pg/vg ratios?

[SurReality89]

hello i tried doing a search on this but i can't really figure out how to find what i'm looking for with the search engine here, as i am sure this as be covered here before...

anyway i when i have bought liquid before i never had the decision of what pg/vg ratio i wanted, and i honestly don't even know what the ratios are for my current liquids. so i'm just curious what the differences are from a 50/50 70/30 30/70 100/0 and 0/100

right now i have turkish blend and vanilla from aromaejuice.com and i don't particularly think i'm will be sticking with them, the vapor is a bit harsh to me and i don't really think i get as much of a vapor cloud as i do with the vanilla cream i got from cloudsofvapor.com... i generally have just been mixing my vanilla cream with my turkish blend to get something i can handle without coughing, and i don't think its the flavor because i like the vanilla cream but not the vanilla from aromaejuice...

i'm thinking the pg/vg probably has something to do with this as opposed to just the flavor, because the both flavors from aromaejuice have a similar feel that i don't like even though they taste completely different.

thanks

 

[SurReality89]

i'm thinking i'm just going to start with a DIY method, and get 100%PG and 100%VG 60mL each (seems to be the smallest amount available for a decent price) with some flavor concentrates and just figure out for myself to see what i like and what the benefits of each actually are (if any)...

still open for suggestions, i know its pretty early still so i'm sure later some folks will chime in
~SurReality

 

[chips]

A good ratio for e liquid is PG 80% to VG 10-20%

Although cutting VG with about 15% distilled water to make aqueous glycerine is recommended, as VG is quite thick to work with, adding 15% distilled water, gives the same consistency as PG. You can also buy aqueous glycerine, ready cut.

The VG does have a slightly distinctive taste in e liquid, so if it is at much stronger concentrations, it can effect the flavour of an e liquid. In small amounts it wont make too much difference.

PG is best for carrying flavour and giving throat hit, whilst VG will produce more visible smoke on the exhale.

 

[BuGlen]

PG = Propylene Glycol: Provides much of the throat hit (along with the nicotine level), carries the flavor more than PG, and is thinner than VG so it allows the e-juice to feed easier in your device. 100% PG liquids can be harsh and may cause leaking in certain devices.

VG = Vegetable Glycerin: Provides most of the vapor cloud and is thicker than PG. 100% VG liquids may cause some wicking issues in certain devices and can "gunk" your atomizer quicker than VG or mixed liquids.

I personally use 50/50 blends and I haven't had any real issues except with the really dark / sweet liquids shortening the life of some cartos.

 

[SurReality89]

yea that's sort of what i was thinking, i have vaped a VG solution (meant for oral use not vape) but i actually like the sweet taste that carried into the vapor... i'm just not sure if it would be good for my atomizer to have such a syrupy fluid constantly going through it. i think that more VG might by my preference, but i'm not sure because i don't know what COV's ratio's are because i know i like their liquid over aromaejuice... i think i will just go ahead and do the DIY thing i was talk about and mixing the VG and PG nicotine myself (plus adding my own flavors sounds fun) to see what i like the most. since its cheaper that way anyway and it looks like i can get most of the flavors i was thinking about buy in concentrated form.

 

[SurReality89]

one thing i'm wondering is... if VG causes less nicotine to be absorbed into my body, and thus wasting more nicotine by exhaling it as opposed to PG? i want to be actually consuming the most nicotine as possible, but i also want to see vapor lol so idk if it is some sort of trade off or if PG vapor is the same just less visible

 

[BuGlen]

one thing i'm wondering is... if VG causes less nicotine to be absorbed into my body, and thus wasting more nicotine by exhaling it as opposed to PG? i want to be actually consuming the most nicotine as possible, but i also want to see vapor lol so idk if it is some sort of trade off or if PG vapor is the same just less visible

Actually, the absorption of nicotine may not be as critical as you might think. While it's true that vaping in general isn't as efficient at delivering nicotine to the blood stream as traditional cigarettes, I vape 18mg liquid (former pack a day smoker), and it's more than enough to get what I need. In fact, at less than 6 months vaping, I'm already considering lowering the nic level in my liquid to 12mg.

If you're doing the DIY thing, you may also want to get liquids with different levels of nic so you can figure out the best level for you.

 

[SurReality89]

i'm using the 24mg/ml, and i was actually curious about stepping it up a notch lol... but maybe i ought to consider that, i was actually thinking i would get super concentrated nicotine and diluting it to try to save some pennies, but ironically i did the math and its actually more expensive to do that after buying VG/PG to dilute it down (which i don't understand at all i figured i would save money, plus i'm good at diluting high concentrated forms of substances from other hobbies lol)

but if i do want to go to less concentrated nicotine, it would be cheaper to just stick with one 24mg/ml that i intend on getting anyway and getting vg/pg and diluting that down, rather than buying different concentration and thus buying more nicotine all together.

 

[BuGlen]

I would generally discourage using nicotine concentrate "right out of the gate" when you first start down the DIY path. The wrong amount of nicotine added to your liquid could result in a toxic dose that may result is making you very sick. Also, the handling of nicotine concentrate should only be done with adequate protection of the skin and in a controlled (very well ventilated) environment. This is not saying anything about you personally, as you may have a degree in chemistry and be fine, but more for others that may reading this thread and thinking it's a good idea.

I think your idea of getting the 24mg and mixing it down is probably the best way to go as you figure out your mixtures. Another thing to consider is having different nic level liquids for different moods or times of the day. There are several people who prefer a high nic does in the early day and low dose in the evening, or a high nic juice for stressful times. Basically, whatever keeps you using traditional tobacco products is a good thing. And there's no reason that you can't have fun in the process.

 

[SurReality89]

yes your attitude about high concentrates seems to be the same as the DIY suppliers... because there is no reason getting a high concentrate that is intended to be diluted to 3-5 times the volume should cost MORE than buying it pre-diluted... WTF i wish i could just buy 99-100% nicotine, this .... is whack. the highest i can find is 10%... i can usually just google any compound and find a 99.9% pure form, why is nicotine any different? and where do the suppliers get their nicotine??

 

[classwife]

yes your attitude about high concentrates seems to be the same as the DIY suppliers... because there is no reason getting a high concentrate that is intended to be diluted to 3-5 times the volume should cost MORE than buying it pre-diluted... WTF i wish i could just buy 99-100% nicotine, this .... is whack. the highest i can find is 10%... i can usually just google any compound and find a 99.9% pure form, why is nicotine any different? and where do the suppliers get their nicotine??

We do not discuss 99-100% nicotine here...
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-forum-rules/51178-forum-rules.html
22. Nicotine strength
a. The maximum nicotine strength of eliquids allowed to be offered for sale on ECF by Suppliers is 36mg or 3.6%. No liquid of strength higher than this can be specifically offered or specifically mentioned by Suppliers. Trade deals are exempt, within private supplier boards only, as higher strengths are needed for trade bulk mixing. Note that there are shipping restrictions in some countries for toxic materials, which can be obtained by application to your local Postal Service and private shippers, and you are cautioned not to contravene these restrictions.
b. Suppliers can sell whatever strength they wish with the exception of pure nicotine (900mg / 90% and above). Sites that sell pure nicotine will be blocked by ECF. We define 'pure nicotine' as 90% / 900mg/ml or higher.
c. There is a limit on public discussion of 200mg (20%) maximum for mixing discussion, recipes and tutorials, and also in the Classifieds.
d. The use of 'Pure Nicotine' cannot be discussed (in detail) on public forums on ECF (trade forums are exempt) due to the hazard [1] - see Notes below. That is to say, it can be mentioned in passing but not discussed at length especially as regards mixing.


Notes

[1] It became obvious that some members joining in discussion of pure nicotine did not have any idea of the danger, or any knowledge of working with hazardous chemicals, or even any basic knowledge of measurements. Pure nic is as dangerous as cyanide - opening a bottle in a room can result in all present being poisoned. It must be handled in a fume cupboard, with hazmat precautions. Pure nic can be theoretically defined as: Nicotine 100%, 1000mg, 1000mg/ml, but is more likely to be found as 998mg, 997mg/ml or 990 mg (99%). We consider anything over 90% / 900mg to be 'pure nic'. No discussion of use or links to suppliers whatsoever* are allowed.

There is a very real danger of death or hospitalization with this material and ECF cannot support any publicity of its use or sources. There is no need to use it since far safer strengths are available for bulk mixing, such as 48mg (4.8% nicotine in PG or VG), 60mg (6%), and 100mg (10%). To protect our members and ourselves we do not allow discussion or sources of anything over 200mg (20% nic)*.

Advertising/promotion on ECF cannot exceed 36mg strength. Vendor's sites can sell any strength up to 89% though we advise vendors to limit sales to 10% / 100mg/ml where possible. Sites selling pure nic will be banned.

* Except within private trade forums.


That 10% is 100mg Nicotine...


Please learn what you are doing before messing with DIY.


Edit: Moved to DIY E-Liquid

 

[bzmotoninja83]

OK so I have a question. I bought a 2oz bottle of glycerin at Michaels yesterday to test out the diy situation. Don't know if its PG or VG. No specification. Anyways, I also found a local supplier that has a 2oz bottle of 50mg/ml PG mix. If I were to mix the two glycerins would that create roughly 24mg/ml?

Also wanted to say that the flavors I picked up are Wilton's cake flavors. 4 pack with cherry, peppermint, some other "creamy" mint and, cinnamon. Cherry and cinnamon aren't that bad.

I did a test run of 20 drops of VG, 5-6 drops of distilled water, and roughly 10% flavor. I'm thinking I should find some PG
So I can just mix 1:1 to make a 60/40 or 50/50.

 

[SurReality89]

my bad, thanks for keeping me in check classwife.