Question about Mg. Nicotine and E-Juice

[jbbishop]

I'm planning to make the switch. I've found the single greatest source of confusion is the unreliable representation concerning the equivalency of nicotine for the super mini versus the analog.

Now I understand that the average pack of full flavor cigarettes has about 22 mg. of nicotine. Let's just say about 1 mg. nicotine per ciggy (although I've read people can intake up to 2 mg. depending on how they smoke).

The highest strength cartridges are 6 mg. nicotine for these super minis I believe, although I think I saw one that said 8 mg. for an Njoy product? Actually, this translates to approximately 1/3 pack of cigarettes, and I've read that going through 3 carts a day is average from some users so this tallies pretty well.

I've read that on a puff per puff basis the e-smoker ingests at best about 1/3 as much nicotine as with a regular cigarette. A cart is supposed to deliver between 90 and 300 puffs (I believe these various assertions are applied to the micro mini) so I would guestimate that maybe 150 is a possible average? Or about 25 - 30 puffs being equal to a full cigarette?

These uncertainties aside for the moment here is where the math really tanks for me:

Many people say that buying carts is so expensive so they refill using the liquid. e-liquid comes in the highest strength of 36 mg. of nicotine for a formulation of 30 ml. of juice which, it is warned, is "VERY STRONG." Anecdotally, puffers are going through 1-2 ml. per day which I gather they regard as "equal to about 1 - 2 packs of cigarettes," but as I understand it this would only be equal to about 1-3 mg. of nicotine per day or a max. of about 3 analog cigarettes.

Is there something that I'm not understanding? Also, why do I have to read through all these forums and still find myself confused about this question? It seems to me that it should be the first thing curious people would want to figure out, not the least for attempting to determine their product needs and budgetary requirements.

 

[Harry Crazington]

Many people say that buying carts is so expensive so they refill using the liquid. E-liquid comes in the highest strength of 36 mg. of nicotine for a formulation of 30 ml. of juice which, it is warned, is "VERY STRONG." Anecdotally, puffers are going through 1-2 ml. per day which I gather they regard as "equal to about 1 - 2 packs of cigarettes," but as I understand it this would only be equal to about 1-3 mg. of nicotine per day or a max. of about 3 analog cigarettes.

Jbbishop, but there's 36mg in EACH ml, so1 or 2 ml would be about 20 to 40 drops or 36 to 72mg nic divide by 1/3 = 12 to 24mg nicotine, or ciggys. Wow, I was smoking 40 real cigs a day, now I'm down to 1 pack equivelant of e-cigs. A 50% reduction in nic intake.

 

[jbbishop]

From the New Member Forum:
Topic - how long do carts last compared analogs

FRANKIE WRITES:

For example 30 ml of 16 mg (high) e-liquid per month means you vaped the equivalent of 20 light analog cigarettes per day.

But regular cigarettes contain 0.9 mg. of nicotine and lights 0.6 mg. of nicotine so 20 lights per day is going to be 12 mg. of nicotine x 30 days = 360 mg. of nicotine where the "30 ml of 16 mg (high) e-liquid" reads like that's only 16 mg. of nicotine total. What am I missing here?

KATE WRITES:

Frankie is right about the nicotine but here's a general idea for puffs:
Super Minis (RN4081, RN4088, DSE103, etc...): About 1-3 cigs worth (20-30 puffs)
Mini (DSE901, etc...): 5-6 cigs worth (50-75 puffs depending on how you puff)
Pen (DSE801, RN4072, etc...): 7-10 cigs worth (up to about 100 puffs) eCigar: 10-12 cigs worth (up to about 120-130 puffs)
Pipe (DSE601, etc...) At least 14-15 cigs worth.

Taking the super mini, assuming the cart isn't dried out or whatever, then isn't the equivalency to a cigarette entirely dependent upon the amount of nicotine, thus 0 to 6 mg. is equal to from 0 to 6 cigarettes worth? Then, is that true there is only 20 - 30 puffs? If so, is there some quality issue where you're not really getting 6 mg. of nicotine out of them? I believe I've seen them advertise from 90 to 300 puffs per cart for the super mini, and I'd like to know what is really typical... I know they advertise a cart to be equal to 2 packs of cigs where mathematical analysis suggests more like 1/3 of a pack... Now Kate is saying it's only like 1-3 cigarettes (although she says she doesn't use carts herself). Geez, it sure would be nice to get some consensus.

 

[jbbishop]

THANK YOU HARRY CRAZINGTON, finally knowing that begins to make some sense, so 36 mg. nicotine formulation is actually about a gram of nicotine in a 30 ml. solution. Now I can see why people might get away with diluting their juice with glycerin, etc. Geez, this **** is deadly what if someone put it in your coffee? If anything needs to get regulated it's this e-juice. They need to put it in tamper proof cartridges I guess.

 

[Harry Crazington]

Jbbishop, not only that, but 36mg x 30ml = 1080 mg nic, divide by the lethal dose of 60mg nic = 18 times the lethal dose if someone drank a whole 30ml ( 1oz ) bottle all at once !

 

[Harry Crazington]

Jbbishop...and not only THAT...the e-juice is extremely flammable, put one drop on a spoon or piece of tinfoil & hold a flame to the juice & it burns like gasoline !...stuf's DANGEROUS, handle with care...& wear a helmet & goggles 8-o

 

[Kate]

Jbbishop, but there's 36mg in EACH ml, so1 or 2 ml would be about 20 to 40 drops or 36 to 72mg nic divide by 1/3 = 12 to 24mg nicotine, or ciggys. Wow, I was smoking 40 real cigs a day, now I'm down to 1 pack equivelant of e-cigs. A 50% reduction in nic intake.

Why divide by 1/3? Where does the other 2/3 go?

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/health-safety-e-smoking/3598-nicotine-safety.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/general-e-smoking-discussion/6525-draws-puffs-per-ml.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/2562-helpful-links-videos-new-user.html

 

[Harry Crazington]

Why divide by 1/3? Where does the other 2/3 go?http://

Ha, I just noticed your question Kate.
Where did the other 2/3 go? jbbishop was talking about thirds in his first post...and I was probably drinking when I answered him, and now rereading it I'm too totally confused by the whole mess to try and refigure it soooo..the other 2/3 probably got exhaled .....

 

[BatFanBob]

My head hurts...........

 

[abby182000]

the 1/3 in the formula is derived from the fact that when vaping instead of smoking you only get 1/3 of the nicotine per drag than what you would get from an analog cigarette. At least that is how I interpreted it.

 

[TheColoradoDude]

Has anyone figured out all this in a simple formula?

 

[happily]

Has anyone figured out all this in a simple formula?

yes......and no. 18mg is per ml.

but as far as nic intake by vaping compared to analog's some say it is close/ 14-22 mg is a pack of smokes. Some vapers need less intake and some need more. They way you inhale seems to affect everyone differently.

A more specific question would be easier to answer.( although there is no exact answer)

 

[TheColoradoDude]

Okay thanks,, I was just worried that I was vaping way more nicotine than my former analog habit.

 

[happily]

If you get a headrush or dizzy your vaping too much...............that's the best rule

 

[Ultimist]

There is a great deal of misrepresentation of nicotine in this thread. 60mg of nicotine IS NOT LETHAL to human beings. A lethal amount of nicotine for humans is 60mg PER KILOGRAM of body weight. In other words, if you weigh 100 pounds (45.36kg) the amount of nicotine you would have to ingest to be killed would be 60mg x 45.36, or 2721.6mg (2.72 grams) of nicotine.

A 10ml bottle of 18mg nicotine liquid has 180 milligrams of nicotine, so someone weighing 100 lbs. would have to ingest FIFTEEN bottles of that liquid in order to die.

No offense to those who said 60mg of nicotine is lethal... but that just isn't correct. It is 60mg per kilogram of body weight. BIG difference.

 

[TheColoradoDude]

There is a great deal of misrepresentation of nicotine in this thread. 60mg of nicotine IS NOT LETHAL to human beings. A lethal amount of nicotine for humans is 60mg PER KILOGRAM of body weight. In other words, if you weigh 100 pounds (45.36kg) the amount of nicotine you would have to ingest to be killed would be 60mg x 45.36, or 2721.6mg (2.72 grams) of nicotine.

A 10ml bottle of 18mg nicotine liquid has 180 milligrams of nicotine, so someone weighing 100 lbs. would have to ingest FIFTEEN bottles of that liquid in order to die.

No offense to those who said 60mg of nicotine is lethal... but that just isn't correct. It is 60mg per kilogram of body weight. BIG difference.

Oh I want to believe you but how do I know those facts are correct? How come a supplier has not not chimed in on the straight dope of the correct answer? Or maybe you have?

 

[Ridewithme38]

There is a great deal of misrepresentation of nicotine in this thread. 60mg of nicotine IS NOT LETHAL to human beings. A lethal amount of nicotine for humans is 60mg PER KILOGRAM of body weight. In other words, if you weigh 100 pounds (45.36kg) the amount of nicotine you would have to ingest to be killed would be 60mg x 45.36, or 2721.6mg (2.72 grams) of nicotine.

A 10ml bottle of 18mg nicotine liquid has 180 milligrams of nicotine, so someone weighing 100 lbs. would have to ingest FIFTEEN bottles of that liquid in order to die.

No offense to those who said 60mg of nicotine is lethal... but that just isn't correct. It is 60mg per kilogram of body weight. BIG difference.

that's 60mg per kg of PURE nicotine right?...is that the amount needed to be absorbed into the blood stream or just the amount ingested? I.e. With vaping its estimated that only 1/3- 1/10 of the nicotine inhaled is actually absorbed by the body, through the skin it maybe less....is 100% absorbed if swallowed?

 

[Ultimist]

I remember reading it somewhere online, not sure where. But I am fairly certain I am remembering it correctly.

In fact, I can prove that 60mg of nicotine isn't enough to kill. I vape the 36mg liquid exclusively... meaning 36mg of nicotine per milliliter. I vape between 4 and 5 ml each day, meaning I take in 144 to 180 mg of nicotine each day. If 60mg of nicotine is lethal, I hardly think I'd be able to take in 2 to 3 times that amount every day and still feel BETTER than I felt when I smoked analogs.

 

[TheVapSter]

not to jump off subject but reading this i plan to dilute my juice for now or at lest try it and see; what would yall dilute it with pg or vg (non nic) can you find it at the local supermaket what would you look for in what section what else do they use pg for anyone know if i remember right someone here said you can get it easy and its real cheap like a couple of bucks a liter i dont know how true that is but i would love to find out?

 

[Bowlcut3x]

I think I'm starting to understand the ratio of nicotine to liquid, i.e. 36mg e-juice contains 36mg per ml. Is that a liquid measurement or dry? After researching I've seen a post on Yahoo Answers that the nicotine is extracted into a final product being crystals. When use the other method of soaking, straining and boil down I get this disgustingly black liquid.

So... would 36mg of the black liquid be the same as 36mg of the crystallized nicotine? Obviously I'm still doing something wrong because commercial e-juice is almost clear whereas the stuff I make is the color of pancake syrup.