Sweetners

[thatrandy]

I have a few questions about sweetner...
1- Is using some type of sweetener absolutely necessary for "sweet" flavors like bubblegum? or will they taste fine without it?
2- What is generally recoginzed as the best sweetener? Ethyl Maltol is the only one ive heard of

 

[Boletus]

Many of the flavorings you find will already contain sweetener(s) and may be quite sweet by themselves, perhaps even too much for some tastes. Other people here know more about the additives than I.

 

[fogging_katrider]

EM isnt really a sweetener. Its more useful to take sharp edge off some flavors and can help flavor mixes to play nice together.
Ime, more than 2% depending on what your adding it to can also flat out kill an otherwise decent mix...dulling and muting the flavor way too much.

A lot of people use sucralose. TFA Sweetener is sucralose in pg & water. I dont like to use more than 1.5% because I can taste it at that and higher levels. It works the trick though at 0.5 to 1% most of the time. Sometimes you can impart sweetness to your mix by using other very sweet fruit flavors in your fruit flavors. For example TFA pineapple (strong stuff) just a drop per 10ml mix can really add sweetness and pop to a lot of fruits without blowing out the intended primary fruit flavor in the mix. TFA Raspberry (also strong stuff) pops and sweetens watermelon and some berries like strawberry a lot with a drop per 20ml mix.

Your milage may vary.

hth

 

[Raztax]

I'm curious as well. I've been using EM but have read of people using stevia. I'm wondering if any of the stevia I see at the grocery store can be used.

 

[Boletus]

I'm curious as well. I've been using EM but have read of people using stevia. I'm wondering if any of the stevia I see at the grocery store can be used.

Many of the stevia products contain additives that are not good for vaping, such as small amounts of sugars and anti-caking agents, but there is at least one that seems OK by other people's opinions. Here are some threads with some info for that.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/587878-stevia-base-vg-water-sweetener.html
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/616699-diy-question-about-sweetner.html
[edit] Posted wrong thread initially.

 

[thatrandy]

I'm curious as well. I've been using EM but have read of people using stevia. I'm wondering if any of the stevia I see at the grocery store can be used.

I've heard there are some sites that sell pure stevia extract NuNaturals Pure Liquid™ Clear Stevia™ heres an example I found.... the listed ingrediants seem good from a glance, idk though, more research is needed for sure. Here's The Label

 

[AndriaD]

I've been using sucralose with very good results; I like the taste, it tastes "sweet like sugar" to me -- even the dietary kind you use in food/drink. But I've found a recipe I really like which calls for stevia instead, which I don't have, and have no interest in getting, and I'm wondering how stevia compares to sucralose in pure sweetness? Could I do a 1-to-1 substitution with my sucralose?

Thx!
Andria

 

[Alien Traveler]

I've heard there are some sites that sell pure stevia extract NuNaturals Pure Liquid™ Clear Stevia™ heres an example I found.... the listed ingrediants seem good from a glance, idk though, more research is needed for sure. Here's The Label

I hate taste of stevia, it has a nasty aftertaste for me. I prefer sucralose (as in splenda). Sweeteners stevia and splenda sold in food stores have a lot of filler - they consists of 95%+ of glucose (which will ruin coils in no time). I have bought pure sucralose from Amazon. Additional benefit: it can be used as a real zero calories sweetener in a kitchen.

 

[Alien Traveler]

I've been using sucralose with very good results; I like the taste, it tastes "sweet like sugar" to me -- even the dietary kind you use in food/drink. But I've found a recipe I really like which calls for stevia instead, which I don't have, and have no interest in getting, and I'm wondering how stevia compares to sucralose in pure sweetness? Could I do a 1-to-1 substitution with my sucralose?

Thx!
Andria

Stevia: up to 150 times the sweetness of sugar - Stevia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sucralose: is about 320 to 1,000 times as sweet as sucrose (table sugar) - Sucralose - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[AndriaD]

Stevia: up to 150 times the sweetness of sugar - Stevia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sucralose: is about 320 to 1,000 times as sweet as sucrose (table sugar) - Sucralose - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hmm ok, thanks for that. It sounds like I should probably use half the amount of sucralose, to achieve a similar sweetness -- even that may be sweeter than the stevia would make it, but it's ok, I like sweet a lot.

I've never tried stevia, but I tend to agree with you, most artificial sweeteners do leave a horrid aftertaste; sucralose is the first I've ever tried that didn't. The only drawback I've found with sucralose is in baking; it doesn't melt/caramelize the way that sugar does, so it tends to make baked goods too dry. I don't even like sugar from beets; if it doesn't say "pure cane sugar" on the pkg, I don't buy it, because beet sugar has an aftertaste like a mildewy basement. Ugh.

Andria

 

[Rin13]

I would start without the sweetener as it can always be added later and doesn't really require steeping. Most of the liquids I make, I have found, don't need additional sweetener. As others have said, some flavorings have their own sweetness. When I do add it, I typically do not use anymore than 1% and usually only add a couple drops.
My personal favorite sweetener is Sucralose (it's just called Sweetener by ECigExpress and I believe Wizard Labs as well)
Ethyl Maltol has a sweetening-like flavor but it's not the same. It has a flavor all of it's own on top of the sweetening effect. Some people like that flavor, some hate it and most of the time it will effect the overall flavor of whatever you're mixing with. (has a candy/cotton candy kind of flavor)
Stevia is a less common sweetener and the little I have had with it I do like but have had difficulty finding it in eliquid websites. I personally would rather buy all my ingredients from a eliquid vendor as they are more likely to be suitable for vaping. (of course it doesn't guarantee that the ingredients are vape safe but there really are no 100% guarantees where that is concerned) Plus I'd rather just pay one shipping and get everything at once.
I usually get my DIY supplies from ECigExpress or Wizard Labs. However, I will be making another order soon with a new (to me) vendor called Eliquid Mart because they have smaller bottles of both Capella and Flavour Art flavorings. I have purchased from OneStopDIY shop, MyFreedomSmokes and High Desert Vapes with no issues.

 

[AndriaD]

I would start without the sweetener as it can always be added later and doesn't really require steeping. Most of the liquids I make, I have found, don't need additional sweetener. As others have said, some flavorings have their own sweetness. When I do add it, I typically do not use anymore than 1% and usually only add a couple drops.
My personal favorite sweetener is Sucralose (it's just called Sweetener by ECigExpress and I believe Wizard Labs as well)
Ethyl Maltol has a sweetening-like flavor but it's not the same. It has a flavor all of it's own on top of the sweetening effect. Some people like that flavor, some hate it and most of the time it will effect the overall flavor of whatever you're mixing with. (has a candy/cotton candy kind of flavor)
Stevia is a less common sweetener and the little I have had with it I do like but have had difficulty finding it in eliquid websites. I personally would rather buy all my ingredients from a eliquid vendor as they are more likely to be suitable for vaping. (of course it doesn't guarantee that the ingredients are vape safe but there really are no 100% guarantees where that is concerned) Plus I'd rather just pay one shipping and get everything at once.
I usually get my DIY supplies from ECigExpress or Wizard Labs. However, I will be making another order soon with a new (to me) vendor called Eliquid Mart because they have smaller bottles of both Capella and Flavour Art flavorings. I have purchased from OneStopDIY shop, MyFreedomSmokes and High Desert Vapes with no issues.

bullcityvapor.com is excellent because they show very clearly which flavors have any diketones -- at least for the ones they know about, and they do a pretty thorough job of due diligence; I have checked a flavor one week and it showed as fine, but the very next week, they had the "caution" background up for that same flavor. Good prices too, and fast shipping -- much faster shipping than ecigexpress.

Andria

 

[Mr.Mann]

Knowing vapers, this has already been looked into, but does anyone here have any thoughts on using sugar alcohols as a sweetener? I've looked into them some and the one things that jumps out is that they "[do] not caramelize" when heated and it's apparently highly water soluble. There seem to be other advantages, but I still don't know about the application for vaping. I am one of those people that can taste artificial sweetener in very tiny amounts, and while it's not terrible, it can be very distracting to my buds. It would be nice if this, or anything else, was a good alternative.

 

[Mr.Mann]

Sugar Alcohols: American Diabetes Association®

Not sure what this means in the context of vaping, but supposedly glycerol/glycerin is considered a sugar alcohol. So maybe that means using something like Xylitol is okay? Dunno, but I sure as hell ain't saying it is -- I am just curious as this point.

 

[Alien Traveler]

Sugar Alcohols: American Diabetes Association®

Not sure what this means in the context of vaping, but supposedly glycerol/glycerin is considered a sugar alcohol. So maybe that means using something like Xylitol is okay? Dunno, but I sure as hell ain't saying it is -- I am just curious as this point.

VG is a sugar alcohol. Not too much sweetness, isn't it?
There are other things a bit sweeter (sorbitol), but still you'll need a lot of them in a juice.

 

[Mr.Mann]

...
There are other things a bit sweeter (sorbitol), but still you'll need a lot of them in a juice.

I read that xylitol can be used as a 1:1 with actual sugar (sugar and xylitol having the same rating of sweetness) and it's supposedly ~2x as sweet as sorbitol, but as you stated earlier, the sweetness of sucralose is definitely off the charts in comparison to sugar*. I generally have to dilute sucralose because of how sweet it is and it tends to adulterate the mix in tiny percentages, not just simply adding sweetness (at least to my buds).

*What is the relative sweetness of different sugars and sugar substitutes?

 

[Rin13]

Cool. Although I have always gotten my stuff from EcigExpress super quickly.

bullcityvapor.com is excellent because they show very clearly which flavors have any diketones -- at least for the ones they know about, and they do a pretty thorough job of due diligence; I have checked a flavor one week and it showed as fine, but the very next week, they had the "caution" background up for that same flavor. Good prices too, and fast shipping -- much faster shipping than ecigexpress.

Andria

 

[Rin13]

I honestly don't know but I'm not really a fan of alcohols in my ejuices. The organic vendors will sometimes use flavorings with an alcohol base and I don't like it.
Have you tried Stevia? It's not artificial... It's from a plant. I really dislike artificial sweeteners myself and I like it. It's what I use in *real* life... like in coffee, tea, etc. Open Source Vapor uses it in their juices and it's nice in there.

Knowing vapers, this has already been looked into, but does anyone here have any thoughts on using sugar alcohols as a sweetener? I've looked into them some and the one things that jumps out is that they "[do] not caramelize" when heated and it's apparently highly water soluble. There seem to be other advantages, but I still don't know about the application for vaping. I am one of those people that can taste artificial sweetener in very tiny amounts, and while it's not terrible, it can be very distracting to my buds. It would be nice if this, or anything else, was a good alternative.

 

[Mr.Mann]

I honestly don't know but I'm not really a fan of alcohols in my ejuices. The organic vendors will sometimes use flavorings with an alcohol base and I don't like it.
Have you tried Stevia? It's not artificial... It's from a plant. I really dislike artificial sweeteners myself and I like it. It's what I use in *real* life... like in coffee, tea, etc. Open Source Vapor uses it in their juices and it's nice in there.

It's weird, but it's not really like those kinds of alcohols, but I can't explain it (maybe someone else can). But, since I have tried sucralose and don't really dig it, I may try Stevia one day.

 

[AndriaD]

I read that xylitol can be used as a 1:1 with actual sugar (sugar and xylitol having the same rating of sweetness) and it's supposedly ~2x as sweet as sorbitol, but as you stated earlier, the sweetness of sucralose is definitely off the charts in comparison to sugar*. I generally have to dilute sucralose because of how sweet it is and it tends to adulterate the mix in tiny percentages, not just simply adding sweetness (at least to my buds).

*What is the relative sweetness of different sugars and sugar substitutes?

You prefer sorbitol or xylitol over sucralose? Eeewww. I never could stand that topical stuff dentists use before the novocaine shot, because of the sorbitol, it tastes NASTY. Sucralose just tastes like sugar.

Andria