Sick of the hysteria

[jexmex]

Ok, I know I am new and all, but please hear me out...


Many people on here sound like government conspirators! THEY ARE GOING TO BAN E-CIGS! STOCK UP NOW! FDA IS SPREADING PROPAGANDA!

Firstly, the chance of a ban anytime soon is very small. Why?

1.) Government takes forever to do anything, including banning a product. (Look at the alternative weed, forget the name of it)

2.) Its obvious you will still be able to get e-cig supplies from some places, it would just be harder.

Second, is the FDA spreading propaganda? Well coming from the FDA process, and who they answer for yes and no.

1.) The FDA is a testing body, it tests the safety of products. If a product has not been tested safe, by its means, it considers it potentially harmful. Until all the tests get done, the way the FDA wants them done, it will continue to see things this way. It is also required to release information when it becomes clear and concrete. Maybe this has some reason to do why the FDA's report on e-cigs did not get released sooner. They are not really looking at are they safer than a or b, but rather they are safe. The argument of if its acceptable for whatever risk could happen will probably come at a later time, when more things become clear.

2.) The FDA is government agency, and while the government is suppose to work for us, us is a wide variety of people that includes, general non e-cig users, non smoking advacotes, and of course the people who are in charge of firing the directer (Mr Prez).

While I do not fully believe that the full decision or direction of the FDA has been set my big tobacco, I think there are a lot of people (senators, governers, congressman, etc), that are weighing on the FDA's back about taxes. While the reason for the taxes are supposibly health costs, they have not made any real effort into helping smokers really quit, with a real quit smoking consuling program. Big tobacco is also big jobs, and big money for economy, so I am sure thats playing into it all as well.

Basically, please people quit jumping to conclusions with no evidence to back it up. E-cigs will not be banned this year, because its a government agency, and when the truth comes out about e-cigs, opinions will change quickly.

We need the manufactors to step up and provide evidence in the manner that the FDA wants, for it to be viable. That means THE FDA's WAY! I don't know or care what it is, because I am not in the need for that information, as I do not manufactor anything, but e-cig manufacters need to know.

Sorry if this went too long, or off direction, but I just started typing and it all came out.

 

[wezzie]

Go to e-cigarette news and look at the thread labeled "One US distributor down ".

I think there may be a reason for the hysteria. We are stocking up to ensure we can continue to fulfill our addictive needs (a safer method). Now we have additional concerns/rage…we are concerned for the suppliers whose livelihoods are being threatened by the seizures.

While I appreciate your how you feel, I would rather be prepared for the worse possible scenario. If there is no ban, good grief, my stocked up supplies will not go to waste! If a ban does ever occurs, I will be a very happy vaper…and vaping for months ….although… worried for the ones who built their homes with sticks and straws instead of bricks...and those vapers who can not possibly afford to stock up...ah, need food 1st.

Dang it, I can’t remember my cell phone #, but can remember those childhood--lesson teaching – stories! Oh, for an unfortunate few…the sky is falling and I am sad for that.

 

[kinabaloo]

Sadly, that's a naive view jexmex.

Look at what the recent FDA test actually found (leaving aside what what not disclosed) and how it was then spun, by them. If anyone was clinging to the idea that the FDA is unbased and plays by the rules, and good sense prevails, it surely should have gone up in smoke that day of the announcements.

Nobody would be against quality monitoring, but there's no real reason for a ban and years of testing - it's just a bigger game in which ordinary folk are the victims. This is not really some new drug, it's just nicotine in a base of PG.

 

[jexmex]

I don't believe its a naive view, its more of a realistic view from my perspective.

I am not saying to not stock up, by all means if you have the means stock up, it cannot hurt, but spending more than you can afford to stock up is, imo, a bad and unneeded move.

I could be wrong, it would not be the first time. But IMO a ban is probably no less than a year away if its going to happen.

 

[Mingolvr]

Think it will take a year? Don't think so...they are already confiscating shipments of products that are NOT YET illegal. Suppliers are suffering, losing money and closing up shop.

If they decide to ban, it will take one day. Period. They will announce it and it will be done, just like some drugs. Off the shelves and gone overnight.

I'm afraid you need to read a bit more jexmex. There are a LOT of things the fda is already doing to cut our supply off.

 

[Taylor]

It was spun for sure, they called a few parts per billion less than 1% instead of less than .000001.

 

[jexmex]

No, it will not take a day, get real, this is the government, masters of procrastination, and until they are proven to be death traps, then there will be no immediate ban. More importantly, FDA has no approval yet to ban them. Not sure who really is in charge of that atm, right now FDA is evaluating them, but has no real control over them, from what I have read here on these boards.

 

[DC2]

No, it will not take a day, get real, this is the government, masters of procrastination, and until they are proven to be death traps, then there will be no immediate ban. More importantly, FDA has no approval yet to ban them. Not sure who really is in charge of that atm, right now FDA is evaluating them, but has no real control over them, from what I have read here on these boards.

Have you read the thread about the court case of Smoking Everywhere vs the FDA?
The decision will be handed down quite soon now.

And if it legitimizes the FDA seizing product, then USA suppliers will have some serious issues.
And if Paypal and the credit card companies stop allowing transactions, then there you go.

I stopped gambling because they made it almost impossible for me to fund my account.
And they can do it as quickly as they feel like.

 

[NY JETS]

Go to e-cigarette news and look at the thread labeled "One US distributor down ".

I think there may be a reason for the hysteria. We are stocking up to ensure we can continue to fulfill our addictive needs (a safer method). Now we have additional concerns/rage…we are concerned for the suppliers whose livelihoods are being threatened by the seizures.

While I appreciate your how you feel, I would rather be prepared for the worse possible scenario. If there is no ban, good grief, my stocked up supplies will not go to waste! If a ban does ever occurs, I will be a very happy vaper…and vaping for months ….although… worried for the ones who built their homes with sticks and straws instead of bricks...and those vapers who can not possibly afford to stock up...ah, need food 1st.

Dang it, I can’t remember my cell phone #, but can remember those childhood--lesson teaching – stories! Oh, for an unfortunate few…the sky is falling and I am sad for that.

There are optimists and pessimists. Just because one supplier is closing up shop doesn't really mean anything. I am a vendor and I am not telling people to stock up or raising my prices or panicking in any way. I too am getting flabergasted with logging on here and seeing one end-of-the-world thread after another. There should be more threads about helping new vapers, innovating ideas, and talk that is inviting to spread the word. Once you as a customer have trouble getting your vaping products at a fair price then let's start with the good-grief posts.

 

[KreeL]

Jexmex is absolutely correct.

These continuous dumfounded threads about an imminent ban are totally naive. They are going hand in hand with the Big Tobacco agenda of propaganda and fear tactics.

In reality the FDA's hands are tied. Sure they are being pressured, but they don't have grounds to ban e-cigs. Like jexmex says, they must prove e-cigs dangerous to the population at large, or at least as dangerous as other nicotine related products. As we now know, they cannot do this. They tried and failed.

My advice to all is not to spread rumors or fearmongering. Do not keep calling publically for product testing or regulations. Use your energies to convert more smokers to vaping and save lives. THAT is what you can do to help. We need smokers to switch from tobacco to ecigs in massive waves. How can a smoker who reads all this hysteria justify to himself/herself to try ecigs now? So please do your part and stop with the hoopla. It does more harm than good.

 

[DC2]

I must have missed something, but I could have sworn the FDA is already seizing shipments.
And it seems there is a court case underway to determine if they can keep doing that.

Maybe "ban" is not the right word, but you can pick another if you like.

My understanding is that the court decision should be coming down within the next two weeks.
So yeah, I hope you're right, and then in two weeks we can all go back to our happy place.

 

[wHack]

Nov 8, 1990 the FDA banned over the counter sales of GHB. The next day GNC's and other health stores all over the country were raided the employees didn't even realize the products had been banned in most cases. 1 Day...

 

[jexmex]

Well not sure how they get away with seizing shipments, but I think thats a major abuse of powers, and should be addressed. The government only gets away with things that we the people allow it to. The problem is, many of the people are sitting on the computer writing conspiracy articles, rather than demanding accountability.

Lets face it, politicians are politicians, but they still have limits they cannot bypass. Well at least not legally or easily.

 

[Chief-A-Lot]

You make several valid points no doubt, however, taking such a nonchalant approach to what is going on with the FDA announcements and findings would not be the best way to approach this issue. The other day my girl friend went for her annual checkup and proudly announced to her doctor that she stopped smoking and started vapping. The doctor’s response was “OMG… stop that right away! The FDA found toxins in those… I would much rather see you smoke a cigarette then do that!” My point… People who are uneducated in matters (whatever they maybe) cling tight to the media and what “Health Officials” say…
I do agree with some of your views about things taking time to get done in this country, and with the size of it, it is understandable. The FDA played their cards very well and chose their wording very carefully before they made their “statement “on their finding of e-cigarettes. NEVER underestimate big business powers that be.
I for one flat out refuse to go back to analogs. Whether or not vapping is 100% safe or not, I know how I feel compared to how I felt when I was on analogs. I KNOW for a fact cigarettes KILL end of discussion! It sickens me that someone tells me what I can and can’t put in my body and that’s how I feel about the matter. Allowing me to put a definitive deadly substance in my body with no worries, but putting the squeeze on people trying to better their chances of longevity through an alternate means of an addiction they THEY allow and deem legal is flat out ^%%# up!
In closing, you using the word “Hysteria” is a tad dramatic. I really see no Hysterical actions on any of the posts… What I do see are people that are educated, comfortable and dedicated to the new life style they chose, and don’t want to let some $!#*%$# jackass in a suit taking that away from them. So as people that educated themselves in and about the vapping lifestyle, they are just CONCERNED and want to continue what they believe is making a better choice… CHOICE being the key word that is under scrutiny.
No disrespect to anyone’s views on the issue, just my two cents.

 

[jexmex]

Nov 8, 1990 the FDA banned over the counter sales of GHB. The next day GNC's and other health stores all over the country were raided the employees didn't even realize the products had been banned in most cases. 1 Day...

gamma-Hydroxybutyric acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

GHB, is nowhere near in the same category as e-cigs, so please dont pretend that a drug used for date rape, and in general just getting high is in the same category.

 

[jexmex]

All very good points being brought up.

I do believe there is cause to be alarmed to a certain degree, please dont think I dont.

In general people are stupid, and just go by what they have heard from sally next door who heard it from henry at the grocery store, who heard it from FOX NEWS, lol.

But, that is why we need a e-cig organization that is proactive, and from what I have seen of ECA, it is not. We need representation.

But, still, anything that could get people to quit smoking will not be axed, at least not right away, because everybody knows the dangers of smoking analogs, and if this just went away, people would ask questions. AND I HAVE THE UPMOST CONFIDENCE IN MY GOVERNMENT TO KNOW EVERYTHING THING TAKES LONGER THEN IT SHOULD, SO A BAN IS NOT IMMEDIATE IMO.

Like I have said before, just my thoughts, and thats all. I respect everybody's opinions and thoughts, but I just feel like some of you act as though doomsday is tomorrow, but I guarantee its not. (Maybe guarantee is to strong of a word, but thats what I am going to use)

 

[wHack]

They get away with siezing shipments by claiming that e-cigs are a drug/device combination used to treat the illness of nicotine addiction, and therefore fall under thier jurisdiction. Since they have not approved these drug/device combinations for the treatment of said illness they are not legal and they can prevent them from entering the country. For that matter they could walk in and sieze inventory from US suppliers right now if they so chose using this same argument. However this is being contested in court by NJOY and Smoking Everywhere ( at least SE is good for something ). If the court finds the FDA is correct and has jurisdiction then there will even be legal precident behind further such actions. And as I stated above it's not out of thier ability or the scope of thier previous endeavors to do such a thing in as little time as 1 day.

 

[DC2]

Edited to nothing since I can't delete my own posts...

 

[wHack]

I do not wish to draw any further parallels between the 1990 ban and the possibility of an e-cigs ban of this forum, but the point was that they can succesfully ban something in a day, they likely won't but it's easy enough for them to do.

 

[jexmex]

Well I want everybody know know, I am not trying to step on any persons opinions, and I am by no means a expert. I wanted to kinda swing the view another way. Hell, I will not be beyond stocking up myself, because while I believe the government takes forever to do anything, they also have in the past dont things ways that they should not have done them.

But I also believe some people really do need to stop and breath, and think about what the actual change of a ban tomorrow, or even next week is. IMO its pretty low, low enough in fact, I think we should all be a little bit calmer, while trying to pass the real information on.

But we also have to look at how the industry has handled themselves, and realize that it has not been in a professional consistent manner, that the FDA would consider to be proper.

Why were these issues not handled from the git go? Why did the manufacturers wait to do anything?

Do you think that the makers of Nicertte just started marketing there product? NO, they went through the process, the government works on processes, and policies, and when people or companies bypass them, it never ends up with good reaction. I believe in the end, e-cigs will prevail, and life will be good. But for now, things are stressful because of the way the industry handled itself, and now the FDA is in attack mode because of that.

Sorry, been drinking so I am ranting, lol. usually happens after the 3rd or 4th brew, and from there just gets more and more, slowly loosing meaning.