To anyone who says its easy to quit while you're a minor is wrong. Does being 18 automatically make you more addicted to nicotine? I've turned 18 this year, and I was smoking for 7 years before I found ecigs. I'd happily buy a kit for any of my 17 year old friends. It sad when people use the old abstinence approach to teenagers. We WILL still do it. I'm not saying it should be legal to minors, but I'm definitely not going to let one of my friends continue killing themselves with analogs when they could be safely vaping. At least if they're vaping, they can at least work down to no nicotine and maybe even quit. I don't care if its illegal or not, analogs are disgusting and harmful, and helping my friends quit them is worth the risk and effort.
Opinons on underaged vaping (under18)
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For myself personally I am not talking about trying to get kids who don't smoke hooked on e-cigs. I'm talking about getting kids who ALREADY smoke off of analogs. And there are MILLIONS of them out there. You can thank Big Tobacco (and because of the money they give to them...the government) for that....as well as ANY problems the e-cig industry has.
The first thing that comes to mind is admittedly self-serving: if what little public-opinion polling conducted so far means anything, it means that you, I and everyone else here has an image problem. That problem won't be enhanced by the sight of children--with the consent and approval of their vaping parents--using e-cigarettes on the street.
The ultimate effect of it, in fact, could only be additional harm done to the general perception of vapers and vaping. While we're arguing this point, the wheels of prohibition are turning, and the ultimate outcome would make this controversy moot.
If teenage vaping threatens my right to vape, then I say no. (NO! NO! IT'S MINE! MINE, I TELL YOU! YOU CAN'T HAVE IT!!!)
I remember being addicted at 16, it wasn't easy - but it was easier. I remember not having cigarettes and inviting this guy over just so I could have some of his cigarettes, or scheming up ways to get a couple of dollars from my dad. But not yet at the point where I'd smoke one that I found on the street.
But if my future teenage daughter or son came home smelling of cigarettes.... I might hook them up with a spare batt and atty and some low to no nic juice.
I remember being addicted at 16, it wasn't easy - but it was easier. I remember not having cigarettes and inviting this guy over just so I could have some of his cigarettes, or scheming up ways to get a couple of dollars from my dad. But not yet at the point where I'd smoke one that I found on the street.
But if my future teenage daughter or son came home smelling of cigarettes.... I might hook them up with a spare batt and atty and some low to no nic juice.
morally, i almost feel obligated to make an attempt at converting every smoker i meet, minor or not. however, due to legal ramifications, i won't even address an underage smoker. not in this, the day of lawsuits.
If my son or daughter started smoking, I'd much rather buy them their own smokes (or eCigs) than risk them getting it from God knows where.
I began smoking when smokes were less than 50 cents a pack. I was give 35 cents for lunch each day.
I was also 13 years old.....
I was also 13 years old.....
I think many people in the US have image problems per se...but what you perceive as an image problem and what I perceive as one may be two different things. We are one of the MOST UPTIGHT countries in the world and generally mocked by the rest of the world. In France it is second nature to smoke, and ads with topless women on the street don't cause people to bat an eye....as well as many other countries. In England teenagers going to the pub is part of their culture. Having wine with dinner for KIDS is condoned in many other cultures. I just think we lose focus when we start worrying about the WRONG issues. For me, I'd rather see my daughters vaping then see them in a casket. I'll leave it at that...I'm too fresh off the smokes to get real upset, lol.
Yeah I see where you are coming from, but the real sad thing is not everyone does,, and what is really sad the ones that can pull the switch on the whole thing don't agree with you.
So the question would be do we provide more ammo to the opposing or do we stand by the guidelines already provided and prevent additional restrictions to the masses?
Yes minors drink.. but drinking is already accepted
Yes minors smoke... though not completely accepted it is currently on paper
Yes minors have sex, but it is already accepted for consenting adults
The above mentioned topics debate only has one issue what should be considered an acceptable age to be considered a minor. right now the age is already established for smoking and drinking
As far as sex that isn't really an ugly issue until an instance happens when an 18yr old gets in trouble knocking up his 17yr old girlfriend.
Ecigs is a new beast when it comes to debate... and adding if a minor should be added to the equation is ignoring the big picture.
Yes everyone is free to do what they want.. but things do have to be brought into perspective...
I am not very articulate so excuse me for that
LGD
I think you're missing something: whatever attitudes prevail in Europe don't matter. They don't vote here, nor influence the doings of the FDA or any other regulatory body. We're losing our right to vape while we ponder the irrelevancy of social mores across the Atlantic.
Odd, by the way, that you'd hold up the French's second nature smoking as a paragon of healthy, unfettered attitudes--and then have a problem with the spectre of your daughter lying in a casket.
Covers my personal feelings about just the concept of "should" we allow/not allow minors. Sure as a PARENT, I should do all i can to keep my (yes i really have one) 16 and year old son from having sex wiht or w/out condoms. Doen't mean i'm going to be successful either, but it is my job/role to teach them good habits. Same goes w/ smoking tobaco and alchol. Thats my job. Teach them best i know. Smoking analog or e-cig is not amongst the best things i can teach them. Making it legal/illegal isn't gonna stop or change the equation much.
There is a good chance that this "might" have worked for me as well.
However it wasn't done and didn't stop me. But well, there were people stopping me from buying beer and alcohol, and it had zero affect on me taking the practice up. So I again doubt banning/allowing sale of e-cigs is going to make much of a difference either way, from the point of view of public policy and society. Sure it may affect one or two to not take it up. But, doesn't anybody remember the kid who will do something just because it IS not allowed? Some are going to take it up for that reason as well. Cigarettes are banned for < 18yr olds too. And yet a lot of them start then. Arguing about the ban is deflecting from real discussions about what/how to deal with the reality of what is going on in the world and solutions that can/will have an impact.And this is the crux of what we really should be discussing. Its not like we even know whether the e-cig community is gonna survive past the current debate for those of us well beyond our age of majority. Involving or bringing in any discussion about minors is going to just arm our opponents in the debate regarding those +18 further harm the amount of support we get from non-smokers in our fight. and that support is "tepid" at best.
So I say we should leave the topic alone, or really fight ferociously against any in our community who allow or encourage sale of these to anyone <18. To do otherwise is neither a good plan for those <18 or the rest of us >18 at this time. Wheter its completely right or not doesnt make it not the way it is, and we just dont have the political capital to do otherwise.
I never said vaping should be legal to minors? I was just saying I wouldn't let them continue to smoke analogs if they wanted to vape. Thats just what I would do, because I'd rather not watch someone kill themself than I would want to do it myself.
If the real issue here was this getting in the hands of minors, then cigarettes and alcohol wouldn't be legal to begin with. And if vaping could replace analogs, then we're taking a step forward if minors were the issue.
Sure, the opposing side can take this topic and use it against us. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't talk about it and be prepared. I don't know why everyone is so afraid to talk. We NEED to talk. Vaping WILL survive, as long as we all at least KEEP TALKING, and KEEP INFORMING.
And I honestly don't care if you disagree with me.
I'm looking forward to the day when someone walks up to me and tells me that what I'm doing is either worse or just as bad as smoking.
If the real issue here was this getting in the hands of minors, then cigarettes and alcohol wouldn't be legal to begin with. And if vaping could replace analogs, then we're taking a step forward if minors were the issue.
Sure, the opposing side can take this topic and use it against us. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't talk about it and be prepared. I don't know why everyone is so afraid to talk. We NEED to talk. Vaping WILL survive, as long as we all at least KEEP TALKING, and KEEP INFORMING.
And I honestly don't care if you disagree with me.
I'm looking forward to the day when someone walks up to me and tells me that what I'm doing is either worse or just as bad as smoking.
First of all is this a kid who is your child? I personally know that my son smokes and is under age. Do I approve no! He's a teenager and is going to do what he is going to do. I have not personally let him try vaping. To me it wouldn't be beneficial to let him vape. I want him to quit not pick up another habit. If this is your child you need to make a decision that you feel is right for them and you.
I am prepared for any backlash. I know that my opinion may not be popular.
If I discovered that one of my kids was sexually active, I'd buy them condoms and put them on the pill.
If I found out they were smoking, I'd get them a PV and let them share my juice.
If I found out they were drinking or doing drugs, I'd lock them in their room and they'd never see the light of day.
Ignoring it won't make it go away, but we can try to protect them from harming themselves.
But, should they be able to buy it? Absolutely not! It's my prerogative as a parent to choose how to handle it, I know my kids better than any government agency.
If I found out they were smoking, I'd get them a PV and let them share my juice.
If I found out they were drinking or doing drugs, I'd lock them in their room and they'd never see the light of day.
Ignoring it won't make it go away, but we can try to protect them from harming themselves.
But, should they be able to buy it? Absolutely not! It's my prerogative as a parent to choose how to handle it, I know my kids better than any government agency.
I am going to start another thread. Should the FDA make e-cigarettes Legal for all people in all states including minors?
If people can say that health care is a right why not e-cigs? like the above poster said addiction has no age limit.
Frankly I believe that minors will reach for the forbiden fruit more often than not, that's why it's cool and that's why we have peer pressure. Making it specifically illegal for minors will be an attractive nuisance in the same way that alcohol and other drugs are.
Someone else mentioned Europe and it's laws or lack of laws. It's legal for minors to drink so it actually makes it less attractive to minors. If we make e-cigs illegal for minors specifically, as it seems to be now, we will only increase the amount of kids who think it's cool and feel pressure to try them.
So my answer is that the Law should not specifically forbid minors from vaping. As it stands currently, if I were a business owner I would follow the law. As a citizen I would follow my concious and decide on a case by case basis. If an addicted minor asked for e-cig advice I would in all good concious give them the information they need to make a successfull go at it. If a non addicted minor or adult ask for e-cig advice I would tell them to stay the heck away from nicotine and why. Again there are other catagories such as bi-polar and other conditions were nicotine has been shown to alleviate some symptoms, but that is a whole other story.
If people can say that health care is a right why not e-cigs? like the above poster said addiction has no age limit.
Frankly I believe that minors will reach for the forbiden fruit more often than not, that's why it's cool and that's why we have peer pressure. Making it specifically illegal for minors will be an attractive nuisance in the same way that alcohol and other drugs are.
Someone else mentioned Europe and it's laws or lack of laws. It's legal for minors to drink so it actually makes it less attractive to minors. If we make e-cigs illegal for minors specifically, as it seems to be now, we will only increase the amount of kids who think it's cool and feel pressure to try them.
So my answer is that the Law should not specifically forbid minors from vaping. As it stands currently, if I were a business owner I would follow the law. As a citizen I would follow my concious and decide on a case by case basis. If an addicted minor asked for e-cig advice I would in all good concious give them the information they need to make a successfull go at it. If a non addicted minor or adult ask for e-cig advice I would tell them to stay the heck away from nicotine and why. Again there are other catagories such as bi-polar and other conditions were nicotine has been shown to alleviate some symptoms, but that is a whole other story.
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