Pipe that emits smoke while it is untouched?

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cadcoke5

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I actually got into this subject a few years ago, when I played with the idea of making a small smoke machine for puppet theater, that used an E-cig. I had some marginal success, but eventually decided that it did not emit enough smoke.

But, playing with the E-cig, I found that I liked using it, even though I have never smoked. I have always liked the smell of cigars, and some pipes. I think the smoke that is emitted by the cigar/pipe, and not inhaled, is part of the experience.

This also relates to some of the goals I had for a smoke machine for puppet theater. It is useful to have a way to simulate a smoldering cigarette, or fire, or cooking pot on a small stage. Is there such a thing as an E-pipe or other product that emits smoke while it is just sitting on your desk?

I have seen some instances where people are making their own atomizer, and demonstrate it by powering it up before it is installed inside its housing. It emits a small puff of smoke.

I have also noticed a bit of a tendency for an atomizer to smoke more at the beginning of their use, and the taper off as the liquid is used up near the actual atomizer coil. Then, if the atomizer is allowed to "rest" more of the juice will soak the coil again, and it returns to its prior volume of smoke. I wonder if a device with multiple coils are connected so they are fired in sequence, will allow a more continuous flow of smoke?

So, what I am describing may be possible. I wonder if those smoking atomizers can continue to emit those small puffs, or do they only do it for the first few times they are fired up, when they boil off the extra liquid?


Joe Dunfee
 

slopes

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I've had a couple of manual e cigs on which the switches eventual broke - leaving them full on. I can tell you, it was an AMAZING experience - exactly like handling a real, lit cigarette... hot, smoking and abundant in vapour. I used to unscrew the atties a little to disconnect them after a session - but it didn't take long before they conked out and died.

I wish more people would take an active role in modding an ecig - or pipe - which functioned in this way. My ideal device would switch on to low current (simmering over), be activated into full vape mode via an auto switch on the mouthpiece and contain a tiny and light enough battery to provide a 10 minute vaping session in this way (I'd carry a pack of 20 of these easily changeable batteries and whip a new one in for each 'smoke').

This is a completely different approach to the type of devices being developed by ECF modders... but I believe it would be the holy-grail of vaping as a true replacement for the cigarette-smoking experience. If I had the electrical knowledge I would have built one for myself long ago... but I don't :(
 
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cadcoke5

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I am sure it would be a battery drain, but that is why I first thought of a pipe for this idea. Since, pipes commonly have a holder for them to rest in, it would be a natural for them to be powered for the smoke generating while idle. I also imagine any of the power supplies that are microprocessor controlled could be re-programmed to allow for this mode.

Another item I am trying to follow up on is the possibility of a motorized fluid supply. A few years back, I recall someone doing some research and finding a reasonably priced mini-pump. I don't know if any of the commercial finished products, or even kits are using this sort of technology. Unfortunately all my efforts to search turn up too much, since "Auto drip" and other similar phrases are generally used for non-motorized methods.

Joe Dunfee
 
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asdaq

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A guy.... you must be new here, LOL. Actually that isn't quite it either. Search for a Tayvoy regulator, it has a pre-warming function built in that fires the atty for a second or so every 10 seconds to keep the coil warm. Playing with this you could theoretically re-program it to actually run more when 'idle'.
 

asdaq

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I have looked all over for the "Tayvoy regulator", but without success. Can anyone recommend a place in the U.S. to look for one, or something with a similar function?

Joe Dunfee

It is in Polish, but ecig specific: Mod TayVoy « TayVoy

A little google translate helps, but I doubt it is available outside of Poland as there seems to be enough demand just domestically to keep the supply as busy as it wants to be. But, you can still get a general idea of what is going on with it and the features. It isn't all that far off from a DNA or Nivel, seems to be just thinking up the desired functions and making them happen.
 

cadcoke5

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First, Roadrash, thanks for the mention of the wiper timer circuits. I hadn't thought of that. 12v would be a problem, but I was reminded that the need for timing like this is a common one in many industries. I actually have a timer control box for a theatrical fog machine. Now, it is itself, bigger than what my entire e-cig based device should be, and I have no clue of the voltages inside.

It isn't all that far off from a DNA or Nivel, seems to be just thinking up the desired functions and making them happen.

I did find a mention of the Nivel, where they said it would be possible to upload software updates to it. This implies it is programmable by the user. Of course, that would depend on the creator desiring to go open source with it.... and someone bilingual to come up with the English documentation. So, that is looking unlikely, and certainly not likely in the time frame I have.

So, if I want to get this going, I am going to have to do some electronics design. It won't be for the current play, so it will be one of those "put this on the back burner" type of projects. At least for the continuously smoldering concept. I may create an E-cig with a tiny fan for another effect on stage.

Joe Dunfee
 

cadcoke5

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If you are just looking for a 'mini fog machine' for puppet theater, check out the Wizard Stick -

I actually have one of the products from that company, a Zero Blaster that shoots smoke rings. And while the Wizard Stick puts out more fog, it uses the same technique. A squeeze bulb (i.e. an eye-dropper top) puts a bit of fog juice onto the heating element. So, it can't easily be made automated or remote controlled.

Joe Dunfee
 

Scubabatdan

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I actually have one of the products from that company, a Zero Blaster that shoots smoke rings. And while the Wizard Stick puts out more fog, it uses the same technique. A squeeze bulb (i.e. an eye-dropper top) puts a bit of fog juice onto the heating element. So, it can't easily be made automated or remote controlled.

Joe Dunfee

Sure it can, a TCS M100 3.0V micro pump and a remote control circuit.
Dan
 

cadcoke5

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Sure it can, a TCS M100 3.0V micro pump and a remote control circuit.
Dan

Thanks for mentioning that pump. I had, in the past, looked for just such a device.

But, now that I discovered tanks on E-Cig atomizers, I wonder how much need there is for pumps like this. Well, a chain smoker may appreciate it, but I don't know that I need the long term abilities a pump like this would provide.

I recently PM's you, looking for a programmable regulator. I just recently purchased an Arduino for this project, but am still hoping I can find a off-the-shelf device for e-cigs.

Joe Dunfee
 

cadcoke5

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I got one of the alternative fans mentioned by others in Scubabatdan's thread about his "Air powered assist module", and tried it in my first mod. It was the "squirrel cage" type fans, known for better air pressure. But, the results were less than satisfying. The air pressure needed to get air through the restrictions in the connector are just to much for that fan. I also tried a dual-coil cartomizer with a hole punched in the side for a tank, with no better results even though I enlarged the hole a lot.

If I use a Phoenix atomizer, with its cap off, even the dime-sized muffin fan provides an ample amount of air when I aim it at the exposed coil. So, I haven't given up hope, just re-directed my efforts.

Below are some pictures of my attempt. I took a two cell AA battery box, and cut a hole for the cartomizer to fit. I use a cap as a gasket to help form a seal. Then I cut a square hole to accommodate the output from the fan. An alternative with a bigger box would have been to put the fan completely inside, with the inlet at an opening in the side. But, in my case, I needed the air to be drawn in through an opening in the cup the smoke maker was to be mounted. So, that dictated the location.

Note that this assembly is fairly messy, since it was just a proof of concept. There was no switch wired in the circuit, rather I just held wires together. The fan says 3 to 5 volts DC. The battery is 4.7volts.

Joe Dunfee

E-cig with fan-Closed.jpgE-cig with fan-open.jpgE-cig with fan-Open2.jpg
 

Scubabatdan

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Thanks for mentioning that pump. I had, in the past, looked for just such a device.

But, now that I discovered tanks on E-Cig atomizers, I wonder how much need there is for pumps like this. Well, a chain smoker may appreciate it, but I don't know that I need the long term abilities a pump like this would provide.

I recently PM's you, looking for a programmable regulator. I just recently purchased an Arduino for this project, but am still hoping I can find a off-the-shelf device for e-cigs.

Joe Dunfee

Sorry, been busy as sin, I have not done any programming with chips, so I really do not have any input in that area, sorry.
Dan
 

Scubabatdan

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I got one of the alternative fans mentioned by others in Scubabatdan's thread about his "Air powered assist module", and tried it in my first mod. It was the "squirrel cage" type fans, known for better air pressure. But, the results were less than satisfying. The air pressure needed to get air through the restrictions in the connector are just to much for that fan. I also tried a dual-coil cartomizer with a hole punched in the side for a tank, with no better results even though I enlarged the hole a lot.

If I use a Phoenix atomizer, with its cap off, even the dime-sized muffin fan provides an ample amount of air when I aim it at the exposed coil. So, I haven't given up hope, just re-directed my efforts.

Below are some pictures of my attempt. I took a two cell AA battery box, and cut a hole for the cartomizer to fit. I use a cap as a gasket to help form a seal. Then I cut a square hole to accommodate the output from the fan. An alternative with a bigger box would have been to put the fan completely inside, with the inlet at an opening in the side. But, in my case, I needed the air to be drawn in through an opening in the cup the smoke maker was to be mounted. So, that dictated the location.

Note that this assembly is fairly messy, since it was just a proof of concept. There was no switch wired in the circuit, rather I just held wires together. The fan says 3 to 5 volts DC. The battery is 4.7volts.

Joe Dunfee

How much air are you losing through the sides of the box? it it were air tight that thing should work like a champ. Also I found that when soldering the center pin you need to be careful not to let the solder obstruct the air hole. You can even use a 1/16" drill bit and hand drill the air hole bigger in the attys center pin to allow more air flow.
Hope that helps.
Dan
 

cadcoke5

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How much air are you losing through the sides of the box?

Thanks for that info. I know I was getting some air loss, but really was not concerned about it since I was originally thinking that there was too much total air volume anyway. But, of course, my thinking can be wrong, and it often is. Real-life testing trumps theory. I will try again in the future with a fully sealed case and drill out the connector a bit. I may also try putting the tiny dime-sized fans in series, since that will double the pressure in the same way that stacking two batteries will double the voltage.

As the video below shows, I went a different direction today. I drilled about a 1/8" dia hole in the side of a phoenix atomizer. Then, strapped the fan to the side of it. Note that in later experiments, I blocked at least 3/4 of the fan's inlet in an effort to reduce air flow and get a denser smoke and it was still too much air flow.

For this particular project, I need to get it done soon, and so am not doing much more experimenting for now. But, one major issue with this device is that I tend to use up the smoke juice too fast. It is also difficult to know how much is currently needed for the amount of time you use it. Also, if you add too much it will leak into the fan. I may try to add some cotton around the perimeter to see if that provides more leak-free juice storage.

I really like the idea of a clear tank. But, the Genesis style one that I have is the only one that can tolerate having a hole in the side like the Phoenix atomizer. The Genesis one is prone to leaking a bit if upside-down. This theatrical fogger needs to tolerate being held in any orientation. The tanks that surround a cartomizer seems to leak when upright.

The videos were too large to upload with the 3meg limit, so I have linked them to dropbox. I have two different formats, since I am not sure what is popular nowadays.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35836415/Tiny Smoke Machine-V1.3gp
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35836415/Tiny Smoke Machine-V1.wmv

Joe Dunfee
 
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