The battle is already lost.

[Johnsky]

I had no idea that battle with Stevia happened.

In summary, to me it looks like the FDA wouldn't give it the OK because nobody bribed them to do so... and only did their job in part when the government intervened and forced them to do their job.


As another poster said... what good are they?

If they aren't there to ensure safety, and all they do is take bribes to put a stamp on things, then why do we keep them around? Why not just tear the FDA apart, fire the lot of em, and install something that actually is intended to promote safety?

 

[LaceyUnderall]

There is no doubt that the FDA has some issues. Even the scientists for the FDA are screaming Corruption! FDA Scientists Accuse Agency of Corruption, Intimidation But this hasn't gone unnoticed and it IS being dealt with. We can only hope that it is dealt with properly.

 

[Maxwell_Edison]

I guess I'll buy the e-cig and stock up. Hoping it will all work out. I signed the petition, I hope everyone else has too, and I'll write my congressman. If it goes under I will use the black market (And I will tell everyone that every death caused by cigrettes is blood on the governments hands). I bet weed is legal before these are. Stinkin Uncle Sam wants his tobacco taxes.

I have a feeling if I wait till it's legal I'll be waiting a long long time. I did not anticipate this when I decided to vape. This hit me like a ton of bricks (from Tower 7)

 

[Boston George]

To preemptively strike and stop this thread from going into the abyss.

Please do not talk about
-moon men
-9/11
-<insert your pet conspiracy theory here>

If you want to talk about such things, there are places like Reddit and 4chan.

---


I do find it odd that the FDA hasn't shutdown the SE mall shops. Especially because they often make the false claim that they are FDA approved. Is this a sign of an internal struggle, maybe. It may also be that the FDA knows it doesn't have the legal right to classify the inhalers as a drug combination.

The FDA knows that if they try to stop SE, SE will fight them in court. If the FDA looses it will embolden the other vendors. Then the floodgates will open.

So right now, a blanket threat "What your doing is illegal!" is more effective than actual enforcement action.

 

[Maxwell_Edison]

I said NOTHING about moon men, they aren't real.

My closing wink was a refernce to something said earlier in this thread, thus the pararthesis and green smiley face. It was not a part of my comment. Please don't jump on me without a good reason.

 

[Savantster]

"The only reason there is a supposed ban is because this has yet to happen."

Health New Zealand reported on studies done on Ruyan's e-cigs and liquids. Found them 100% safe, nothing nefarious in the smoke/mist/vapor.

Lab test have been done, they are pretty much 100% (depending on the "flavors" being added). There is no good reason to block them at present, and if they want to start demanding tests on "flavorings" that aren't already proved safe, that's fine. Propylene Glycol with nicotine (no flavor at all) is 100% safe, period. If someone has doubts, let them run test after test, but the chemical analysis done so far shows nothing dangerous.

 

[Savantster]

Another thing to keep in mind; re: tobacco controls..

perhaps the FDA _will_ approve these once it can engage in oversight of tobacco/nicotine. that is, once it has the reigns of tobacco, bringing in a "safe" alternative (at a minimum, for the short term) while choking big-tobacco with regulations could topple the entire empire while giving society a "safe" (if not addicting) bump of dopamine.. and once tobacco is dead, they can worry about going after the "safe" addictions without worry people will revert to the now not legal tobacco venue.

wishful thinking.. I'm thinking.

 

[jennydotz]

Sorry, bad post

 

[strayling]

I was at the supermarket yesterday and noticed lots of little bottles of stevia liquid on the shelf right next to the sugar ...

 

[walkstheplanes]

I knew about the stevia ban, but it's being introduced slowly into our market. I purchased some stevia a week ago for sweetening some teas... Also, I do know that Pepsi is experimenting with using stevia for a diet line.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevia

There's more info here...

I'm coming late into this thread, so I apologize if I'm beating a dead horse.

 

[Maxwell_Edison]

I'd like to know - how many of you, knowing the legal situation today, would still purchase the e-cig starter kit? Or would you wait till it played out a little more?

I ask because someone like me, on a fixed VA pension, can't afford a $100 kit that I might soon not be able to buy cartridges and accessories for. As I said before, I fully intended to make the purchase, was looking forward to seeing them in Walgreen's this April and then I've learned all this stuff was going on. Should I just buy it and figure it will all work out? Or, would you?

Appreciate your answer
Max

PS - I've been asking this in several places and no one has answered: Approximately how many analog cigs equal one 901 cartridge?

 

[strayling]

I'd buy. There may be some politicking to be done but these devices aren't going away.

 

[Maxwell_Edison]

I'd buy. There may be some politicking to be done but these devices aren't going away.

Now that's what I've been waiting to hear! Thanks!!

 

[strayling]

Now that's what I've been waiting to hear! Thanks!!

I may be wrong, but even if worse comes to worst and e-cigs get banned I've spent some time not burning dead leaves and inhaling the smoke.

 

[Bryn]

Anyone remember when Cyclamate the Sweetener was banned in 1960's? Big Sugar barons fought and won, but 20 years later FDA found it harmless. I don't know if they actually lifted that ban.

I would hate to wait for FDA to find e-cigs harmless 20 years later!

It would be good for someone to remind FDA of this..to show them that we know it's all about money.

 

[Smokin'Sandy]

I bet the cancer societies are multi billion dollar. If we had cure for cancer I wonder how many billions would be lost and how many researchers out of work. Sometimes it's hard to really trust anything for no other reason that the information is controlled by those with the money. Then you have the public and they are pretty easily swayed by such terms as "Terrorist", "Second hand smoke" etc etc. When you take a step back and try not to let your emotions get involved and just look at the information available pretty shortly you end up asking yourself "Can I trust ANY of this?" Hell, I still haven't figured out why they took down building 7.

It is interesting the way the domino's are falling and the fact they haven't taken any action yet. I agree that we need to take advantage of the lull and do everything within our power to sway public opinion as quickly as we can. People shouldn't be finding out about this from "Good morning America" Maybe we can call it the "Anti terrorist smoking device with the benefits of no second hand smoke"

I'm a little off topic, but there seems to be a cure for certain cancers. The FDA filed 34 fraud charges against DR. Stanislaw Burzynski and a TX judge acquitted him on all of them.

If you have some spare time, check him out.

 

[gr8dane]

I'd like to know - how many of you, knowing the legal situation today, would still purchase the e-cig starter kit? Or would you wait till it played out a little more?

I ask because someone like me, on a fixed VA pension, can't afford a $100 kit that I might soon not be able to buy cartridges and accessories for. As I said before, I fully intended to make the purchase, was looking forward

Look at it this way. If you're a pack a day smoker, you're going to spend at least $150 this month on analogs(if you can find them for $5/pack). For $100, you can buy a 510 starter kit (with 2 complete e-cigs), a spare atomizer just in case, and more than enough juice to get you thru the month. No matter what happens, you will actually save $50 over the next month. And the following month will be even better (cost $60 worst case to maintain that second month). If you DIY your liquid, you can cut your juice cost in half to boot. So it's a win-win situation....EXCEPT, if you're like most of us, you won't be able to buy just one...you'll have to get another whether you need it or not

 

[zachari]

On a poll in this forum the vast majority of users do want regulation and labeling of e-liquid. So its is almost putting the FDA and the consumers in one basket and the sellers in the other. If the sellers do not get in control of the process, it will be driven by others with much harsher results.

I don’t think manufacturing of liquid in the US is improbable, it is dirt cheap to make.

 

[saintgadreel]

On a poll in this forum the vast majority of users do want regulation and labeling of e-liquid. So its is almost putting the FDA and the consumers in one basket and the sellers in the other. If the sellers do not get in control of the process, it will be driven by others with much harsher results.

I don’t think manufacturing of liquid in the US is improbable, it is dirt cheap to make.

Banning and proper labeling wouldn't be the same basket, IMO. I think it would be better to have things like child safe containers for liquid, proper labeling, safety warnings where appropriate, etc. What the FDA will most likely do would be to ban the sale and import of the product altogether, and based on what I've read about previously unapproved drugs under the FDA's jurisdiction, MANY years could pass before that decision changes.

As far as I can see, the labeling and related issues with marketing has more to do with the existing tobacco products than it does with vaping. It's just one of many issues that are being used against PV's considering there is no founded medical evidence indicating an actual threat. When in doubt, make up a problem and stick with it, that seems to be a government specialty in the US.

 

[moose88]

ok guys obviously the 5th deadline has gone and no news from the FDA, but i believe that the sooner we reach the 10,000 mark on our petition the better. This is the only combined effort to do something against the FDA in the ecig industry. so lets join forces and make it count the easiest way to get thousands of people to sign up in a matter of days is to spam youtube (technically its not spamming, its just informing)

so go to youtube, and search for any video that is relevant to this petition
type in things like
-FDA
-ecig
-Ecigarette
-FDA ban
-smoke 51
-ruyan
etc etc be creative

and in the comment box type in something along these lines (copy and paste to save time)
"HEY GUYS, the government body FDA is soon banning this product in the USA unfairly, because they know that they will get less taxes from real cigarettes. this is unfair and goes against the american constitution! please please please go to Google and type in "electric cigarette petition" and click the first link. every vote counts, we have the right to quit cigarettes and save our health!!!even if your from the UK or Canada because they will copy USA. please copy and paste this//"

something along those lines, remember you cannot include links or else it wont post, so you have to say "go to google and type in electric cigarette petition" also, at the end of your post, say "please copy and paste this" so more and more people will do it.

collectively the top 10 ecig videos on youtube have more then 1.5 million views, so getting around 5 thousand people to sign the petition in a few days should be a piece of cake! lets do it.
ps can someone make my post into a thread, i dont think i have sufficent posts to do it?