To All E-liquid Manufacturers.

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HazMatt

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With all of the negative things being thrown at us vapers, and the deeming FDA regulations, I wonder why so many companies add coloring to their e-liquids. Aside from the fact that they are UNNECESSARY additives, I believe all these bright colors might be enticing to young children. Imagine a group of e-liquids that all range in color from clear to brown. Now, imagine a second group of e-liquids, with all the colors of the rainbow, sitting next to the natural colored e-liquids. Which do you think a child would reach for? If you use the colors to help differentiate what flavors are in each bottle, perhaps you need a good labeling system.

Also, I prefer subdued labeling over vividly colored labels. I believe there should be no pictures of fruit, candy, deserts, food, unicorns, robots, rainbows, cartoon characters, etcetera, on the labels. Image the same scenario, subdued labels next to vividly colored and/or pictured labels. Which do you think a young child would reach for? I am not saying that labels should be incredibly plain, just use subdued colors. Take Five Pawns and Flavorz By Joe for example. They have very nice packaging and labeling without using vivid colors, or pictures to represent the flavor.

E-liquids should never be left were children could reach them. And, as responsible adults, we should do our very best to prevent this from happening. However, if by chance, a child is faced with a bottle of e-liquid, I believe that natural colors, subdued labels, and of course, child safety caps, would be the last line of defense in preventing a possible tragedy. ALL e-liquid manufacturers should use child resistant lids, of some type.

Additionally, I think manufacturers should be a little more accurate and honest, with labeling, where PG/VG ratios, flavorings, nicotine and other additives are concerned.

With cloud chasing becoming a bigger part of the vaping community, there are manufacturers that claim to sell 100% VG e-liquids. Flavorings and nicotine are not VG. So, any e-liquid, that contains flavorings and/or nicotine, are not 100% VG. Their e-liquids may use 100% VG base with only added flavor and/or nicotine and, if this is the case, these types of e-liquids would be more appropriately labeled Max VG. The same applies to Max PG e-liquids. If it has flavorings and/or nicotine, it is not 100% PG.

Some manufacturers cater to vapers that are sensitive or allergic to PG. They may only use VG, flavorings and/or nicotine, with a little added water, or something else, to thin out the e-liquid. Their listed ingredients should reflect this. Perhaps these types of e-liquids could be labeled as PG Free, with some type of viscosity rating. Perhaps a scale to shows water on one end andGVG at the other. They could then use an arrow to indicate the appropriate viscosity.

Similarly, 50/50 blends, would likely be better listed as having a 50% PG/50% VG base with flavor and/or nicotine added. The same would apply to any other claimed PG/VG ratios.

I am not advocating that manufacturers divulge the exact mixtures used in their e-liquids. However, each ingredient should be listed on the label. The only ingredient that should be precisely listed is the nicotine content. And, I believe that manufacturers would be better off listing the nicotine content per ml. For example, list the nicotine content as "12mg per ml" instead of just "12mg" or "12mg strength". We, as veteran vapers, may understand that "12mg" means 12mg per ml. However, imagine an uneducated person testing a 10ml bottle listed as "12mg" only to discover that there is in fact 120mg of nicotine in that 10ml bottle. I am afraid that these types of inconsistencies are what the FDA will use to try and stop the manufacture of e-liquids. Each label should also contain a warning about the dangers associated with nicotine.

I know that manufacturers are not allowed to post here. If you are an e-liquid manufacturer, feel free to send me a PM. I can then copy and paste, any responses, to this thread. To avoid any possible conflicts with the admins, I will keep all copied and pasted responses, from manufacturers, anonymous.

I also welcome responses from fellow ECF civilian vapers, here in the thread.

Thank you for your time and consideration,
Matthew
 

Nick N

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Keep in mind that "vaping" is still uncharted territory and these safeguards or best practices that juice manufacturers take are voluntary. The FDA will eventually regulate this as well (keep the comparisons to cigarettes out of it!)I for one feel that guidelines are necessary, how do you know you are getting the 24mg nicotine you paid for, and that the device you are using can effectively deliver it?
 
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VENAXIS

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I see no reason in adding colorants to our e-liquids, so I agree with you on that point.

I think what manufactures mean by 100% VG/PG is as you said, the base, since 'maybe' they can't get an accurate percentage of how much PG/VG is mixed into the flavors they're using in their e-juice. Unless of course the flavor they're using mentions the amount of VG/PG in it, then that would be great!

In order to see this fixed and for accurate numbers to be printed on the manufacturer's bottled e-liquids, flavor makers need to be honest about the exact amounts of PG/VG they use in their flavors, so that it can be properly measured.

I hope I didn't say something that doesn't address your arguments.. Just woke up :?:
 

young gotti

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i had a big thing all typed up and the computer decided it didn't want to post it

but i agree with the warning labels and accurate labels, even though i think the labels are fine as is, but they should take action before hand rather than the fda forcing them to

in the supplement world we have warnings on everything but that doesn't mean we can't put the advantages on the package either, so even though it wouldn't be wise, if places put warnings about nicotine, they should be able to list advantages too
 

HazMatt

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That's quite the surmise you wrote there.

It took some time also.


Keep in mind that "vaping" is still uncharted territory and these safeguards or best practices that juice manufacturers take are voluntary. The FDA will eventually regulate this as well (keep the comparisons to cigarettes out of it!)I for one feel that guidelines are necessary, how do you know you are getting the 24mg nicotine you paid for, and that the device you are using can effectively deliver it?

True it is not currently regulated howerver, if all manufacturers follow a similar labeling system, the FDA will hopefully mandate a labeling system that makes sense. I also wish that e-cigerettes and e-liquids were not lumped into the same category as traditional tobacco products. As far as nicotine content, I want to get what I paid for and not get more than I want. If I purchase 12mg per ml, that is what I expect to get, with in a small acceptable variance. Perhaps a 1mg per ml margin is acceptable.


I see no reason in adding colorants to our e-liquids, so I agree with you on that point.

I think what manufactures mean by 100% VG/PG is as you said, the base, since 'maybe' they can't get an accurate percentage of how much PG/VG is mixed into the flavors they're using in their e-juice. Unless of course the flavor they're using mentions the amount of VG/PG in it, then that would be great!

In order to see this fixed and for accurate numbers to be printed on the manufacturer's bottled e-liquids, flavor makers need to be honest about the exact amounts of PG/VG they use in their flavors, so that it can be properly measured.

I hope I didn't say something that doesn't address your arguments.. Just woke up :?:

FDA regulations may require manufacturers to have the exact mixtures on record. However, to protect their own proprietary mixes, I don't think the exact mixtures need to be printed on the labels.

For example, let's say an e-liquid has a VG base however, the flavorings and/or nicotine are in a PG carrier. In this case, I believe that the listed ingredients should read VG, PG, Flavorings and/or nicotine. If the flavorings and/or nicotine are in a VG carrier then, the list ingredients should read, VG flavorings and/or nicotine. This would help protect people that are sensitive or allergic to PG.

While I don't think exact mixtures should be listed, perhaps a rough estimate could be listed on the label. Max VG mixes could list the ingredients as, VG and <6% flavorings and/or nicotine. PG/VG blends could list ingredients as something like, 50% PG/50% VG base with <20% flavorings and\or nicotine. And, as I mentioned in my OP, any other ingredients, such as water, should also be listed on the label.

Please take all of this with a grain of salt as I am just spit balling ideas here.
 

zahzoo

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I agree with the food coloring... it's unnecessary, does not enhance flavor nor nicotine absorption. In addition, I don't believe any food grade coloring has been safety evaluated for inhalation. I question if all colorings I've seen are even food grade. If you need color for marketing purposes use colored bottles and caps.

I'm not opposed to colorful labels but I also think they should be void of cartoon characters, bunnies, kittens, flowers, dragons, etc... This is an adult product. Package it as such.

On labeling, the PG/VG ratio should be clear. Also the content of the flavorings used. You don't have to disclose your recipe... but as the flavor distributors notate... natural & artificial flavor in an alcohol base or PG base or whatever. I also believe additives such as Ethyl Maltol (EM), Sucralose, Acetyl Pyrazine, Vape Wizard, Citric acid, Maltic acid, etc... should all be disclosed in the ingredients listing.

We really don't need the FDA nor any other regulatory body to mandate simple standards so consumers can make relatively knowledgeable purchases of reputable products.
 

skoony

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i think coloring would be ok if it was used in such a way as to be able to distinguish genres of flavor. one shade for fruits,another for candy,sweets,tobacco,or bakery flavors. if the coloring was consistent it would it at least would give an older user like me a heads up on what was in the bottle i'm grabbing. some of the fonts used on the labeling is extremely small. for DIY'ers all little tint would be a safety aid as someone unfamiliar with vaping coming across an unlabeled quart jar wouldn't assume it was water. the reason that soap bubbles has nothing to do with its cleaning properties. it was a visual aid added before modern plumbing so one was aware that this water has soap in it.
regards
mike
 
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