To all the questions of what to buy to start out..

[SpeakerPlayNet]

....
1. "I started with a blu/volcano/ripoff mall kiosk trap" >

Loved your post. One point, however, since you are addressing newbies. Volcano models come in several flavors, the Volcano (little guy and not worth your time), the Magma (a 510), Magma Mega (510 longer battery life), and Inferno - which is in the class of at least #4 with a 1000 mah battery and tons on vape plume. Just didn't want the company name to be put in the same category as that first ecig offering by the same name sold by the same company. And, be sure you're getting a manual battery so you have the options - (a) cart + atty or (b) cartomizer or (c) atty + drip tip so you can try them all.

I just made up two kits for Xmas presents. I gave one both a set of Magma Mega 510's and a set of Inferno's - reason: she needs something she can smoke and walk to work with (510- Magma Mega) that is good, doesn't look like a cigarette, and doesn't look like a strange drug device. The Inferno is for home and out and about when she doesn't mind using the larger Inferno.

2nd person got set of Tornados because they were on sale and I was only getting this person one kit (in class #4).

I think this was a good post and laughed a lot at your description, thanks for that.

 

[SpeakerPlayNet]

I don't think everyone needs an Ego or Riva. Sure a lot of people end up there but not everyone does. Some people have no problem charging batteries during the day and don't mind at all. I don't. I love my M401. I like my KR8 too. They are both great tasting PVs with decent battery life for minis (M401 is 210mah and KR8 standard is 280mah).

For those who use 510 batteries Totally Wicked sells a multi charger - charges five 510 batteries at once. I use it with my Magma Mega's and love it. Works good to use when I forgot to charge up my larger bat's.


I have yet to learn what a M401 is, I've been meaning to look that up. And on the question note, I have one of those small Titan 510 sets (purchased strictly for collecting and learning) - it is 2.75" (battery only) - is this considered a "Super Mini" while my KR8, which is 3" (and closely resembles a cig with carto attached) considered a Mini? Then the longs (Megas) come in at 4". Where does the 901 fit in? Are say the Riva 901 and the "DSE 901" two different animals?

After that the batteries seem to start back at 3" but much fatter and much longer charge time (650 mah) Then a little longer still and moving up to the 750 and 1000 mah's. As far as I can tell, these are sort of called the "Ego/Riva classes" ?? I haven't seen them called anything else except maybe brand names. Then what would you call the 1000's mah's that are still in the Ecig (non-mod class)?

After that it seems everything is a mod and lots of shapes and sizes and ways of getting the juice to the atty.

One last question - I saw penstyle mentioned several times and one sticky said "it's a category not a model" but then didn't explain further. I am guessing it is the longer thinner type - does it matter if the cart mouth end is the round or the flat?

It'd be great if someone would clear this up and let me know also if I've misspoke or left something out. Thanks in Advance!

 

[Zod]

Hey Airbrush: Yeah you can just grab a couple Riva batteries as essentially they're just a big 510 battery and compatible with all the 510 hardware out there. I'd still recommend the kit though as you'd barely spend more but get 2 attys, the cone(ditched this right off but it does make your PV prettier), and the charger. I've charged Riva batteries with my regular 510 charger but it takes a little longer, just don't charge 510 batteries on your Riva charger. It's a bit higher voltage and amperage and would likely fry the battery. You can also find 1100mah Riva batteries and nhaler has the real deal 1300mah batteries. Some early suppliers were calling the 1100 a 1300 til they cracked open a battery.

Hey Speaker:
You have a good point on Volcano having their own clones of the 510 and eGo but the issue I have with them besides their low end kit is that if you're going to clone Joyetech hardware don't charge as much or more than Joye does. The Inferno is a competent eGo clone (phase 3 not 4) but you get only 1 atomizer, 1 battery (1000mah! Nice) and a passthrough. Why you get 2 cones with 1 atty I'll never understand. While that battery is sweet the kit is twice the price of the Riva but they do have some awesome finishes. If you buy the 1300mah Riva battery for $35 then things are more comparable price wise but Riva still edges it in the 1300mah and an extra atty which are $8 each. I just find it hard to respect a company that pushes the low end so hard (4 vkits vs 1 each for Mag and Inferno) because they know you have to buy their overpriced proprietary cartridges for it. xxxEXACTLY THE SAME BUSINESS MODEL AS blu.xxx

Not bashing on the Inferno itself as it does fit in that "sweet spot" I mentioned for performance but the Riva kills it in pricing. My problem *is* actually with the company itself simply because the vkits even exist. Lord knows I got ripped off $120 worth when I chose it as my starter......

Edit: Also keep in mind the idea behind the OP was as low an entrance fee as possible but maintain respectable performance. $60 with 1 battery and 1 atty and no juice just isn't there.

 

[SpeakerPlayNet]

That's not what I'm after, specifically.
What I'm after is a cartridge or cartomizer or flavor that doesn't taste like burning garbage.

I can help you here as I've been there/done that after weeks on this forum and some help. Your 8R808D-1 (KR8) battery will take 510 size parts if you get a "901-510" adapter (also called a 901/808D-1 adapter). The first # is the battery. Then go to the Volcano website and order either the Magma standard or Mega ceramic carts and the special refill syringe kit. (These are actually cartomizers as are the carts you're using on your K808 now so no atty needed). What happens is the juice sits in a ceramic holding tank and is wicked up to the atty, as opposed to the juice sitting in various filler material. You waste less juice and I think (IMO) get a much cleaner juice taste (once the cart is used once as sometimes carts have a strange initial taste). The standard holds a fair amount but the mega is of course longer and therefore holds about twice as much. Totally wicked sells the adapter as do several other places. Volcano sells the ceramic carts - I haven't yet found them elsewhere - and they are under Magma Accessories in a drop down list. While you're there - check out the Inferno case for about $10, sweet - holds tons including juice bottles. I've seen this case in lots of places but not at this good of a price. Anyway, you can put anything from a 510 to a good size 1000 mah Ecig and accessories in them, they are double zippered and two sided, about 6" long, 2.5" wide when zipped and 1.5" deep when zipped. I love the red - it's not pictured but is a true red.

 

[Zod]

"pen style" refers to the shape not bulging through the battery AKA 510megas.
If you're even considering KR cartos you should start at Vapor4life. (V4L) MANY here swear by them and their excellent cartos. Their Vapor King line is a KR and they have a good selection to support it.

 

[SpeakerPlayNet]

Hey Speaker:
You have a good point on Volcano having their own clones of the 510 and eGo but the issue I have with them besides their low end kit is that if you're going to clone Joyetech hardware don't charge as much or more than Joye does. The Inferno is a competent eGo clone (phase 3 not 4) but you get only 1 atomizer, 1 battery (1000mah! Nice) and a passthrough. Why you get 2 cones with 1 atty I'll never understand. While that battery is sweet the kit is twice the price of the Riva but they do have some awesome finishes. If you buy the 1300mah Riva battery for $35 then things are more comparable price wise but Riva still edges it in the 1300mah and an extra atty which are $8 each. I just find it hard to respect a company that pushes the low end so hard (4 vkits vs 1 each for Mag and Inferno) because they know you have to buy their overpriced proprietary cartridges for it. xxxEXACTLY THE SAME BUSINESS MODEL AS blu.xxx

Not bashing on the Inferno itself as it does fit in that "sweet spot" I mentioned for performance but the Riva kills it in pricing. My problem *is* actually with the company itself simply because the vkits even exist. Lord knows I got ripped off $120 worth when I chose it as my starter......

Edit: Also keep in mind the idea behind the OP was as low an entrance fee as possible but maintain respectable performance. $60 with 1 battery and 1 atty and no juice just isn't there.

Actually, the Inferno kit comes with one 1000 mah Battery and one 650 mah battery. The 650 Inferno doubles as a PT and can also be disconnected and used as a 2nd take-with battery that doesn't need a computer attached to it once it's charged. The reason these things come with the cones is it improved draw, according to more than one source I've read. Having the 2 cones means that you have one for the 1000 and one for the 650 batteries (In my house both batteries are used throughout the day so I appreciate the 2 cones). Yes, I have to pay $8 for another atty but the charger is high-speed and charges in 2 hours - you get the USB with the wall outlet adapter). You can't use this high-speed charger on your lower mah batteries but everyone has those chargers around often in duplicate or triplicate. I stick by the statement that for $60 this is still a good battery (you only get 2 650's with the Ego). You do get 5 tobacco carts with the Ego but I don't like those style carts so there is a preference here but since you can use 510's on the Inferno it doesn't much matter. I have yet to try the Riva so I can't compare there except to note they are two 750 mah's on the kits I looked at, not sure where the 1300 came in. I will no doubt order one at some point but am sure my Inferno will be my favorite until the right mod that auto drips comes along for me. I prefer dripping over both cart types discussed but the ceramic over the filler type. THE INFERNO IS NOT PROPRIETARY CARTS - YOU CAN USE 510 ATTYS/CARTOS, ETC.)

 

[Zod]

I know the Inferno's carts are not proprietary. I don't like the fact they push the vkits so hard which are. The 1300 came in because that would make the Inferno's 1000 a moot point for the price. Ceramic cartos are available EVERYWHERE and they don't have to use an adapter as they're readily available in KR form as well as 510. I don't like Volcano as a company because they have that blu-like side of their lineup that seems designed to rip people off when there's TONS of suppliers here that have nothing in their lineups like that and I feel deserve people's business first.

I'm sorry but it's appearing that you work for volcano?

 

[Zod]

But I will say Volcano got my stuff to me really fast for coming from Hawaii. I'm not trying to get coarse on volcano but this is precisely what the OP was about. NOT pushing what you love upon someone new but introducing them to that price/performance sweet spot to get them hooked on the cheap. Otherwise you'd here me spouting nothing but LR or high voltage mods.

 

[throatkick]

This post will help many and should be a sticky. However, the reason these steps take place has more to do with marketing than anything else. People see the mall kiosks and various "starter" kits at gas stations/7-11 etc. They buy one. The few very light smokers or those extremely motivated to quit make do and that's it.

Most, start realizing that these are OPTT (over-priced tinker toys), that batt life is non-existent and that the cartos will cost them an arm and a leg. They go back to the kiosk and up the nic content. Then, while there is an improvement, it is slight and they start to draw like crazy producing that burned taste. They go through 2-3 cartos a day (discovering that some are duds) and realize that it is just not practical. Those who are motivated enough, search and find places like this where their horizons are vastly broadened.

On the other hand, the mall kiosk now carries 36mg Usa Made VG juice... so things are getting better. I say, passthrough models available within 2 months

 

[Zod]

The kiosk thing is what chaps my .... Anything proprietary for me = money making plot. Read: blu, kiosk, vkits, iAnything (apple), compaq, bluray. Freedom>slick design any day for me.

 

[Mudflap]

Problem 1: I wanna try ALL of the flavors available

Problem 2: I wanna try ALL of the PV's and accessories available

Problem 3: I'm not a billionaire and my kids might want to go to college someday

Yes, I have problems. But I don't crave analogues anymore. Therefore, I win.

A VV mod of some kind is in my immediate future, but egads, how will I ever choose which?

 

[Newbz]

Ouch. The KR is a pretty competent piece and a 510 is going to be pretty fairly equivalent just it will vape much longer on the Riva batt. If it still feels lacking grab an LR atty or carto and it will kick harder.

Actually, I have not found that to be the case. Received my Riva this AM, charged it up, primed it according to the helpful video someone linked to and gave it a try.

1. The Riva510 gives a cooler temperature of vapor than the KR808d-1. It is extremely noticable. The KR808 is like taking a breath on a hot, muggy, summer day. I can see why some people would like that heat, but I don't. The Riva gives off almost room temperature vapor with just a hint of warmth IMO.

2. Most importantly, the Riva doesn't have any hint of burning plastic to it. My RN4081 never has either. This must be the difference between using cartridges plus an atomizer and using a cartomizer. Having said that, I've tested my KR808 by having friends use it and they claim to taste absolutely no burning. My WAG on this is that I can taste the cooper coil of a cartomizer when it gets hot, and 99 out of 100 other people wouldn't. Lucky me, eh?

3. Only downside to the Riva is it is much bigger than either the RN4081 or the KR808d-1 (with a standard battery). This makes it a little hard to shove in my pocket and go. I'll need to find a new type of case for it. I was using a TightPac cigar tube. The Riva isn't even pretending to fit in it.
OTOH, the Riva is pretty sweet looking. It's not obnoxiously huge, I just need a new case.

4. I would have saved a hell of a lot of money had I purchased a Riva first. Vapor is nice and cool, flavors are true, vapor production is good, it looks nice, feels good in my hand, filled easy (Thanks to the southern lady's video!) and best of all, NO BURNING PLASTIC FLAVOR!!!!!

Good deal. I will order spares for this model, no question.

This is the unit I'll use for a good long while. I'll keep the RN4081 as my back up, and I'll give the KR808 away.

Total bill to be smoke free: $900 +.
Not smoking a pack and a half a day: Priceless.

 

[Infernia]

Count me in the Kr808d-1 starter. I also found the starter kit I had was over-priced, not enough nicotine in the cartomizers to stop craving analogs, bad tasting juices or so/so ones and burnt tasting.
Next I got the Joye 510 and a bunch of accesories. Amazing difference in flavors between the kr8 and the 510 but like most others I couldn't keep a battery for more than 2-3hrs.
Bought an Inferno and love it (eGo, vGo rebranding). Now I'm searching for more vapor and less dripping ... a juice fed mod. (Guess what... I have a computer with a glass side and lots of mods inside it for heat dissapation as well as for asthetics ... pretty lights)
@Newbz - I too can taste that yuck you are experiencing. You aren't alone. At least with the new juices it's a little better. It's a hard hitting PV and so I'm giving it to my 2 PAD boyfriend when he finally comes home. He won't notice that taste at all.

This is a great thread I wish I had seen before I started. I would have gone straight for the eGo, saved a bunch of money and would already own a juice fed mod.

 

[QuikWgn]

It's pretty well documented on several threads here on ECF that it seems at least some of the kr808's and more so the Royal Smokers E2 series of cartos have some kind of 'primer' gel/fluid on the coil that seems to impart a really nasty taste, and there are several methods such as dry burning, or rinsing in alcohol etc that can be done to remove it prior to vaping. Once cleaned out of this 'primer' a lot of people have had favorable experiences, but for others it seems too much work.

 

[throatkick]

Why would anyone want a "primer gel/fluid" that imparts a really nasty taste?

 

[KevinDavis]

Hey Brad,
Can you please explain a little bit more about the resistance on the Riva. Thanks

 

[huzai]

Im in phase 1, going to skip to 3. thanks for writing!

 

[ralstad]

Im in phase 2 and just want to have a pv that will last me all day at work and not have to refill a carto every 2 hrs but also dont want to spend an arm and a leg to get what I want so taking the time to look around at the mods her so I make an informed and hopefully good decision. So heading to phase 4 just taking my time. I really like the 510 kit I bought just not quite good enough.

 

[Zod]

Remember, a Riva is essentially a 510 still, just with a bigger battery. If you're looking for harder hitting or more vapor you may want to look into LR attys or LR cartos. I got a 1300mah battery from nhaler for the stationary vaping but it lasted a whopping day. Oh well, back to 5v.

 

[dna]

You know what is insanely confusing and ought to be SCREAMED OUT in big letters somewhere:
a "brand" is not a "model."

So freaking confusing. You list your mall brands and they are totally foreign to me (except Blu, which is ubiquitous on the internet.) I actually read these forums (well, skimmed) before sending my husband off to the store and he was still lost, because the specific branded type available was unmentioned. I know there are threads and videos that attempt to explain the different types, but the concept that "brands" and "models" are two different animals is something that ought to be explained as soon and as frequently as possible.