Question.. chew vs vaping and cancer

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pipster

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So I was wondering about this the other day.. if you are at risk for oral cancer from chewing, are you at risk for oral cancer from ejuice in your mouth, on your lips all the time? What in chew causes oral cancer? The nicotine or the tobacco? If it's tobacco, do the .NETS put you at risk? I don't know anything about chew, snus or whatever you call it.
 

LurkTron

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So I was wondering about this the other day.. if you are at risk for oral cancer from chewing, are you at risk for oral cancer from ejuice in your mouth, on your lips all the time? What in chew causes oral cancer? The nicotine or the tobacco? If it's tobacco, do the .NETS put you at risk? I don't know anything about chew, snus or whatever you call it.

Chew has fiberglass that cuts little tiny holes in your lips to deliver the nicotine. Chewing tobacco is full of chemicals and I mean FULL. It is not the nicotine that causes cancer, although it can cause high blood pressure and other heart related problems. The chemicals are the culprits causing cancer not the nicotine.
 

Mailablemage

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E juice contains 4 ingredients (i may need some spellcheck here)

Nicotine
Vegetable glycerine
Polypropylene glycol
Food grade flavoring

Pg and vg are both used in medical practice and have had studies done on them, neither of which are carcinogens. Food flavor is food flavor. And nicotine does cause health risks but not cancer
 

Ryedan

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Chew has fiberglass that cuts little tiny holes in your lips to deliver the nicotine. Chewing tobacco is full of chemicals and I mean FULL. It is not the nicotine that causes cancer, although it can cause high blood pressure and other heart related problems. The chemicals are the culprits causing cancer not the nicotine.

There is no fiberglass in chew. That is a rumor that probably exists because "small, glass-like particles can be seen due to the formation of salt crystals", unless you have better data on that. Nicotine is absorbed through the mucus membrane in the mouth.

Also, everything is full of chemicals. Water is a chemical. Which chemicals in chew cause cancer?
 

Jonathan Tittle

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There is no fiberglass in chew. That is a rumor that probably exists because "small, glass-like particles can be seen due to the formation of salt crystals", unless you have better data on that. Nicotine is absorbed through the mucus membrane in the mouth.

Also, everything is full of chemicals. Water is a chemical. Which chemicals in chew cause cancer?

The nitrosamines are considered a danger and are formed during the growing, curing, fermenting, and aging of tobacco. The others are polonium–210 (a radioactive element found in tobacco fertilizer) and polynuclear aromatic hydrocarbons (also known as polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons). This is coming from Cancer.gov, bullet #2.

Smokeless Tobacco and Cancer - National Cancer Institute
 

Ryedan

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The nitrosamines are considered a danger and are formed during the growing, curing, fermenting, and aging of tobacco. The others are polonium–210 (a radioactive element found in tobacco fertilizer) and polynuclear aromatic hydrocarbons (also known as polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons). This is coming from Cancer.gov, bullet #2.

Smokeless Tobacco and Cancer - National Cancer Institute

From your link:

"7. Should smokeless tobacco be used to help a person quit smoking?

No. There is no scientific evidence that using smokeless tobacco can help a person quit smoking (7). Because all tobacco products are harmful and cause cancer, the use of all tobacco products is strongly discouraged. There is no safe level of tobacco use. People who use any type of tobacco product should be urged to quit. For help with quitting, ask your doctor about individual or group counseling, telephone quitlines, or other methods."

I've been around long enough to know when I read "all tobacco products are harmful and cause cancer" and "there is no safe level of tobacco use", I can eliminate the source as factual data. This works for me but of course YMMV.

From Smokefree Health Effects:

"One set of chemicals that are talked about a lot in the science are nitrosamines, or tobacco-specific nitrosamines (TSNAs). Nitrosamines are a class of chemicals that we are exposed to in food and through other pathways. Some of these are known to be carcinogens in some quantities. Whether the TSNAs might be carcinogens is the subject of debate. Fortunately, it does not matter whether these chemicals might cause cancer since we have evidence about whether smokefree tobacco itself causes cancer. The evidence shows that people who use ST do not have measurable increases in cancer rates or mortality. So it does not really matter what chemicals are there."

A link from that page helped me put it into better perspective with some hard data: Lee and Hamling 2009;

"Results

Eighty-nine studies were identified; 62 US and 18 Scandinavian. Forty-six (52%) controlled for smoking. Random-effects meta-analysis estimates for most sites showed little association. Smoking-adjusted estimates were only significant for oropharyngeal cancer (1.36, CI 1.04–1.77, n = 19) and prostate cancer (1.29, 1.07–1.55, n = 4). The oropharyngeal association disappeared for estimates published since 1990 (1.00, 0.83–1.20, n = 14), for Scandinavia (0.97, 0.68–1.37, n = 7), and for alcohol-adjusted estimates (1.07, 0.84–1.37, n = 10). Any effect of current US products or Scandinavian snuff seems very limited. The prostate cancer data are inadequate for a clear conclusion.

Some meta-analyses suggest a possible effect for oesophagus, pancreas, larynx and kidney cancer, but other cancers show no effect of smokeless tobacco. Any possible effects are not evident in Scandinavia. Of 142,205 smoking-related male US cancer deaths in 2005, 104,737 are smoking-attributable. Smokeless tobacco-attributable deaths would be 1,102 (1.1%) if as many used smokeless tobacco as had smoked, and 2,081 (2.0%) if everyone used smokeless tobacco."

It has been a while since I have read about ST. I remembered it being pretty safe, but forgot the details. It's good to look this stuff up once in a while :)
 

kristin

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Over 99% of the diseases caused by "tobacco" are actually caused by smoke. Smoking actually has twice the risk of oral cancer, although that risk is still extremely low. A lot of the cases of oral cancer blamed on smokeless tobacco use are now being found to have links to alcohol and HPV instead. Like caffeine, nicotine can temporarily raise blood pressure, so both stimulants are not recommended for those with pre-existing heart disease or conditions that raise the risk of stroke.

Many of those horrific pictures of oral cancer weren't even from smokeless tobacco use - they are propaganda. I call it the "airplane crash effect." Even though the risks are extremely low, the images are so graphic and horrifying that people are still more afraid of it than other things they do that have much higher health risks. It is ironic that many smokers think they would have a greater risk of oral cancer switching to ST because of the "airplane crash effect" of ANTZ propaganda.

There are approximately 13,500 oral cancer deaths per year in the U.S. and most of those are linked to smoking, alcoholism and HPV, not smokeless tobacco use. According to the ACS, about 7 out of 10 oral cancer patients are heavy drinkers and HPV is found in about 2 out of 3 oropharyngeal cancers. And the ACS also says that smokers are "many times more likely than non-smokers" (and smokeless tobacco users are non-smokers) to develop these cancers. Note that the ACS isn't specific about the actual number of oral cancer cases directly linked to ST use, likely because the numbers are so low and it's nearly impossible to rule out the other possible factors.

After decades of research, snus users have not been found to have higher incidence of oral cancer. Snus has been found to have lower TSNAs than other types of smokeless tobacco, however, the difference is really negligible in western brands of ST, so it is unlikely to make a difference in cancer risk. Most oral cancer research on "chew" is actually linked not to western-style types like Skoal, but to Asian/Indian "chew" that actually contains little tobacco. It's a product that mostly contains the areca/betel nut.

So, if you use "western-style" smokeless tobacco, but are not a smoker, heavy drinker or exposed to HPV, the health risks of using ST barely register - comparable to many of the things we consume that aren't necessarily healthy, but that most people would consider relatively safe.

It's also worth mentioning that the reason we think e-cigarettes are 99% safer than smoking is due to research on smokeless tobacco compared to smoking.
 
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emus

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Hogwash! Cancer is always caused by toxic overload on the liver leading to DNA injury in liver or remote sites. Eat organic, eliminate as many chemicals from your environment as you can, and your good to go!

Would be great if you're correct. Any supporting data? Like peeps on organic islands w/ lower cancer rates? I've seen data to support refined flour/sugar is bad for the heart; data compared counties w/o refined flour/sugar.
 

Mitey F

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Would be great if you're correct. Any supporting data? Like peeps on organic islands w/ lower cancer rates? I've seen data to support refined flour/sugar is bad for the heart; data compared counties w/o refined flour/sugar.

Unfortunately you're right. Studies have shown that men who live long enough WILL get prostate (or maybe it was testicular?) cancer eventually, if nothing else kills us first. I don't know if the same applies to other types of cancers, but I don't see why it wouldn't.
 

emus

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Unfortunately you're right. Studies have shown that men who live long enough WILL get prostate (or maybe it was testicular?) cancer eventually, if nothing else kills us first. I don't know if the same applies to other types of cancers, but I don't see why it wouldn't.

I am afraid I'm right also. Currently a vegan relative is having the fight of her life. Terrible when bad things happen to the good.
 

pt91

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Hogwash! Cancer is always caused by toxic overload on the liver leading to DNA injury in liver or remote sites. Eat organic, eliminate as many chemicals from your environment as you can, and your good to go!

Where did you get this information? Pls post the studies that this is based on. This type of statement just blows me away as a caregiver to someone who has stage IV cancer.
 

cbrite

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hippiebrian

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The cancer risks for smokless tobacco (including dip, snus and leaf chew) have been grossly overstated. Here's some facts:

FAQ: Health Effects (tobaccoharmreduction.org)

Then there is the relatively low rate of oral cancer to begin with (less than 1% of the population) and 75% of oral cancer is caused by smoking, leaving .25% of the population who doesn't smoke. Really, worry more about your drive to and from work which is far more likely to kill you.
 

hippiebrian

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.25% seemed high so I did a little research, and the incidence is much smaller:
Oral Cancer Incidence (New Cases) by Age, Race, and Gender

Now seeing as 75% of those cases are caused by cigarette smoking, you can figure your chances of getting it from vaping is pretty darn low, and if your worry is that it is comparable to the rates of smokeless tobacco users is correct, you have very little to worry about.

Relax and enjoy.
 
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