The Wizard - Why not?

[Charged]

I was talking more about the wick design like I have. From watching the wick when heated...when it gets hot the fluid tends to back away somewhat from the coil.

Are you sure it's really backing away or is it just going away into the air because of the heat?

If when it started to back away from a front coil...energize a rear coil to push it back again and just keep alternating like that.

Wouldn't pulsing the beginning of the coil push it back out of the coil as well?

Is there a simpler way to do that than with a 555?

Hmm... I'll have to ponder over some Captains on that.

 

[nicotime]

Are you sure it's really backing away or is it just going away into the air because of the heat?

Yep...heating the liquid expands it forcing pushing it back down the fiber...I watched the dyed fluid do it.


Wouldn't pulsing the beginning of the coil push it back out of the coil as well?

What I was thinking was this...say the coil is 1" long. Put a ground wire in the middle at .5". Then a positive at each end. Then have a circuit that alternates pulses of power to the ends. When the first side heats up some fluid will back up to the other side...then by that time the other side energizes pushing it back. Yes, where the fluid is be picked up some will get pushed back but I was hoping for the same effect like a cars valves. The pulse caused by the exhaust exiting helps suck in more mixture when the intake starts to open. I'll have to do another experiment with this setup and just take the hot wire and fire each side by hand to see what happens.

Hmm... I'll have to ponder over some Captains on that.

I'm sure that will be tough for you.

 

[nicotime]

OK I just run a test of the theory and there was no visible movement of the fluid, although I used the cotton like silica (dumb) instead of the straight fiber stuff. Either way I think I'm sliding back to over-engineering that thing instead of keeping it simple.

Never mind... sorry about going off topic here C.

 

[SurfVortex]

That double-wound coil looks quite promising,C. Video was really fun,thanks.
Too bad about the night you had to sleep with your Wizard and dremel....in a purely fuzzy, masculine, heterosexual way, of course! (thanks Tony!)
Say howdy to the Captain for me!

 

[TonyLoco2]

Hey charged I came across another slide show that had the vendor on it that had the wizard at VapeFest. The web-site was

bluemistvaping.com


And you're welcome surf it is my purely heterosexual pleasure lol

 

[Charged]

Tony, I did a search for that Bluemistvapor and not much except for domain registration requests.

OK I just run a test of the theory and there was no visible movement of the fluid, although I used the cotton like silica (dumb) instead of the straight fiber stuff. Either way I think I'm sliding back to over-engineering that thing instead of keeping it simple.
Never mind... sorry about going off topic here C.

Hi nico, It is possible to pulse that coil as you requested but it would require a "H" bridge type drive circuit and just too complicated for what you're doing.

Also, I've been a little concerned about heating a wick directly with a coil as that coil can deliver some major heat depending on the resistance and voltage your applying. I decided to run a little test of my own.

I used some silica rope for wick material that nico supplied to me that was marked "good for attys" (thank you nico). I tried using a needle to get this stuff down in the glass tube I'm using but it was just impossible. No matter what I did I just couldn't make it work..... So I wet quite a long piece of it down and twisted the crap out of it, then clamped one end with a pair of vise grips, hung it through the grate in the freezer and clamped a second set of vise grips on the other end so it was weighted and stretched tight. After about an hour I pulled it out, snipped of the ends and quickly shoved it down through the glass tube before it started melting. This worked like a champ.

So on with the test.
Wick material routed through the heating tube.

I ran pure PG no additives except for distilled water through the heater for about 35 seconds with the coil voltage at 5 Volts and 1 amp for a total of 5 Watts of power. The whole time I was forcing fluid through the wick and producing good vapor.

I pulled the wick out to examine it's condition:

If you look close. The wick has hardened and is somewhat burnt and no longer really acts as a wick. I can't really tell if it is the wick material itself or, if it is just burned PG attaching itself to the wick material.

If this happens with only 30 seconds of heat, I'm not sure how long it would work for normal vaping. Also, I made sure that there was no time that I didn't have fluid flowing through this wick.

This is probably why most atomizers use indirect heat from the coil to vaporize the liquid and not allow the wick or filler to actually come in direct contact with the heating coil.

 

[nicotime]

Cool test C, cant explain that one. I have run numerous test on one setup and have never got the wick to do that. It even caught on fire a couple times and didn't char it like that. I would have to say it more of a burnt fluid problem than wick...and due to intense heat in a small area. Dunno...maybe lack of air has something to do with it. I only have had 510's so I don't know about other attys...but the 510 has the coil wrapped around the fiber directly and it works fine.

You just have an incinerator built there bro...you want to vaporize liquid man not replicate a supernova!

 

[Charged]

You just have an incinerator built there bro...you want to vaporize liquid man not replicate a supernova!

Yea maybe a little too hot.

Sorry.... but I'm a little ticked off..... gotta go off topic for a sec.

 

[nicotime]

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[Charged]

I only have had 510's so I don't know about other attys...but the 510 has the coil wrapped around the fiber directly and it works fine.

Sorry about the side-step there.

OK, so this tells me I have been going in the wrong direction. I kept thinking I needed more heat but that's not the case. I really need less heat spread out over more area.

I think the best approach would be to use the IR camera and some PG to determine exactly the power and temperature needed for complete and efficient atomization through the glass. Now where did I put that damn camera.

 

[Scubabatdan]

Sorry about the side-step there.

OK, so this tells me I have been going in the wrong direction. I kept thinking I needed more heat but that's not the case. I really need less heat spread out over more area.

I think the best approach would be to use the IR camera and some PG to determine exactly the power and temperature needed for complete and efficient atomization through the glass. Now where did I put that damn camera.

How about a plugged 22ga needle that has wire wrapped around it at 2 wraps per inch inserted into the glass? this would slow the liquid down and maximize the surface area of the heated glass. Simmilar to the original concept but every thing is reversed. The glass is the outside and the SS needle is inside plugged at both ends and wrapped with wire allowing the fluid to travel in a spiral at a slower pace for vaporizing.
Thinking outside the box here.
Dan

Added concept below:

 

[Charged]

You are right on the mark Scuba. That is close to what was happening when I put that resistor lead down through the tube. It was acting as a filler and spreading the liquid evenly around the heating surface. Yes the idea of creating a spiral in the tube would allow even more uniform heating and also reduce flow to a usefull rate. Now I just need to find something that will do this nicely and still allow it to be removed from the tube for cleaning.

 

[Charged]

The needle is a good idea. What are they made out off. A hollow tube would be good. That way I could silver solder the spiral wire at both ends and let something protrude out the exit side like a little handle to allow it to be pulled out easily.

 

[Scubabatdan]

The needle is a good idea. What are they made out off. A hollow tube would be good. That way I could silver solder the spiral wire at both ends and let something protrude out the exit side like a little handle to allow it to be pulled out easily.

Have not gotten my tubing yet, this was the Idea I had. Figure I would share, with the tube hollow there is not as much surface to heat up like a solid piece would require. Would like to see the results
Dan

 

[beast775]

this thread gets more exciting everytime i see it.

 

[Charged]

Have not gotten my tubing yet, this was the Idea I had. Figure I would share, with the tube hollow there is not as much surface to heat up like a solid piece would require. Would like to see the results
Dan

Yes the less mass the better. My problem is the quartz I'm using has a 1mm ID. The smallest OD stainless tube I can find is 1.25mm. Looks like I'll have to go with solid wire for testing.

Thanks for chiming in. What size tube are you using Dan?

 

[Charged]

OK I think I have it.
Max outside diameter is 0.94mm. Will give it a try tonight when I get home from work.

 

[nicotime]

That 14 gauge needle I sent is like .083" isn't it?

 

[nicotime]

Oooops...damned MM I see...I'm so confused anymore.....nevermind

 

[Charged]

Oooops...damned MM I see...I'm so confused anymore.....nevermind

Yea I know. Get with the times nico we're suppose to be using the metric system. At least that's what they been telling me for the last 40 years. Go to the hardware store and try to buy some metric copper pipe and they'll look at your like your some kind of nut job.

Yea that needle is over 2mm in diameter. A tad to big. I have a feeling this is going to suck the heat away like crazy. Can't wait to try it though.