Percentages and Viscosity

[Rimau]

Hey guys,

I want to try and mix with a VG nic base only, and I need to thin it out with distilled water so it will wick, but every time I use a calculator it insists I need PG. I don't want to add PG. I will also be adding flavor.

My questions are:

1. What percentage is good for flavor (very light flavor is desired)?
2. What is a good percentage for distilled water to thin out VG into something like 50/50 viscosity?

Note: I know that everybody had different likes for flavor, but is 5% normal, 10% strong, etc? If I had an idea of what kind of percentages are "normal" or usually found in premixed flavored liquids, then I would at least have a starting point.

I will start with either a 26mg or 36mg 100%VG nic base with a desired goal of 24mg. After fooling around with the numbers, I was able to get close (23mg final) with the calculator on the DIY Flavor Shack site, and could get the PG down to zero, but the percentages, at least to me, mean nothing without a starting point. 2%, 5%, 8% water are fine when tweaking the numbers to get to zero PG and 23mg, but don't really help. Point is, I could try 4 or 5 1ml combinations to find the answer, but many of you guys are experts at this and I would appreciate some indication of a relatively good starting point. Why reinvent the wheel by myself when you guys have space flight already

Thanks

P.S. I need to thin for ego-t and CE-2 XL r5 usage

 

[Prettycat191]

There will always be PG in your mixes if you use most flavors, because most of them have a PG base. There are some flavors with a VG base, but I can't remember any of them at the moment. That affects the PG % in most calculators.

Flavoring strength varies from flavor to flavor and vendor to vendor, but if you like light flavor 2-5% would be a good start.

You can use Distilled Water or PGA (Pure Grain Alcohol) to thin VG, I never used more than 10% DW to thin mine (never tried PGA, but I wouldn't go over 5% with that either), but they were still thick; I ended up changing to a PG/VG ratio for more flavor in the end.

I'm sure more people will be along with more advice for you soon, this is just my limited experience.

 

[mgordon1100]

I can't answer about the water, I don't use it. However, the e-juice me up calc works fine for your application. Is that what you're using? Anyhow, you have to account for your flavoring. example: If you want 10 percent flavoring, then you have to account for it by making it a 10/90 pg/vg ratio. This is assuming that your flavor is PG based, it's normal. Then, it will show you good numbers and under PG to add, it will say 0.

Hey, Copy Cat! You got in ahead of me. That's what I get for watching Ally McBeal, I guess.

 

[Prettycat191]

I can't answer about the water, I don't use it. However, the e-juice me up calc works fine for your application. Is that what you're using? Anyhow, you have to account for your flavoring. example: If you want 10 percent flavoring, then you have to account for it by making it a 10/90 pg/vg ratio. This is assuming that your flavor is PG based, it's normal. Then, it will show you good numbers and under PG to add, it will say 0.

Hey, Copy Cat! You got in ahead of me. That's what I get for watching Ally McBeal, I guess.

Doesn't that make you the Copy Cat?

I remembered one of the VG base flavor types, Nature's Flavors.

 

[Desertfremen]

IIRC to thin VG into the consistency of PG you need 20% water. So to thin to a 50/50 I too suggest 10%. If you wish to use PGA then 5% will give the consistency of PG so I'd'start with 2.5%. I've also found that with using 80 proof vodka 14% will thin VG down to PG consistency so again halve that to get 50/50.

I too use an all VG base where the only PG in my mixes comes from the flavouring or a bit pf koolada but I like my juices to be about the consistency of PG as opposed to 50/50. I cant help you with the mixing calc cuz I dont use them. I like doing my own math so I dont have to fit my mixtures into a defined rule.

 

[MaxUT]

+1 for the sandworm rider

I premix the plain VG, 80/20 with distilled water, so that it's the consistency of PG.

 

[Switched]

+2

80/20 vg/h2o

 

[Rimau]

Thanks -- as prettycat said, I will keep it down to no more than 5% flavor, which should be somewhere around 95/5 VG/PG as a chemical base, and water to round it out to an 80/20 mix using water. I'm not too hot about using PGA if I can get away with it, don't like the TH it gives.

Using the ejuice calculator v.13 and juice-me up calculator.

DIY flavorshack has VG based flavors, but not the ones I really want to use. With premixed, I usually add about 10% DW to thin from the 50/50. I guess I should have gotten a 60/40 or so, but I want to try cutting down on the PG for awhile just to see how it turns out. I'll get back once I have tested them.

All of you have given some really great advice, I will try them and see which ones work best. the reason I am trying to calculate is that I want to start with pure VG nic, add a slight flavor, and keep it around a 50/50 viscosity, ending up with an 18mg and/or 24mg nic liquid. I guess I could just keep adding DW, but then my nic numbers wouldn't be where I want them. I know it sounds ridiculous, but I want known given values before I start tweaking, this way I will be able to achieve some kind of consistency.

Prettycat -- what was the pg/vg ratio you ended up with? What are you vaping it in?

Saludos

 

[Prettycat191]

I vape 40/60 PG/VG, I found that it's the perfect balance for me in terms of TH, vapor production, and maximum flavor. I use an Ego-T passthrough battery, with Riva 510 atomizers @~2.0ohm, and @~2.2ohm, drip through my drip tips exclusively.

 

[Rimau]

Thanks. How's the vapor with that mix? I haven't done really any dripping as it is a pain, that was one reason I went with the ego tank when it first came out, still using it, but also the 5th revision CE-2 and am trying the CE-3 as well.

 

[Prettycat191]

I get good vapor, definitely more than my smoking friends lol. Enough to where it lingers in the air for a few seconds at least.

 

[wizard10000]

I work strictly in VG except for flavoring - as a matter of fact I no longer own any PG at all

*Most* VG-based nic is already thinned with DW so the only thing you have to worry about is the 0mg VG. Most of the time my flavoring runs 15% or better so I don't thin the 0mg at all and it wicks in cartos just fine - couldn't tell you about eGo tanks as I use homemade syringe tanks.

Considering flavoring will also thin your juice I think starting at 10-15% DW will get you where you wanna be. If you're using PGA to thin then 5-10% should do ya.

 

[Rimau]

Thanks wizard. I am just waiting for some supplies to arrive. I have been making calculations for a 20% DW, but I will cut them back to 15% to start once I am ready to mix a batch. I am picking up the 0mg VG tomorrow, I have about a quart of 0mg PG, but no VG. At one point I was thinking of just replacing any 0mg VG with water, but 6oz of VG run about $3 locally for Humco brand (saw the sticky that basically recommended it, the USP version of course).

I only have a small bit of 36mg VG left, and have been using it with DW to "mix" with some premixed 50/50 in either 12mg or 18mg, but it will be totally different using all VG and DW, except for the 10% or less PG that is in the flavors. I am thinking on the lines of a 5% flavor so at least the final mix will be 95% VG and DW.

I'll get back when I make my first batch. Which will be as soon as the mail can hurry up.

 

[whiskywildcard]

The biggest issue you are going to run into is the fact that adding flavoring and water to your 26mg base is automatically going to bring it below your target of 24mg nic. i break nic up into usable units for myself when i do my juices. By this i mean i take a look at my current nic (26 mg in your case) and see how much adding 50% would change it to (13mg)for my base, you can also figure out what it would be in smaller % as well in this manner, adding 10% of anything will reduce your nic by 2.6 mgso if you are at 10ml bottle of juice and have 9ml of your 26mg nic, you add in 5%flavor, and 5% water and you finish at 23.4 mg juice. Hope this helps a little

 

[mgordon1100]

I just wanted to say this somewhere. I guess this thread is as good as any. I think this really only works if you have some kind of tank like system. Aren't there those Cartos that are like tanks?

Anyhow, last night I mixed myself up some flavorless vape. I really didn't care much for the taste, as some folks do. So, I put a few drops of flavor in my tank. I think I got the best tasting liquid this way. It's not always practical, but if your going out somewhere, and know how much you're going to be using, you can always set up a few cartos or tanks ahead of time. The way I see it, I got my liquid in the percentage that I wanted, and any flavor I add will really not make very much of a difference in that small amount.

 

[Rimau]

mgordon -- you are right, that would probably be the fastest way. I am using tanks and Ce-2/CE-3 carts, so that wouldn't be a problem, but sometimes I want more or less nic, and with the CE, I always add a bit of DW anyway. It will just easier to make a 5ml batch. The only problem is that if I am only adding 8 drops to a 10ml mix, I shutter to think about 1 or 2 drops into a .8ml tank or even a 1.8ml cart. Brrrrrrrr. I like my flavors to be more on the mellow side, otherwise I would get tired of them too fast.

Whisky -- Thanks for the heads up. I am getting 48mg so I have lots of wiggle room. I want to try for a 26mg batch, just a tad bit over the usual 24mg. I picked up a bottle of plain VG today so I will have plenty on hand to add as the heed arises without sacrificing nic. That is one of the reasons I want to DIY, this way I get all the percentages I want with respect to DW and VG as well as the nic level I want. Thanks for reminding me that adding 10% of anything 0nic in 10ml will lower it by 2.6 (@26mg), I guess I forgot how to add I'm not being ironic, I actually forgot such a simple equation. Although now I feel like an idiot. That opens up all kinds of possibilities for final mixes, just add VG or DW to reduce the nic without having to make a new batch.

Although if I did only end up with 23.4, I would at least be in the 24mg ballpark and happy enough. On the weekends I have less opportunities to vape, so I want a little higher nic level for then, however, during the week, I am seriously thinking of at least dropping back down to 18mg (where I was before) or even to 15mg because I really like vaping, but want to cut back on the nic a little when I am sucking in 4-5ml during the day.

Side note: I found some lost RY4 that I had forgotten about that is about 9 months old, and wow! I guess the tobacco settled in, I am so glad I have some RY4 flavor coming with my VG nic. If I can get this DIY stuff to work right, I am going to seriously start thinking about mixing my own RY4 from scratch. When I get there I will ask you guys for recipes, but one thing at a time.

P.S. Pretty cat: you are a bad girl, in a good way. I followed your lead and went to the flavor store when you posted the prices for the flavors you just picked up there. Thanks for the tip.

Saludos

 

[Prettycat191]

Sure, and let the owner know of any specific flavors you might like to order in the future, I got a reply from him today to let him know what flavors I like, because they're looking for suggestions of flavors to stock. Gonna have to compile a list for him now; he's gonna wish he'd never asked!

 

[whiskywildcard]

Very welcome man, i seem to notice alot of people are overthinking the % of nic being used and i like to make math as easy as possible in my head, figured it would help ya out. If you have any questions about mixing or % feel free to message me i check in here almost nightly. you can also obviously always check out the DIY section in the forums. HAPPY VAPING

 

[Rimau]

Still waiting on supplies, as soon as they are here I’ll throw a batch together and let you know. I have been reading around and some are recommending 10-15% flavor, except for the tobacco. Some have even said 20%! Best thing is to start low and add after some ageing. I am going to try the hot water bath to help speed things up a bit.

I'll get back with the results.

 

[Rimau]

OK, did it! The only problem was that my order got mixed up and I received 36mg 50/50 instead of 48mg VG. Oh well. I am trying to get around 29-30mg final, and the 36mg makes it difficult, what with the DW and flavoring and all. I had to settle for a 26mg, but it worked! The RY4 needs to settle down for a few days, even though I gave it a hot water bath. The tobacco notes are a bit too flowery right now. The blackberry worked out perfect. At least I know that this stuff works

I am measuring in ml and not drops, just easier it I tweak my calculator a tad on the DW/flavor/mg levels to get the mls to round out more. I made a couple different one's to let age, but I really wanted to start with 100%VG nic and have a 20%DW, but I had to settle for a 50/50 and about 15% DW. Asi es la vida.

Note: Chris at flavor store was fantastic! Is sending me a bottle of 100%VG @48mg today. Gotta love those guys. I will definitely buy from them again, and recommend them to everyone. It's nice to find a place with good customer service.

Will get back once the 48mg gets here.

Saludos and thanks to everyone, you all have been a great help getting me started mixing.