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Aaaawww zoiDman...you're not a "Nob". LOL. Sorry man, couldn't resist.
Alls I know is it's not about the batteries (2 HIGH DRAIN 14500's in this case). It's to do with the switching regulator I believe. Tomzgreat did a great review on it. Not sure how to link the thread.
One of the main reasons I got the Beast was for my rebuildables.
I made a hybrid coil (ss mesh/cotton core) @ 1.8ohms. I was pushing the amp limit just to get that coil performing good with my tube mod.
The ss mesh sorta acted like a heat sink and the ability of the cotton core kept it wet, so I needed something that could really push it w/o overheating.
My tube mod, maxed out, seemed like it could get the coil going once the coil was warmed up, but by this point, the tube mod was so hot that it was only a matter of time before something failed.
Not only was the Beast able to make my hybrid coil dance, but it stayed cool doing it. I was instantly sold on the Beast at this point.
Then I tried using it under normal vaping conditions and I was surprised there as well.
I liked it so well that I gave the wife my tube mods and I plan on getting another one.
I made a hybrid coil (ss mesh/cotton core) @ 1.8ohms. I was pushing the amp limit just to get that coil performing good with my tube mod.
The ss mesh sorta acted like a heat sink and the ability of the cotton core kept it wet, so I needed something that could really push it w/o overheating.
My tube mod, maxed out, seemed like it could get the coil going once the coil was warmed up, but by this point, the tube mod was so hot that it was only a matter of time before something failed.
Not only was the Beast able to make my hybrid coil dance, but it stayed cool doing it. I was instantly sold on the Beast at this point.
Then I tried using it under normal vaping conditions and I was surprised there as well.
I liked it so well that I gave the wife my tube mods and I plan on getting another one.
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Excellent! My DID atomizer (genuine, not the rip-off version) shipped 4 days ago. I'm concerned that the Provari might have troubles pushing low res so this mod will make a nice insurance policy.
Sorry, for some reason I missed this post 
Yes the led will start to dim when the voltage is getting low.
The wheel was a little to stiff the first day or two, but it's perfect now as it's not as stiff and it's definitely not loose enough to move on it's own.
I work outside also and I don't see it being a issue.
Yes the led will start to dim when the voltage is getting low.
The wheel was a little to stiff the first day or two, but it's perfect now as it's not as stiff and it's definitely not loose enough to move on it's own.
I work outside also and I don't see it being a issue.
My problem with many (most) potentiometer adjusting wheels in VV mods (and especially those without a voltage display) is the lack of linearity. The variable resistors used are apparently very cheap.
What do I mean by lack of linearity? If the voltage is set to 3.7 and you turn the wheel about 10°, it goes up to 3.8 volts. Another 10° takes it to 4.0. But then the next 2° of arc bumps the voltage all the way up to 4.8! Even with an inline voltage display attached, these wheel-based VV pots are a pain to adjust with any sort of accuracy. Madvapes VV boxes suffer from this flaw dramatically (to the point where it's near impossible to get certain voltages---you end up under- then over-shooting what you want, even with an infinitesimally small movement of the wheel). Even my Buzz Pro and iPro suffer from this non-linearity---they have a sudden bump in the midrange where the voltage leaps from 4.5 to 5.1 in just a tiny arc of wheel movement. I even sent back my BuzzPro to get that fixed, and was told that the adjusting pot wheel "within spec." If that's true, then "spec" is pretty darned sloppy.
The only manual-adjusting VV I have that doesn't frustrate me this way is the adjustor on my VapeCore Splash VV from Shan, since the range of adjustment is spread over two full 360° turns of the screw-head (if I recall correctly). But then, that one is at least somewhat aggravating because it requires a jeweler's screwdriver to adjust, like most of the now-ancient 1st generation VV mods.
I'm not suggesting that digital is always better than analog---many audiophiles complain that digital mp3s sacrifice a little of the "aliveness" of analog recordings on vinyl or tape (I can't tell personally, but it's still a classic example), and I much prefer analog clocks to digital---but this is one case where I'd take digital every time. The .1 volt increase/decrease increment with a button push is an easier way to adjust voltage, at least in my case.
What do I mean by lack of linearity? If the voltage is set to 3.7 and you turn the wheel about 10°, it goes up to 3.8 volts. Another 10° takes it to 4.0. But then the next 2° of arc bumps the voltage all the way up to 4.8! Even with an inline voltage display attached, these wheel-based VV pots are a pain to adjust with any sort of accuracy. Madvapes VV boxes suffer from this flaw dramatically (to the point where it's near impossible to get certain voltages---you end up under- then over-shooting what you want, even with an infinitesimally small movement of the wheel). Even my Buzz Pro and iPro suffer from this non-linearity---they have a sudden bump in the midrange where the voltage leaps from 4.5 to 5.1 in just a tiny arc of wheel movement. I even sent back my BuzzPro to get that fixed, and was told that the adjusting pot wheel "within spec." If that's true, then "spec" is pretty darned sloppy.
The only manual-adjusting VV I have that doesn't frustrate me this way is the adjustor on my VapeCore Splash VV from Shan, since the range of adjustment is spread over two full 360° turns of the screw-head (if I recall correctly). But then, that one is at least somewhat aggravating because it requires a jeweler's screwdriver to adjust, like most of the now-ancient 1st generation VV mods.
I'm not suggesting that digital is always better than analog---many audiophiles complain that digital mp3s sacrifice a little of the "aliveness" of analog recordings on vinyl or tape (I can't tell personally, but it's still a classic example), and I much prefer analog clocks to digital---but this is one case where I'd take digital every time. The .1 volt increase/decrease increment with a button push is an easier way to adjust voltage, at least in my case.
My experience is not the same. I spent less than 10min getting familiar with this wheel using the inline meter so I could get good reference points.
I can now quickly adjust and easily get within .2 volts or less of my desired voltage. I have tested this several times over and I am able to repeat the numbers. So I am comfortable and I feel I have a good feel/points of reference from which I can operate.
From there I adjust it by taste and when I checked the voltage, I was exactly where I thought the voltage should be.
I have always used digital voltage displays since day one and this is my first wheel adjustment device. Given that, I thought that I would have issues also, but after use, I'm very comfortable adjusting voltage.
I can not speak of the other devices you mention Bill as I have not purchased or even tried them and therefore, I am not able to compare my experience.
It just works for me and maybe spending the time to get good reference points is the reason it's successful.
I can now quickly adjust and easily get within .2 volts or less of my desired voltage. I have tested this several times over and I am able to repeat the numbers. So I am comfortable and I feel I have a good feel/points of reference from which I can operate.
From there I adjust it by taste and when I checked the voltage, I was exactly where I thought the voltage should be.
I have always used digital voltage displays since day one and this is my first wheel adjustment device. Given that, I thought that I would have issues also, but after use, I'm very comfortable adjusting voltage.
I can not speak of the other devices you mention Bill as I have not purchased or even tried them and therefore, I am not able to compare my experience.
It just works for me and maybe spending the time to get good reference points is the reason it's successful.
Since the stationary pot of the wheel is white and the wheel has a small square indicator that sticks out over the white stationary part.
I just now decided to see if I could use a fine point sharpie and mark lines using the edge of the square on the wheel.
Perfect, now I can get repeat readings to within 0.01v.
The wheel already has a green & red line from smoktek, but now I have added a few more so it's personalized
I will probably clean off all of the marks and start over from scratch with my own now that I know it works.
I used a red fine point sharpie that I had laying here and it shows up nice on the white part and stands out when setting to the edge of the black wheel.
I still reserve the right to make small adjustments to taste though.
I just now decided to see if I could use a fine point sharpie and mark lines using the edge of the square on the wheel.
Perfect, now I can get repeat readings to within 0.01v.
The wheel already has a green & red line from smoktek, but now I have added a few more so it's personalized
I will probably clean off all of the marks and start over from scratch with my own now that I know it works.
I used a red fine point sharpie that I had laying here and it shows up nice on the white part and stands out when setting to the edge of the black wheel.
I still reserve the right to make small adjustments to taste though.
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It's a very good question.
There are two main chemistries used in Lithium Ion Technology
The first is Li-ion (Lithium-Ion) these batteries have a lower discharge rate, generally if they have protection they will cut off at 2.5Amps.
You don't want to use a unprotected one in High Amp applications or bad things can happen.
The 2nd is Limn or Lithium Manganese often called High Drain and identified with imr, these are not protected but the chemistry is more stable and they are capable of outputting the 5 or 6 amps that the Beast Might Draw.
If you are vaping within the lower to mid ranges a regular Lithium Ion is fine. But for performance you will want an IMR
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Sneak Preview:
Rob at Smoktek was nice enough to send me two of the E-Fest Batteries to test.
I'm not done my testing yet and I'm going to retest.
This is a preview and synopsis of the testing.
So Far:
The Efest is slightly longer possibly a mm or two not enough to make any sort of difference and not as long as the Trustfire.
Performance:
In regular vaping the two performed equally. I have yet to torture test the E-Fest but I suspect it will do fine.
Longetivity:
Equipment: Dual Coil 1.5Ohm Cartomizer at 4.30V vaping at 4.19 tested on the Smoktek Varicool Beast.
The batteries were run in 1 minute bursts. Don't worry I used a solution of VG and Water and didn't inhale!
Length of time:
Efest 700 Mah 18 Minutes
Aw IMR 600Mah 19 Minutes
I was surprised by the result, the E-Fest performed around 5% below the AW IMR even though the Mah level was 17% higher.
The reason why I need to do a retest is that the Aw IMR had been in use for 2-3 weeks and totally drained a few times, while the E-Fest had only been in use 3 days and never completely drained. Until a L-Ion Battery has been drained and refilled a few times it may not reach it's full potential.
Rob at Smoktek was nice enough to send me two of the E-Fest Batteries to test.
I'm not done my testing yet and I'm going to retest.
This is a preview and synopsis of the testing.
So Far:
The Efest is slightly longer possibly a mm or two not enough to make any sort of difference and not as long as the Trustfire.
Performance:
In regular vaping the two performed equally. I have yet to torture test the E-Fest but I suspect it will do fine.
Longetivity:
Equipment: Dual Coil 1.5Ohm Cartomizer at 4.30V vaping at 4.19 tested on the Smoktek Varicool Beast.
The batteries were run in 1 minute bursts. Don't worry I used a solution of VG and Water and didn't inhale!
Length of time:
Efest 700 Mah 18 Minutes
Aw IMR 600Mah 19 Minutes
I was surprised by the result, the E-Fest performed around 5% below the AW IMR even though the Mah level was 17% higher.
The reason why I need to do a retest is that the Aw IMR had been in use for 2-3 weeks and totally drained a few times, while the E-Fest had only been in use 3 days and never completely drained. Until a L-Ion Battery has been drained and refilled a few times it may not reach it's full potential.
Thanks Tom...
I'm not an Expert but have been doing some Reading about Dischage Rates and the "C" Rating.
I was somewhat surprised when one of the Batteries I use in a Mod is Rated at 2.0 Amps. And the Math says I'm drawing like 1.9 amps.
So it seemed like the Battery was working as hard as it should be Safely able to. Which did seem right. Seems like I should have some Margin on the Discharge amount the Battery can do.
The standard that I've seen has been a 2.5 Amp Discharge on non IMR Technology. The battery was a rechargeable correct?. If not than immediately cease to use it. There was a situation in Florida where a PV Exploded when the Vaper was using non Rechargeable Batteries.
All Electronics generally have a 10-15% tolerance rate built in but where batteries are concerned it isn't a good idea to push it.
Yeah. It was rechargable but I tossed that Battery anyway.
When I first got into VVPV (a cheap Box Mod) I thought that Batteries were just Batteries. That they all did the same thing and Paying more just got you something that might last longer Lifespan wise.
When I decided to get a Provari and did started to read more and more about things like Internal Resistance and Chemistry.
The one thing I would like to see more Vendors do is list Specs on Batteries isntead of just saying 18650 Battery.
My understanding from reading the Smoktek website is that the E'Fest 700mah batteries are IMR also. It would be more convenient to be able to order those rather than getting the AWs from another source. A lot to be said for the proven consistent quality of the AWs though. Looking forward to your test results tom.
Since the stationary pot of the wheel is white and the wheel has a small square indicator that sticks out over the white stationary part.
I just now decided to see if I could use a fine point sharpie and mark lines using the edge of the square on the wheel.
Perfect, now I can get repeat readings to within 0.01v.
The wheel already has a green & red line from smoktek, but now I have added a few more so it's personalized
I will probably clean off all of the marks and start over from scratch with my own now that I know it works.
I used a red fine point sharpie that I had laying here and it shows up nice on the white part and stands out when setting to the edge of the black wheel.
I still reserve the right to make small adjustments to taste though.
skelly,
My post wasn't aimed at the SmokTek Vari-Cool VV box. I should have specified that. I don't own one, although I do have a Penguin Tin dual-18650 VV with internal voltage display (made by Caged, bought from SmartVapes) that uses the same 6-amp regulator (it's the OKR, I think). Anyway, the pot in my Penguin is identical to your description of the SmokTek's---white body enclosing the coil, with a protruding square on the serrated wheel.
I've had my Penguin mod only a month or so and haven't needed to change voltage on it more than once or twice (which was easy with the firm-turning wheel and voltage display), so perhaps it has better adjustment linearity than many of the regulator pots on my older VV mods.
Glad to hear that yours is so user-friendly and easy to adjust by sight and feel. I'll play with my Penguin VV a little to see if it's up to snuff.
The two most common rechargeable Li-Ion types are:
ICR: Lithium Cobalt, LiCo
IMR: Lithium Manganese, LiMn
LiCo batteries, unless otherwise published by the manufacturer, should not be discharged beyond 2C.
LiMn can get a little fuzzy because not all LiMn battries are "high drain". This means that some may be 2C, some may be 5C, and some (AW 1600mAh) may be 15C or higher. What makes it even harder is that there are only a handful or manufaturers that produce the raw cells (Panasonic, Samsung, LG, Sanyo,....), there rest of the "Brand Names" are re-wrapper's and resellers. The resellers don't like to disclose the identity of the raw cell, so finding a data sheet that stated the max discharge rate is liken the odds at Vegas. Best bet is to use a lifeline and ask the experts (I've been accused of being knowledgable, but certainly not an expert.)
Just to cover all the bases, C rating...
Max safe discharge (in Amps) is a product of the C rating times the capacity.
2C x 750mah = 1500mA = 1.5A max discharge
2C x 3100mah = 6100mA = 6.1A max discharge
So when we speak about the protection circuit cutoff current, 2.5A is a good cutoff for ICR 14500's but is less than half of the max current for an big 18650.
ICR: Lithium Cobalt, LiCo
IMR: Lithium Manganese, LiMn
LiCo batteries, unless otherwise published by the manufacturer, should not be discharged beyond 2C.
LiMn can get a little fuzzy because not all LiMn battries are "high drain". This means that some may be 2C, some may be 5C, and some (AW 1600mAh) may be 15C or higher. What makes it even harder is that there are only a handful or manufaturers that produce the raw cells (Panasonic, Samsung, LG, Sanyo,....), there rest of the "Brand Names" are re-wrapper's and resellers. The resellers don't like to disclose the identity of the raw cell, so finding a data sheet that stated the max discharge rate is liken the odds at Vegas. Best bet is to use a lifeline and ask the experts (I've been accused of being knowledgable, but certainly not an expert.)
Just to cover all the bases, C rating...
Max safe discharge (in Amps) is a product of the C rating times the capacity.
2C x 750mah = 1500mA = 1.5A max discharge
2C x 3100mah = 6100mA = 6.1A max discharge
So when we speak about the protection circuit cutoff current, 2.5A is a good cutoff for ICR 14500's but is less than half of the max current for an big 18650.
For the Pots in question, we as vapers and modders have repurposed "trimmers" to act where an actual potentiometer or rheostat should go. Trimmers are designed to be set once and only moved or adjusted when the the parent device needs calibration (a good multimeter usually has at least 4 trimmers to adjust the calibration as needed). They can be very finicky and will wear out quickly as they were not intended to be adjusted often.
Once I find some time to get back into building mods, I'm goin to start playing with digital Pots. I'm not real happy with the trimmer either. But when weighing size vs function of the non-digital variety, trimmers will win 9 of 10 in the ecig world.
Once I find some time to get back into building mods, I'm goin to start playing with digital Pots. I'm not real happy with the trimmer either. But when weighing size vs function of the non-digital variety, trimmers will win 9 of 10 in the ecig world.
I'm an old school tech guy and I may be a bit rusty, but I'm picking up what you guys are putting down.
I appreciate all the information passed along here as this thread has a lot of good info and not just unrelated ramblings.
There's nothing wrong with those types of post, but I personally like the tech side of things.
All I know is that I bought this box mod to fill a void that I needed filled.
The end result, it is now my all day and only VVPV.
It had to be good for me to give the wife my other VVPV's w/ LCD screens and today I found out that she gave 2 of them away to her girlfriends, batts & chargers included.
She also gave them her new CE4+ CC devices that we haven't even tested.
So now there are 2 'new' vapors running around in the wild using tube style VVPV's w/ CE4+ CC on top as their first PV.
(Feel free to hunt them down, they can probably be caught in a trap with bottles of juice)
The PV's she gave away all have the lower amp range; built in protection and using IMR batts, so I'm not to worried.
She kept the chrome tube mod for herself and told her gilrfriends that it gives her smoke at both ends...she's full of them lately..lol.
To wrap this up, I have a small form/big performance VV mod that only cost me $63 bucks and....I'm a happy vaper
I appreciate all the information passed along here as this thread has a lot of good info and not just unrelated ramblings.
There's nothing wrong with those types of post, but I personally like the tech side of things.
All I know is that I bought this box mod to fill a void that I needed filled.
The end result, it is now my all day and only VVPV.
It had to be good for me to give the wife my other VVPV's w/ LCD screens and today I found out that she gave 2 of them away to her girlfriends, batts & chargers included
. She also gave them her new CE4+ CC devices that we haven't even tested.
So now there are 2 'new' vapors running around in the wild using tube style VVPV's w/ CE4+ CC on top as their first PV.
(Feel free to hunt them down, they can probably be caught in a trap with bottles of juice)
The PV's she gave away all have the lower amp range; built in protection and using IMR batts, so I'm not to worried.
She kept the chrome tube mod for herself and told her gilrfriends that it gives her smoke at both ends...she's full of them lately..lol.
To wrap this up, I have a small form/big performance VV mod that only cost me $63 bucks and....I'm a happy vaper
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Yes these Efest are IMR. Rob at Smoktek is very sophisticated, he wouldn't recommend a Non-IMR Battery for the 6Amp Beast, it would be irresponsible and there would be potential Liability issues. I don't have the technology to test if it is IMR but I'm going to accept the logic.
Hi Skelley,
I'm with you, I tested the units thoroughly because Subjective Posts like " It vapes like a champ" and I get 24 hours just don't cut it with me. Video Reviiews are nice but by nature they have to be shorter and it's very difficult to include all the details and multi types of testing in a Video review.
The Science supports your statement. If you combine this review with the 3amp version review. This unit is way smaller than a Provari and those monster size Tube Mods. Around 20-28 1 minute Vapes support that it holds it's voltage rock solid steady to the end. Testing on more than 5 different types of Cartomizers/Clearomizers including the Dual Coil 1.25OHM show that it will handle any carto/Clearo/Atty currently on the market.
The Beast has no limiting Chip Control Features that stop you from doing what you want. If you want to vape for 30 seconds on end, no problem. The annoying 10-15 second Cutoffs are avoided.
While this is subjective, every owner has said the same thing, no matter how you torture test this unit it stays cool. Maybe I'll get a thermometer to prove it.
The Battery Tests show that it is a long battery Life.
The only Variable will be the durability and how long it will last.
I agree this unit provides all these features at an attractive price point of $56.00 (3 Amp) $63.00 (6 Amp) and many Vapers are purchasing inferior Tube Mods at the $80.00 to $95.00 range
This Box Mod has become my primary PV also. I now just use my Provari as an Atomizer Tester because the Beast performs as well as the Provari and in a smaller form factor. I agree with you "Small form / Big Performance VV at a reasonable price point. I bought a Mini-Lava Tube and returned it twice. (2 Defective Units).
The one suggestion is that for the .... retentive you can buy an Atomizer Tester Digital Cartomizer / Atomizer Resistance Tester (Ohm Meter) and or a Digital Voltage Tester LED Digital Voltage Tester
One thing you mentioned that was important was
" built in protection "
The unit has protections built in and will never overheat, but if the button is depressed in a purse or your pocket, the atty/carty/clearo will continue to fire indefinitely until it burns up eventually melting the unit. It has a sliding power button but I've found that I never use it and at times I"ve pulled it out of my pocket and it was accidentally switched to off, so I have to surmise it could work the other way.
My suggestion is that if you are safety conscious and will be carrying it in a place where you can't notice that the button has been accidentally depressed you pull the Carto/atty/clearo from the unit when transporting.
I'm with you, I tested the units thoroughly because Subjective Posts like " It vapes like a champ" and I get 24 hours just don't cut it with me. Video Reviiews are nice but by nature they have to be shorter and it's very difficult to include all the details and multi types of testing in a Video review.
The Science supports your statement. If you combine this review with the 3amp version review. This unit is way smaller than a Provari and those monster size Tube Mods. Around 20-28 1 minute Vapes support that it holds it's voltage rock solid steady to the end. Testing on more than 5 different types of Cartomizers/Clearomizers including the Dual Coil 1.25OHM show that it will handle any carto/Clearo/Atty currently on the market.
The Beast has no limiting Chip Control Features that stop you from doing what you want. If you want to vape for 30 seconds on end, no problem. The annoying 10-15 second Cutoffs are avoided.
While this is subjective, every owner has said the same thing, no matter how you torture test this unit it stays cool. Maybe I'll get a thermometer to prove it.
The Battery Tests show that it is a long battery Life.
The only Variable will be the durability and how long it will last.
I agree this unit provides all these features at an attractive price point of $56.00 (3 Amp) $63.00 (6 Amp) and many Vapers are purchasing inferior Tube Mods at the $80.00 to $95.00 range
This Box Mod has become my primary PV also. I now just use my Provari as an Atomizer Tester because the Beast performs as well as the Provari and in a smaller form factor. I agree with you "Small form / Big Performance VV at a reasonable price point. I bought a Mini-Lava Tube and returned it twice. (2 Defective Units).
The one suggestion is that for the .... retentive you can buy an Atomizer Tester Digital Cartomizer / Atomizer Resistance Tester (Ohm Meter) and or a Digital Voltage Tester LED Digital Voltage Tester
One thing you mentioned that was important was
" built in protection "
The unit has protections built in and will never overheat, but if the button is depressed in a purse or your pocket, the atty/carty/clearo will continue to fire indefinitely until it burns up eventually melting the unit. It has a sliding power button but I've found that I never use it and at times I"ve pulled it out of my pocket and it was accidentally switched to off, so I have to surmise it could work the other way.
My suggestion is that if you are safety conscious and will be carrying it in a place where you can't notice that the button has been accidentally depressed you pull the Carto/atty/clearo from the unit when transporting.
I'm an old school tech guy and I may be a bit rusty, but I'm picking up what you guys are putting down.
I appreciate all the information passed along here as this thread has a lot of good info and not just unrelated ramblings.
There's nothing wrong with those types of post, but I personally like the tech side of things.
All I know is that I bought this box mod to fill a void that I needed filled.
The end result, it is now my all day and only VVPV.
It had to be good for me to give the wife my other VVPV's w/ LCD screens and today I found out that she gave 2 of them away to her girlfriends, batts & chargers included
She also gave them her new CE4+ CC devices that we haven't even tested.
So now there are 2 'new' vapors running around in the wild using tube style VVPV's w/ CE4+ CC on top as their first PV.
(Feel free to hunt them down, they can probably be caught in a trap with bottles of juice)
The PV's she gave away all have the lower amp range; built in protection and using IMR batts, so I'm not to worried.
She kept the chrome tube mod for herself and told her gilrfriends that it gives her smoke at both ends...she's full of them lately..lol.
To wrap this up, I have a small form/big performance VV mod that only cost me $63 bucks and....I'm a happy vaper
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