Should we be concerned about this?

[manc2000]

BEIJING, China - Watermelons have been bursting by the score in eastern China after farmers gave them overdoses of growth chemicals during wet weather, creating what state media called fields of "land mines."
About 20 farmers around Danyang city in Jiangsu province were affected, losing up to 115 acres (45 hectares) of melon, China Central Television said in an investigative report.
Prices over the past year prompted many farmers to jump into the watermelon market. All of those with exploding melons apparently were first-time users of the growth accelerator forchlorfenuron, though it has been widely available for some time, CCTV said.
Chinese regulations don't forbid the drug, and it is allowed in the U.S. on kiwi fruit and grapes. But the report underscores how farmers in China are abusing both legal and illegal chemicals, with many farms misusing pesticides and fertilizers.
Wang Liangju, a professor with College of Horticulture at Nanjing Agricultural University who has been to Danyang since the problems began to occur, said that forchlorfenuron is safe and effective when used properly.
He told The Associated Press that the drug had been used too late into the season, and that recent heavy rain also raised the risk of the fruit cracking open. But he said the variety of melon also played a role.
"If it had been used on very young fruit, it wouldn't be a problem," Wang said. "Another reason is that the melon they were planting is a thin-rind variety and these kind are actually nicknamed the 'exploding melon' because they tend to split."
Farmer Liu Mingsuo ended up with eight acres (three hectares) of ruined fruit and told CCTV that seeing his crop splitting open was like a knife cutting his heart.
"On May 7, I came out and counted 80 (burst watermelons) but by the afternoon it was 100," Liu said. "Two days later I didn't bother to count anymore."
Intact watermelons were being sold at a wholesale market in nearby Shanghai, the report said, but even those ones showed telltale signs of forchlorfenuron use: fibrous, misshapen fruit with mostly white instead of black seeds.
In March last year, Chinese authorities found that "yard-long" beans from the southern city of Sanya had been treated with the banned pesticide isocarbophos. The tainted beans turned up in several provinces, and the central city of Wuhan announced it destroyed 3.5 tons of the vegetable.
The government also has voiced alarm over the widespread overuse of food additives like dyes and sweeteners that retailers hope will make food more attractive and boost sales.
Though Chinese media remain under strict government control, domestic coverage of food safety scandals has become more aggressive in recent months, an apparent sign that the government has realized it needs help policing the troubled food industry.
The CCTV report on watermelons quoted Feng Shuangqing, a professor at the China Agricultural University, as saying the problem showed that China needs to clarify its farm chemical standards and supervision to protect consumer health.
The broadcaster described the watermelons as "land mines" and said they were exploding by the acre (hectare) in the Danyang area.
Many of farmers resorted to chopping up the fruit and feeding it to fish and pigs, the report said.

 

[manc2000]

This was what caught my eye.

Chinese regulations don't forbid the drug, and it is allowed in the U.S. on kiwi fruit and grapes. But the report underscores how farmers in China are abusing both legal and illegal chemicals, with many farms misusing pesticides and fertilizers.

 

[dordas23]

I try to stay away from Chinese food, pet food, and cosmetics. You just don't know what you might get from them. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff (like vitamin pills) is made there, and you can't always tell where a product comes from.

 

[manc2000]

I try to stay away from Chinese food, pet food, and cosmetics. You just don't know what you might get from them. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff (like vitamin pills) is made there, and you can't always tell where a product comes from.

That's true, I guess just about everything comes from there nowadays. I don't know whether we should be concerned about the flavored ejuices or not.
BTW, hope you had the Derby winner. I know I didn't. lol.

 

[smokum]

I can not find ANY concerns or warnings with the use of KT-30 (forchlorfenuron) anywhere.

 

[jlarsen]

The only people that aren't wary of anything that comes out of China has either spent the past 10 years living under a rock, or is ignorant and stubborn, IMO.

Yes, most of our equipment (vaping) comes from China, and so does MOST (but not all) of the extracted nicotine, and there is next to nothing we can do about that, as even the most reputable U.S. companies get those products which are not manufactured here, from China. However, also IMO, it is foolish to vape non USA mixed liquids that don't use USP grade PG/VG.

Dekang supposedly has a state of the art manufacturing facility, and a reputation for using quality, standardized ingredients, and while that is probably be true, few if any U.S. vendors can offer proof, or even claim that their "dekang" Chinese liquids come from that one trusted Chinese facility/manufacturer, and I have yet to see any proof that Dekang even sells their liquid to U.S. vendors. They do not list a U.S. distributor on their website, and do not reply to email inquiries. So where the U.S. vendors that do claim to be offering authentic Dekang liquid get it from is a mystery, it would seem they would have to be purchasing it from some third party in a country that Dekang exports to. "Dekang" has become slang for virtually any ejuice of Chinese or unknown origin.

While it is possible that a U.S. juicemaker could be using unapproved Chinese PG/VG to cut costs, it would make little sense that they would, as approved USP grade PG/VG are available for little cost virtually anywhere in the U.S.

Some people are convinced that because there is a youtube video of Chinese ejuice being mixed in a state-of-the art cleanroom, that anything labelled as "dekang" on a vendors website is automatically superior to anything made in the U.S.

I personally am less concerned about a speck of dust getting into my ejuice bottle because a U.S. juicemaker didn't spend $250,000 on a cleanroom, than I am about a Chinese vendor that does have a cleanroom, but is able to sell dirt cheap juice because they are cutting corners and using unapproved PG/VG in their product, even if they aren't knowingly using DEG to cut corners and have the best intentions to use quality PG/VG, their raw materials supplier (almost certainly Chinese in origin) could be.

100 dead Panamanians and their grieving families would probably agree with me. They lost their lives when brushing their teeth with toothpaste made with what was supposed to be VG, when a crooked Chinese company substituted DEG re-labelled as VG, knowingly, to cut costs.

We're already taking enough risk that our atomizers (made in China) could be contaminated with lead, as so many children's toys made in China have been, or that the 100mg/ml nicotine extract that most juicemakers use could inadvertently be cut with DEG instead of PG by a corrupt Chinese company - why take the extra risk that comes when juices are made with non USP grade PG/VG, especially when USP grade ingredients are available at most drug stores, and even WalMart?

Yes, premium ejuice such as Halo or Johnson Creek might cost 3 times as much as "dekang" shipped directly from China. But, even companies that sell both U.S. and Chinese juices offer lines of U.S. juices (good, but not exactly premium) for the same price, or pennies more than their Chinese products.

Dead pets in the U.S., leaded children's toys, toxic drywall, dead Panamanians, brain damaged U.S. toddlers that ingested date-rape drugs when playing with Chinese made Aquadots, and dead Asian infants that drank toxic Chinese baby formula - China's reputation for putting other people's lives at risk to save a few pennies is legendary, and all that in just the past few years.

If Dekang wants to gain a little more support from U.S. vapers, then why won't they list their U.S. importer/exporter on their website when their connection to every other country they export to is listed, and why do they ignore every email inquiry about who their U.S. exporter is? Until then, I'll assume that even if Dekang has the most sophisticated facilities, and the highest quality ejuice in the world, that anything labelled "dekang" on even a trusted U.S. supplier's site, is mixed with unapproved ingredients in some Chinese kitchen, next to a pot of boiling chicken heads.

 

[mwa102464]

The only people that aren't wary of anything that comes out of China has either spent the past 10 years living under a rock, or is ignorant and stubborn, IMO.

Yes, most of our equipment (vaping) comes from China, and so does MOST (but not all) of the extracted nicotine, and there is next to nothing we can do about that, as even the most reputable U.S. companies get those products which are not manufactured here, from China. However, also IMO, it is foolish to vape non USA mixed liquids that don't use USP grade PG/VG.

Dekang supposedly has a state of the art manufacturing facility, and a reputation for using quality, standardized ingredients, and while that is probably be true, few if any U.S. vendors can offer proof, or even claim that their "dekang" Chinese liquids come from that one trusted Chinese facility/manufacturer, and I have yet to see any proof that Dekang even sells their liquid to U.S. vendors. They do not list a U.S. distributor on their website, and do not reply to email inquiries. So where the U.S. vendors that do claim to be offering authentic Dekang liquid get it from is a mystery, it would seem they would have to be purchasing it from some third party in a country that Dekang exports to. "Dekang" has become slang for virtually any ejuice of Chinese or unknown origin.

While it is possible that a U.S. juicemaker could be using unapproved Chinese PG/VG to cut costs, it would make little sense that they would, as approved USP grade PG/VG are available for little cost virtually anywhere in the U.S.

Some people are convinced that because there is a youtube video of Chinese ejuice being mixed in a state-of-the art cleanroom, that anything labelled as "dekang" on a vendors website is automatically superior to anything made in the U.S.

I personally am less concerned about a speck of dust getting into my ejuice bottle because a U.S. juicemaker didn't spend $250,000 on a cleanroom, than I am about a Chinese vendor that does have a cleanroom, but is able to sell dirt cheap juice because they are cutting corners and using unapproved PG/VG in their product, even if they aren't knowingly using DEG to cut corners and have the best intentions to use quality PG/VG, their raw materials supplier (almost certainly Chinese in origin) could be.

100 dead Panamanians and their grieving families would probably agree with me. They lost their lives when brushing their teeth with toothpaste made with what was supposed to be VG, when a crooked Chinese company substituted DEG re-labelled as VG, knowingly, to cut costs.

We're already taking enough risk that our atomizers (made in China) could be contaminated with lead, as so many children's toys made in China have been, or that the 100mg/ml nicotine extract that most juicemakers use could inadvertently be cut with DEG instead of PG by a corrupt Chinese company - why take the extra risk that comes when juices are made with non USP grade PG/VG, especially when USP grade ingredients are available at most drug stores, and even WalMart?

Yes, premium ejuice such as Halo or Johnson Creek might cost 3 times as much as "dekang" shipped directly from China. But, even companies that sell both U.S. and Chinese juices offer lines of U.S. juices (good, but not exactly premium) for the same price, or pennies more than their Chinese products.

Dead pets in the U.S., leaded children's toys, toxic drywall, dead Panamanians, brain damaged U.S. toddlers that ingested date-rape drugs when playing with Chinese made Aquadots, and dead Asian infants that drank toxic Chinese baby formula - China's reputation for putting other people's lives at risk to save a few pennies is legendary, and all that in just the past few years.

If Dekang wants to gain a little more support from U.S. vapers, then why won't they list their U.S. importer/exporter on their website when their connection to every other country they export to is listed, and why do they ignore every email inquiry about who their U.S. exporter is? Until then, I'll assume that even if Dekang has the most sophisticated facilities, and the highest quality ejuice in the world, that anything labelled "dekang" on even a trusted U.S. supplier's site, is mixed with unapproved ingredients in some Chinese kitchen, next to a pot of boiling chicken heads.

Excellent post jlarson, we are getting so much .... thrown at us all from the Chinese it is crazy and more comes in everyday, they are also throwing so many new ecig products at us along with there juice one must be extra careful these days and many don't even think about this, people need to open up there eyes and be a little bit more careful on exactly the products there using

 

[Danesnpits]

Do you guys remember back in March of 2007 when Menu foods had to recall dozens and dozens of pet foods, because China had a sale on rice, so alot of the big companys like Eukaneuba, Iams, Nutro, just to name a few, bought the rice in China to mix in with their dog and cat foods. Animals died, because China decided to use rat poison. How sad. And to think, I have been to China before, where my father and I set up feeding programs for their huge dairy farms through the Canadian Alfalfa dehy association. Lord! This is some scary .....!

 

[BuzzKilla]

the exploding watermelons dont concern me... i have worked at a grocery store, and have seen and heard watermelons literally pop... leave one on the shelf long enough and it will do it on its own...

does anyone actually believe the media anymore, all the slander on e-cigs should have opened our eyes by now. for whatever reason, there is always a hidden agenda behind media reports.

how about not trusting fruit from ANY source.... shop at local farmers markets instead of big label stores. support the locals! a farmer in North America is just as likely to ilegally spray their crops as much as a farmer from overseas, AND STILL LABEL IT ORGANIC.... how would we know?

 

[Chime]

Do you guys remember back in March of 2007 when Menu foods had to recall dozens and dozens of pet foods, because China had a sale on rice, so alot of the big companys like Eukaneuba, Iams, Nutro, just to name a few, bought the rice in China to mix in with their dog and cat foods. Animals died, because China decided to use rat poison. How sad. And to think, I have been to China before, where my father and I set up feeding programs for their huge dairy farms through the Canadian Alfalfa dehy association. Lord! This is some scary .....!

It wasn't rat poison it was melamine, and there was a couple of companies in the states doing the same thing round the same time.

It's often added to feed to buff the protien value.

I work with the stuff in a roundabout way (in the form of paneling) oddly enough the MSDS says there's nothin really to worry bout (although it does state that the ld50 is like 15kg I think if I ate 15kg of anything tho i'd most likely keel over)

 

[Danesnpits]

It was rat poison..trust me on that. I have been managing huge petstores for 5 years. Petland and Petcetera's. It was rat poison. Melamin was also found in trace amounts.

 

[Chime]

Just to be safe I still advise my customers not to feed their pets our shelving units.

 

[Danesnpits]

I just get dad to shoot deer and elk, and buy from Canadian made food sources. Royal Canin was not on the list, nor was Horizon, which is Saskatchewan made dog food. I lost a dog, my beautiful show quality great dane, during that issue. He just dropped dead on me, had been drinking alot of water, possibly kidney failure from...hmmm...rat poison? Your guess is as good as mine.. I didn't necropsy. Menu foods refused to make it public. They new about it back in December of 2006 and my dog died March 3rd of 2007, and the memo came out to all petstores March 16th of 2007..They hid it for months those buggers!

 

[AlbertaClipper]

I can't get past the mental image of fields of watermelons blowing up like landmines.

 

[jlarsen]

It wasn't rat poison it was melamine, and there was a couple of companies in the states doing the same thing round the same time.

It's often added to feed to buff the protien value.

I work with the stuff in a roundabout way (in the form of paneling) oddly enough the MSDS says there's nothin really to worry bout (although it does state that the ld50 is like 15kg I think if I ate 15kg of anything tho i'd most likely keel over)

The few U.S. companies whose petfood products tested positive for Melamine were found to have trace amounts of it, orders of magnitude below what was found in the Chinese products that were killing pets.

I believe, that melamine is legal (at least in China, and maybe the U.S.) to add to livestock feed to buff the protein value, but if my memory is correct, it is not legal to add it to pet food (in the U.S. for sure), or to human food. Why it is legal or safe to poison livestock but not pets is beyond me. Because it is used in livestock feed, or maybe because of some extraction process of another product that leads to melamine as an impurity (can't remember which), melamine is sometimes found in trace amounts in pet foods, even in the U.S. where it is more highly regulated - the Chinese were deliberately using it for rice grown to be used in pet food, and I think in some cases adding it directly to pet food to boost protein value, it was showing up in very high quantities.

The ld50 is about 3grams/kg - but the problem with pets is that combined with other substances in pet food, and because of chronic toxicity, it lead to renal failure in pets. A 220 lb adult human could ingest 300 grams in a single dose, and survive 50% of the time. But even if a much lower dose was taken regularly, over a longer period of time it could cause death and/or severe kidney problems.

It was also melamine in baby formula that was killing infants in China and other asian countries the year after the pet deaths.

I'm not one of those people that pays more for ANY U.S. made product over ANY chinese product. If a chinese pencil is 9 cents and a U.S. pencil is 10 cents, I'll buy the chinese pencil. But I don't put pencils in my lungs or stomach. I'd prefer not to ingest poisonous chinese products when I have the option to avoid them.

 

[jlarsen]

It was rat poison..trust me on that. I have been managing huge petstores for 5 years. Petland and Petcetera's. It was rat poison. Melamin was also found in trace amounts.

The bulk of the deaths were due to renal failure from high concentrations of melamine combined with cyanuric acid, which lead to fatal renal failure, mostly in cats.

There were some pet death cases around the same time that were blamed on pet food that had been tainted with rat poison as well, I think some of those cases did pan out to be rat poison, but I don't think that most of the deaths were caused by rat poison.

Either way, the Chinese can't keep poison and food separate, especially if it means increased costs.

 

[kanadiankat]

... If Dekang wants to gain a little more support from U.S. vapers, then why won't they list their U.S. importer/exporter on their website when their connection to every other country they export to is listed, and why do they ignore every email inquiry about who their U.S. exporter is? Until then, I'll assume that even if Dekang has the most sophisticated facilities, and the highest quality ejuice in the world, that anything labelled "dekang" on even a trusted U.S. supplier's site, is mixed with unapproved ingredients in some Chinese kitchen, next to a pot of boiling chicken heads.

DeKang liquids have an imprint on the lids of their bottles. YNDK. It's printed on the rim of the lid. You have to hold it up to the light to see.

 

[jlarsen]

DeKang liquids have an imprint on the lids of their bottles. YNDK. It's printed on the rim of the lid. You have to hold it up to the light to see.

Good to know.

Which vendors actually sell Dekang, and not just "dekang?"

If what I've heard about Dekang's facilities and reputation is true, I might try their juices. But I'm not going to just order "chinese juice" from any site, no matter the reputation of the site, unless I know it is actual Dekang.

And I just noticed you are a Registered Supplier, so I'm assuming you sell Dekang?

Ship to U.S.?

 

[Danesnpits]

I don't think Kat can answer that on the list. I think that would be against ecf rules..but I bet a pm will be in order!

 

[kanadiankat]

The bulk of the deaths were due to renal failure from high concentrations of melamine combined with cyanuric acid, which lead to fatal renal failure, mostly in cats.

There were some pet death cases around the same time that were blamed on pet food that had been tainted with rat poison as well, I think some of those cases did pan out to be rat poison, but I don't think that most of the deaths were caused by rat poison.

Either way, the Chinese can't keep poison and food separate, especially if it means increased costs.

As a pet owner I remember very well that entire debacle. My local pet store owner started making his own mixes (they were pretty good too). Baby food formula deaths though, have come from several countries - including Germany. So China is not the only guilty one in that industry.

It has created a lot of political tension and mistrust - worldwide - against Chinese products. It was also one of the FDA's first arguements against ecigs.

Ecigs were invented in China (actually Hong Kong originally) and businesses there hold all the patents on the main products. This was an unusual turn from where China was mainly mass manufacturing what is designed and created in other countries - to having a true national product. So it is a source of national pride.

There are a few companies from the US who have tried to patent ecigs (including a tobacco company) but (as far as I know) none have succeeded. The original patents hold.

Eliquid, however, is a different story. It's main ingredients have already been in markets for decades (PG, VG, flavoring). When the FDA ran tests on eliquids - both Chinese and US based - they failed to find anything dangerous (and subsequently got their butts kicked in court).

At the moment - the majority of nicotine liquid as a raw material is produced in India and sold to manufacturers around the world - for all nicotine uses - eliquid being just one. I've heard that nic liquid is also created in the US though and I think it's fair to assume that pharma companies also derive nicotine locally.

Manufacturers will seldom disclose the sources of their raw materials. They may disclose the region where the materials were produced - but generally to their wholesalers only and for marketing purposes. It's as easy as trying to discover as the origin of all the ingredients in processed food... go figure!