismiss the refusers more so that looking at the vapers.
From what I've read,so far, it seems the refusers may be smokers, who are upset that they have to leave their work, while you do not. They seem to be trying to force the employer to make you look bad productivity-wise, in that vapers can continue working.
Either that, or they're upset that they are forced, BY LAW, to leave their work, thus making them look bad. Corporate politics is a nasty business.
OTOH, they may just be looking for some off time at someone elses expense.
Or I could be completely off base......
Either that, or they're upset that they are forced, BY LAW, to leave their work, thus making them look bad. Corporate politics is a nasty business.
OTOH, they may just be looking for some off time at someone elses expense.
Or I could be completely off base......
From what I've read,so far, it seems the refusers may be smokers, who are upset that they have to leave their work, while you do not. They seem to be trying to force the employer to make you look bad productivity-wise, in that vapers can continue working.
Either that, or they're upset that they are forced, BY LAW, to leave their work, thus making them look bad. Corporate politics is a nasty business.
OTOH, they may just be looking for some off time at someone elses expense.
Or I could be completely off base......
This is my take on it as I am someone who has walked this planet long enough to know that there are only 2 things on which all of this rests:
1) Fear - of so many things really (this by the way also applies to HC); change, loss, judgement etc.
2) Jealousy - what you are doing is working for you and that conjures up feelings of anger, resentment and contempt before investigation
This is my take on it as I am someone who has walked this planet long enough to know that there are only 2 things on which all of this rests:
1) Fear - of so many things really (this by the way also applies to HC); change, loss, judgement etc.
2) Jealousy - what you are doing is working for you and that conjures up feelings of anger, resentment and contempt before investigation
View attachment 182370
Just imagine the ignorance if we didn't have an education system. There's also a good number of folks who believe we are getting away with something. Everybody wants to rule the world as the song goes, so lets not forget the control issue either.
Just lurking cause i'm still feeling beat up at the moment and wanted some me time
HEY how about them Habs!!!!!
I'll post a more detailed update soon but when I'm less angry We've essentially been thrown out to the wolves with the only ones standing up for us at the moment are management .... go figure?!? The history at my workplace is ugly but (I would hope) not have anything to do with personal conflict. If it is Id remind you all that today was anti-bullying day.
I believe though that the local executives of each union has gone rogue. Might be time to ask Smokie Thomas and Gary Gannage to weigh in ... in all of my being, I can't understand why in hell the unions would not want to adopt resolutions that supported vaping it's a no brainer. I remember not that long ago being at CLC conventions where half the convention floor would be outside smoking, me among them! Need to help these people.
Just as an FYI, all three of the 'refusers' are representatives of the local union. If they are following direction, they are being sorely misinformed despite our attempts to the contrary.
What has happened to my effin rights?!?
I'll post a more detailed update soon but when I'm less angry
We've essentially been thrown out to the wolves with the only ones standing up for us at the moment are management .... go figure?!? The history at my workplace is ugly but (I would hope) not have anything to do with personal conflict. If it is Id remind you all that today was anti-bullying day.I believe though that the local executives of each union has gone rogue. Might be time to ask Smokie Thomas and Gary Gannage to weigh in ... in all of my being, I can't understand why in hell the unions would not want to adopt resolutions that supported vaping
it's a no brainer. I remember not that long ago being at CLC conventions where half the convention floor would be outside smoking, me among them! Need to help these people.Just as an FYI, all three of the 'refusers' are representatives of the local union. If they are following direction, they are being sorely misinformed despite our attempts to the contrary.
What has happened to my effin rights?!?
So here's the thing...I went into Shoppers today looking for some kind of nasal spray cause it's so frickin dry here and the OTC I pick up has mostly propylene glycol in it. So I was thinking that we should all take pictures of the ingredient list of products that we find and post them to a folder here to show those who freak out when the word chemical is used....
If you haven't read this, it's encouraging that the smoking ban doesn't include e cigs
The Baltimore Sun
If you haven't read this, it's encouraging that the smoking ban doesn't include e cigs
The Baltimore Sun
Not just that but many of the preservatives in everything have some degree of the same ingredients we are vaping and in stronger levels. Sounless they ban monhydroglyphimate (made up) and every other thing we don't understand in food, then they are being hypocritical in treating it as smoke. as well as every other thing in the office.
If it is a company that drug tests then they have access to a lab to test it properly, through both employees and the juice itself. They either don't want to spend the money or want to dismiss it simply because apparently it's a health risk to everyone because a few drips might fall out, and when he breathes "smoke" comes out.
I am confused and disgusted that so many people can be so clueless about it. I have so much to say but no place to start as I am completely overwhelmed by the info I just read. Give me time to absorb. I'll be more coherent after I have a minute because right now I'm in knee jerk country.
I am honestly scared for this decision,
At this point there has been no resolution. The MOL has not completed its investigation and still no one from MOL has asked any questions of the vapers that are known in the building.
Speculation has been that management will be filing a complaint against the unions, (go figue????) on what grounds?? . Perhaps that the unions did not adequately represent their member? Thats where I would go with this complaint.
Early days yet as we all know how slowly government works sometime.
Speculation has been that management will be filing a complaint against the unions, (go figue????) on what grounds?? . Perhaps that the unions did not adequately represent their member? Thats where I would go with this complaint.
Early days yet as we all know how slowly government works sometime.
You can also take a look at all the chemicals you are exposed to at work, industrial chemicals right down to cleaning chemicals. The chemicals in our food, water and air. Our planet is just one big chemical mess, north to south, east to west. So the few chemicals found in e-cigs are the tipping point, the straw that broke the camel's back. Vapors should be shot for bring us to the brink of destruction. This is all too pathetic.
As far as the stadium's position on e-cigs. I think it's still just a business move more than anything. They don't want to alienate all there customers. I know the bars here in Ontario took a big hit when the smoking by-laws took affect. The problem for the bars was, when the smokers left because of the ban, the non-smokers that were left behind didn't bring in all their non-smoking buddies to make up the shortfall. And that was their argument all along, more people will come out to the bars if the smokers are gone. The bar owners knew that was a pile of BS, and that's why they resisted. At some point in time a ANTZ will complain and they'll start to push the vapors out as well. After all, it normalizes smoking.
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