Should ecf encourage vaping among neversmokers?
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Can't speak for the ECF. But I don't tend to Encourage anyone who Doesn't Smoke to use a e-Cigarette.
So when I see Threads started by Non-Smokers, I Don't normally post in them.
So when I see Threads started by Non-Smokers, I Don't normally post in them.
That seems like a bit of a loaded question.
Slightly less loaded would be: Should ecf discourage vaping among neversmokers?
Of course, ecf doesn't do anything, so: Should ecf members discourage vaping among neversmokers?
I don't encourage, I don't discourage, if someone asks a question, I do my best to answer, if I can.
Slightly less loaded would be: Should ecf discourage vaping among neversmokers?
Of course, ecf doesn't do anything, so: Should ecf members discourage vaping among neversmokers?
I don't encourage, I don't discourage, if someone asks a question, I do my best to answer, if I can.
I'm with @Lessifer on its not what ecf should do as ecf is little more than a computer program which doesn't do anything but allow people to type in such a manner that others can see what is typed.
As a member of ecf and an individual, I'm not supportive per se of never smokers deciding to take up vaping, but if they are adults, it's not MY right to tell them how to live their lives, nor to judge them for the choices they make.
Im fairly certain that when it comes down to it, I'm the last person on earth who should be preaching to someone for their adult choices.
I do tell others what I see as facts however, when that door opens for me to share those facts.
I cannot answer your survey as that was not an option..
In general though, we have to ask ourselves what is encouragement? I'll tell any never smoker to simply vape zero nic if they want to vape.. but I don't encourage them to pick it up either..
It's not like an ex smoker who we do a huge congratulations for each non smoking milestone.. you know.. "Woot! Woot! Congratulations on three years of vaping! So happy your not smoking anymore! Yea!" That is encouragement..
It's not encouragement nor discouragement to simply answer questions and give advice on safe usage or what device might be good or what e juice vendors are good to buy from..
It just is answering an adults questions about something I have some measure of knowledge about, should I be able to answer a question or give advice.
I won't lie to anyone in order to discourage vaping..and i wont refuse to give advice.
kinda. i was expecting more black and white answers and neglected to consider grey areas and variables brought up by thoughtful respondents. i had just read the thread by lucas.
I have only introduced ECF to tobacco users (cigerate, cigar, pipe or smokeless), never non-tobacco users. Nor have I ever recommended vaping to a non-tobacco user. I see vaping as a harm reduction option to tobacco, not something to start as a non-tobacco user.
As much I as a positive vaper person, it's from an ex-tobacco user. As it may be "95% or better less harmful than tobacco" it' probably not healthy. As an ex-tobacco user, I'm okay with that. But to go from 0% harm factor (ie. not using) to a higher harm ratio, I will not promote that.
As much I as a positive vaper person, it's from an ex-tobacco user. As it may be "95% or better less harmful than tobacco" it' probably not healthy. As an ex-tobacco user, I'm okay with that. But to go from 0% harm factor (ie. not using) to a higher harm ratio, I will not promote that.
I don't think so.
We can still help those people be safe and get the experience they want without directly encouraging it.
I can't speak for anyone else or tell anyone what to do, but I simply don't think it's helpful for the forum as a whole-- which is what the question asks-- to be seen as encouraging vaping among nonsmokers when we are fighting so hard to have e-cigs recognized as a viable smoking cessation tool. IMO it's bad just as a matter of optics.
Then there's the nicotine question. Again, obviously people are going to do what they want to do and say what they want to say, but at the moment I can't see many persuasive arguments for steering a nonsmoker towards vaping with nicotine, at least to start. I can think of one or two reasons a nonsmoker might start with nicotine immediately, but they're very specific. And yeah, I know, safe as caffeine etc. But if we're a harm reduction forum, it's not reducing harm to introduce nicotine to someone who doesn't already have an addiction.
But as others have pointed out, there are gray areas, especially when people have come on saying "I want to vape so I don't start smoking." Myself, I would still recommend starting without nicotine. There is truly something to the placebo effect, not to mention satisfying the oral and manual aspects of smoking. If that person still wasn't finding their desires met, then sure, vape with nicotine if you're really going to start smoking otherwise. However, that is a pretty specific example and not really what you asked.
In short, while recognizing and agreeing that there are gray areas and gradients on this question when considering all possible situations, I think that especially if we're asking about the forum as a whole, the answer should be an unequivocal "no."
Individual situations can be handled individually.
ed: Can you link to the thread that inspired this?
We can still help those people be safe and get the experience they want without directly encouraging it.
I can't speak for anyone else or tell anyone what to do, but I simply don't think it's helpful for the forum as a whole-- which is what the question asks-- to be seen as encouraging vaping among nonsmokers when we are fighting so hard to have e-cigs recognized as a viable smoking cessation tool. IMO it's bad just as a matter of optics.
Then there's the nicotine question. Again, obviously people are going to do what they want to do and say what they want to say, but at the moment I can't see many persuasive arguments for steering a nonsmoker towards vaping with nicotine, at least to start. I can think of one or two reasons a nonsmoker might start with nicotine immediately, but they're very specific. And yeah, I know, safe as caffeine etc. But if we're a harm reduction forum, it's not reducing harm to introduce nicotine to someone who doesn't already have an addiction.
But as others have pointed out, there are gray areas, especially when people have come on saying "I want to vape so I don't start smoking." Myself, I would still recommend starting without nicotine. There is truly something to the placebo effect, not to mention satisfying the oral and manual aspects of smoking. If that person still wasn't finding their desires met, then sure, vape with nicotine if you're really going to start smoking otherwise. However, that is a pretty specific example and not really what you asked.
In short, while recognizing and agreeing that there are gray areas and gradients on this question when considering all possible situations, I think that especially if we're asking about the forum as a whole, the answer should be an unequivocal "no."
Individual situations can be handled individually.
ed: Can you link to the thread that inspired this?
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Sick and Feel Like Puking After Vaping
others explained it for him,but to me vaping is smoking cessation only.
others explained it for him,but to me vaping is smoking cessation only.
That thread teaches me that it is very unlikely that we'll ever be treated as anything other than smokers, because even vapers don't believe vaping is different.
i believe vaping is less harmful. is there another difference?
It's all about the scope. To me it's about the same as the difference between jumping from 3 feet up, and 30 feet up. Sure, you could jump from 3 feet and sprain an ankle, but it's highly unlikely. I also don't see vaping as ONLY smoking cessation. There are actually benefits to nicotine, some people find benefit to vaping with 0 nic, like keeping off snacks. There's also the whole argument of people can choose to partake in whatever activities they want as long as they're not harming others.
I didn't like it when people treated me as a second class citizen for smoking, I will never treat someone that way for vaping, whatever their reason for starting.
Yet, there is a world of difference in them, so much so in fact, we SHOULD educate those who hold the misperception that they are anything close to the same.
Curious why you say that...
I think overall in that thread there was some measure of shock that someone purchased 18mg e juice and began sub ohm vaping it (only way to take in 20ml in a shorter amount of time) who had never smoked simply because most vape shops ask the person questions to find out what nicotine level the person needs, and/or with so many choices most people ask/find out what level of nicotine is best for them - prior to buying.
Heck when I went to my local vape shop here I was hard pressed to get them to sell my mtl low wattage vaping husband who is trying to kick a 40 year long smoking habit 18mg nicotine e juice, and they didn't do so until I explained to them why it wasn't too high a mg for him.
So how this guy managed to get slip through the cracks is anyone's guess really. I was legitimately worried about him - as well as shocked.
I think most of us in that thread were feeling the same thing, can you imagine not having a tolerance and taking in that much nicotine?
It was less demonizing him for vaping, more concern.. (with the exception of the trollers)
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