Trying to find a certain flavor so I can make my own liquid!!
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This was probably not by choice. It was likely part of the whole “save the children!!!” campaign demonizing “child friendly flavors”. To be fair they might not turn out to be wrong, though I strongly suspect they will be.
I found a recipe online for the vanilla from Blu. The only thing is he described the flavors and % but didn't say how much that would make.
1% FA marshmallow
.5% FA meringue
1% INW shisha vanilla
1%TFA french vanilla
1% french vanilla creme
But how am I supposed to know how much this will make? Diy is a headache. I know what to buy, nicotine, pg and vg and flavoring. And maybe I should just buy the whole starter kit from nic river because it has the syringes. And I wouldn't know which syringes to use. I feel like a pain in the .... noob but I really want to get started on the whole diy path.. do I need the whole kit? I already have PG nicotine base.. then the flavors are all in my cart with the pg and vg. Now I'm stuck trying to figure out this recipe I found
1% FA marshmallow
.5% FA meringue
1% INW shisha vanilla
1%TFA french vanilla
1% french vanilla creme
But how am I supposed to know how much this will make? Diy is a headache. I know what to buy, nicotine, pg and vg and flavoring. And maybe I should just buy the whole starter kit from nic river because it has the syringes. And I wouldn't know which syringes to use. I feel like a pain in the .... noob but I really want to get started on the whole diy path.. do I need the whole kit? I already have PG nicotine base.. then the flavors are all in my cart with the pg and vg. Now I'm stuck trying to figure out this recipe I found
Reading this, as well as the user comments, I am inclined to think this is more of a "cream" vape, with vanilla accents; than a "vanilla" vape, with cream accents.
That being said; I would start with the obvious:
TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (as a solo mix; will require exploring various percentages)
OR
CAP Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (as a solo mix; will require exploring various percentages)
(NOTE: the DIY community seems more or less split on CAP vs. TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (VBIC). Some say TFA VBIC has a peppery note, while others say CAP does, or CAP is "flat" and lacks dimension. Only personal trials will tell which is the better choice for you.)
Then, if that didn't work; I would first focus on getting the cream base to my liking, and then work on the vanilla accent.
Something to keep in mind, while trying to recreate any commercial e-liquid:
- Profit is their purpose
- Profit is driven by sales
- sales are driven by repeat customers
- repeat customers are driven by satisfaction
- Profit is offset by cost of ingredients
- using the least costly ingredients, that still provides customer satisfaction, provides the greatest profits. (more expensive ingredients are not always the best/most profitable choice.)
- total volume/amount of ingredient required (for satisfaction) TIMES cost; is directly proportional to profit. (in other words; the cheapest/most expensive, is not always the "best" for profit.)
- Exception:
- I am a "boutique" e-liquid manufacturer; and I can/am willing, to charge above the market average, to provide a "better" product.
- Don't discount the simple things
- Many commercial e-liquid manufacturers use high percentages of sweeteners to appeal to recent smokers.
- if a mixture seems close but "flat," or "thin," try adding/increasing a sweetener to the mix. This can add a sense of "body," or "thickness" to a mix (though may actually mute some flavor. Primary flavors may need to be increased to offset the additional sweetener.).
- Many commercial e-liquid manufacturers use high percentages of sweeteners to appeal to recent smokers.
If not, then I will move up the ladder (FA, INW, FLV). If still not good enough; consider other vendors, or variant flavors.
Don't forget to consider where the original manufacturer is located. Chinese manufacturers are likely using Chinese-made concentrates. USA manufacturers are likely to use concentrate manufacturers readily/cheaply available in the USA.
Finally, don't forget, that there are commercial flavor producers, that provide custom concentrates to their customers. These are NOT made available to the general public. If this is the case; one's efforts are "slim to nil."
Almost, ALWAYS, one is better off; trying to get "similar to," rather than "same as." Keeping expectations reasonable, opens much more room for success.
Finding something "as good as...," is easier than, finding something that is "identical to... ." A willingness to "as good as...," often leads to "better than... ."
I hope that makes some sense. If not; say so. And, I will try to do better.
Lol yes that makes a lot of sense..that's so nice of you to explain all of that. This forum is just great.. did you happen to see my other post about finding a recipe similar to Blu vanilla? I have some percentages and on nic river they have a good calculator.Reading this, as well as the user comments, I am inclined to think this is more of a "cream" vape, with vanilla accents; than a "vanilla" vape, with cream accents.
That being said; I would start with the obvious:
TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (as a solo mix; will require exploring various percentages)
OR
CAP Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (as a solo mix; will require exploring various percentages)
(NOTE: the DIY community seems more or less split on CAP vs. TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream (VBIC). Some say TFA VBIC has a peppery note, while others say CAP does, or CAP is "flat" and lacks dimension. Only personal trials will tell which is the better choice for you.)
Then, if that didn't work; I would first focus on getting the cream base to my liking, and then work on the vanilla accent.
Something to keep in mind, while trying to recreate any commercial e-liquid:
Therefore, that being understood, I would look to the "cheaper" ingredients first. Concentrate manufactures, like FW, TFA, and CAP; are going to be my starting points. They may not be "perfect;" but, am I close enough?
- Profit is their purpose
- Profit is driven by sales
- sales are driven by repeat customers
- repeat customers are driven by satisfaction
- Profit is offset by cost of ingredients
- using the least costly ingredients, that still provides customer satisfaction, provides the greatest profits. (more expensive ingredients are not always the best/most profitable choice.)
- total volume/amount of ingredient required (for satisfaction) TIMES cost; is directly proportional to profit. (in other words; the cheapest/most expensive, is not always the "best" for profit.)
- Exception:
- I am a "boutique" e-liquid manufacturer; and I can/am willing, to charge above the market average, to provide a "better" product.
- Don't discount the simple things
- Many commercial e-liquid manufacturers use high percentages of sweeteners to appeal to recent smokers.
- if a mixture seems close but "flat," or "thin," try adding/increasing a sweetener to the mix. This can add a sense of "body," or "thickness" to a mix (though may actually mute some flavor. Primary flavors may need to be increased to offset the additional sweetener.).
If not, then I will move up the ladder (FA, INW, FLV). If still not good enough; consider other vendors, or variant flavors.
Don't forget to consider where the original manufacturer is located. Chinese manufacturers are likely using Chinese-made concentrates. USA manufacturers are likely to use concentrate manufacturers readily/cheaply available in the USA.
Finally, don't forget, that there are commercial flavor producers, that provide custom concentrates to their customers. These are NOT made available to the general public. If this is the case; one's efforts are "slim to nil."
Almost, ALWAYS, one is better off; trying to get "similar to," rather than "same as." Keeping expectations reasonable, opens much more room for success.
Finding something "as good as...," is easier than, finding something that is "identical to... ." A willingness to "as good as...," often leads to "better than... ."
I hope that makes some sense. If not; say so. And, I will try to do better.
You are NOT being a "pain-in-the-....." Noob, or otherwise. We all started from where you are. RELAX, you are among friends.
Percentages are actually the preferred "measure" for recipes. They are universal, in that they apply to all sizes of recipes the same. Meaning that, whether I am making a 1 liter batch, or a 10 milliliter batch, 5% remains 5%.
If I use an e-liquid calculator it expects the ingredients in the form of percentages. Once I tell it how large a batch I want to make, and with what nicotine content, and what PG/VG ratio I want; it will tell me how many milliliters of each ingredient (based on stated percentages) I should use.
If you want specific measurements; tell us how big of a batch you want to make. That is fairly simple.
As for "kits;" I am generally not a fan. You are (usually) paying for things you will never use.
Sorry... I am REALLY slow typing. (I can't stop myself from watching my fingers.)
I have not looked at NR's calculator. But, if it is like the rest of their site, it should be just fine. (I have lots of respect for NR).
Give me a couple of minutes and I will see if I can find it.
Lol the calculator on nic river explained it all, actually seems simple. Instead of wasting $50 on the kit can you tell me what tools I will need? I have nicotine, then there is an option to buy the phone and vg.. what kind if syringes would you suggest for measuring? Do I need to purchase the blunt needles with it? And I was thinking about just making a 120nl batch to start so what kind of bottles do I need for mixing and storing? I'm a simple kind of person so my way would probably be measuring and throwing it in a big bottle and shaking.. then putting it into smaller like maybe 30ml bottlesYou are NOT being a "pain-in-the-....." Noob, or otherwise. We all started from where you are. RELAX, you are among friends.
Percentages are actually the preferred "measure" for recipes. They are universal, in that they apply to all sizes of recipes the same. Meaning that, whether I am making a 1 liter batch, or a 10 milliliter batch, 5% remains 5%.
If I use an e-liquid calculator it expects the ingredients in the form of percentages. Once I tell it how large a batch I want to make, and with what nicotine content, and what PG/VG ratio I want; it will tell me how many milliliters of each ingredient (based on stated percentages) I should use.
If you want specific measurements; tell us how big of a batch you want to make. That is fairly simple.
As for "kits;" I am generally not a fan. You are (usually) paying for things you will never use.
Hmm. Im also wondering if it's POSSIBLE to measure the flavor in drops and ditch the syringes? I was also reading that recipes usually use about 15-20% flavoring but the recipe I found added up on the calculator to about 5-6% flavoring. Does that seem low? I work evenings and that's why I'm on here at night mostly but I'm slowly going cross eyed so if I stop responding I definitely fell asleep lol. Don't want you to think I ditched you
Why are you buying a phone???
Sorry, just teasing... I couldn't resist. <I am so ashamed
> First, I would suggest mixing only 5-10mL... not 120mL. That way, you can figure out if you like it, without wasting a bunch of ingredients. Then, once you are happy with the recipe (percentages), you can make as large as you like.
As for equipment:
Syringe size is (mostly) dictated by batch size. The bigger the batch; the bigger the syringe. That said, the most common sizes I used (when using syringes) were 1mL (the most), 3ml, and 5mL. Having a 10mL, and even one 30mL did not go unwasted. But, I have yet to throw one away either, so one should(?) be sufficient.
Regarding needles... about the only purpose I can see, is reaching the bottom of the bottle. Otherwise, you have to transfer (pour) into a wider-mouthed container. A few larger gauged needles (14ga., 12ga.; the smaller the number; the larger the barrel size) is usually sufficient. The longer the needle; the deeper the bottle it can reach in to.
I would say a half a dozen syringes (to a dozen), and 3-4 needles; and you should be good, for the first 6 months to a year of mixing.
Haha typo. Thank you for all the advice. It's so much appreciated! I've been wanting to do this for a long time but it all seemed so confusing. This is foolish of me but for 6 years I paid $8.99 for a 10ml bottle of vivid vanilla from Blu. Then not to mention that was my husband's all day vape as well. Ugh I don't even want to say it but I will.... Roughly $200 a month on juice for the both of us. And lots of time we couldn't afford it but bought it anyways because there was nothing out there that was close to what we wanted. Ugh I'm shaking my own head. I'm glad it's over and I can start a new chapter on diy. Could have saved so much $ if I saw the light sooner. So again thank you, have a great night. Would you mind if in the next few days I need help if I reached out to again?Why are you buying a phone???
Sorry, just teasing... I couldn't resist. <I am so ashamed
First, I would suggest mixing only 5-10mL... not 120mL. That way, you can figure out if you like it, without wasting a bunch of ingredients. Then, once you are happy with the recipe (percentages), you can make as large as you like.
As for equipment:
Syringe size is (mostly) dictated by batch size. The bigger the batch; the bigger the syringe. That said, the most common sizes I used (when using syringes) were 1mL (the most), 3ml, and 5mL. Having a 10mL, and even one 30mL did not go unwasted. But, I have yet to throw one away either, so one should(?) be sufficient.
Regarding needles... about the only purpose I can see, is reaching the bottom of the bottle. Otherwise, you have to transfer (pour) into a wider-mouthed container. A few larger gauged needles (14ga., 12ga.; the smaller the number; the larger the barrel size) is usually sufficient. The longer the needle; the deeper the bottle it can reach in to.
I would say a half a dozen syringes (to a dozen), and 3-4 needles; and you should be good, for the first 6 months to a year of mixing.
Yes. That's how I started and it's still my preferred method. 1 ml is about 20 drops, ergo 5 ml is 100 drops. As easy as it gets. If you're mixing at, say, 5%, pour 95 drops of your base at the nic strength you like into a 5 ml bottle, then add 1 drop per 1% of flavorings. Shake and put aside.
I learned this method from @Bill's Magic Vapor. Hang on, I'll try to find you a link to his post.
Using Bill's 100DT Taste Test Method | E-Cigarette Forum
It's a long post, but this is what you need to know in a nutshell:
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Cool. That seems more my style than measuring everything. So if I'm understanding correctly each 1% of flavoring is about 1 drop?
Yes. Looky up there^^^^. I edited my post #33. 1 drop is 1%. 100 drops makes 5 mls.
Possible? Yes.... though I don't personally recommend it.
Drops are EXTREMELY variable... depending on viscosity, applicator, and ambient temperature
For those who are mixing by the "I don't give a shi'p'" method, and repeatability is not an issue... drops can be okay. But, for those striving to duplicate a flavor, or replicate their own creations; then volume (syringes), or weight (scales), are a much wider choice.
15-20% is actually rather high by today's standards. Of course, that is depending on the concentrates used, the hardware used, the hardware settings, and... most of all... the individual's preferences. It is neither wrong, nor right.
The real question is what is right for you (preference), and your specific hardware setup (coils, airflow, power, etc.)? Experimentation, and experience, is the only thing that can truly reveal that to you. Adding more variables (different attys, power, air, and recipes) only questions that.
No worries!
I am a middle-aged bachelor (grey hair is coming in with a vengeance) (a.ka. "oldfart") and keep rather late/early hours. I have the opportunity to converse with folks from all over the globe. So, it is no surprise, or offense, when others go silent (a.k.a. have their own life). I am here when you like, or will be along shortly (given the global clock). I also respond well to "thanks, but no thanks," and "shove off!," equally well.
The community of ECF has helped my own vaping journey in ways I can't even begin to describe. I only wish to pass the knowledge along.
Well thank you again! I will def post my progress! Take care, KellyPossible? Yes.... though I don't personally recommend it.
Drops are EXTREMELY variable... depending on viscosity, applicator, and ambient temperature
For those who are mixing by the "I don't give a shi'p'" method, and repeatability is not an issue... drops can be okay. But, for those striving to duplicate a flavor, or replicate their own creations; then volume (syringes), or weight (scales), are a much wider choice.
15-20% is actually rather high by today's standards. Of course, that is depending on the concentrates used, the hardware used, the hardware settings, and... most of all... the individual's preferences. It is neither wrong, nor right.
The real question is what is right for you (preference), and your specific hardware setup (coils, airflow, power, etc.)? Experimentation, and experience, is the only thing that can truly reveal that to you. Adding more variables (different attys, power, air, and recipes) only questions that.
No worries!
I am a middle-aged bachelor (grey hair is coming in with a vengeance) (a.ka. "oldfart") and keep rather late/early hours. I have the opportunity to converse with folks from all over the globe. So, it is no surprise, or offense, when others go silent (a.k.a. have their own life). I am here when you like, or will be along shortly (given the global clock). I also respond well to "thanks, but no thanks," and "shove off!," equally well.
The community of ECF has helped my own vaping journey in ways I can't even begin to describe. I only wish to pass the knowledge along.
P.S. middle aged bachelor is the new 30.. and grey hair Imo is awesome!
I agree. But for making small (5 ml) samples, and for people who are new to DIY, it's a very easy introduction to mixing and testing flavors.
Bill's 100 DT method is not practical for mixing large batches, of course. And is not as precise as volume or weight method.
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Good to know! Thanks again Katya!I agree. But for making small (5 ml) samples, and for people who are new to DIY, it's a very easy introduction to mixing and testing flavors.
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