Undercover camera at SE reveal...

[jen28f]

From "Oregon investigates electronic cigarette company"
Oregon investigates electronic cigarette company | Health | kgw.com | News for Portland Oregon and SW Washington

"NewsChannel 8 took an undercover camera to a kiosk where a child, accompanied by her mother, listened to the sales pitch. There also is a sign that clearly reads the products are for adults 18 and up."

Now if that was the worst that the undercover cameras exposed, whats the problem? How many take their children shopping and pick up a 6 pack? Or go out to eat at a restaurant and order beer or wine with their meal? And you have to be 21 to buy alcohol. There are ads for alcohol and cigs all over the place, since when is it illegal for children to see/hear/know about them?

 

[cmdrmaxwell]

that AG is one hell of a Nazi! he says that there is no proof that they are safe...well i say that there is no proof that they are UNSAFE! show me that they are UNSAFE and maybe and thats a strong MAYBE and ill think of putting my ecig down!! but until then ill be vapin til me hearts content!!!

 

[TropicalBob]

Proof of safety and efficacy rests with the manufacturer. There is no use applying your "common sense" to the problem. Regulations are written, not thought up at the last minute to fit a given situation. Marketing of e-cigs has been less than stellar by some makers/sellers.

Vape to your heart's content .. and until it becomes illegal to buy any more stuff. Don't blame your government for doing its job. Blame the people who made and sold you the products without following proper procedure. Now we all get to pay for that folly.

 

[mintee]

OMFG, I'm sick to my stomach hearing about this Marketing to Children crap! What, Mint, and Strawberry flavors are only made for children? Adults don't enjoy the simple pleasures of Mint/Strawberry/etc?

Fine, stop all the flavors and just make Hate flavor, and I'll vap that and I'll like it.

 

[jen28f]

OMFG, I'm sick to my stomach hearing about this Marketing to Children crap! What, Mint, and Strawberry flavors are only made for children? Adults don't enjoy the simple pleasures of Mint/Strawberry/etc?

Fine, stop all the flavors and just make Hate flavor, and I'll vap that and I'll like it.

I know! That is the argument that burns me the most. Like after you turn 18, you don't like good flavors anymore. Somehow chocolate and strawberry and mint must all taste like *ss when you hit 18. If you think about the things that are for adults that are flavored that no one beefs about. Maybe if they were marketed in these adult pleasing flavors....shnapps, vodka, malt liquor, mixed drinks, vitamins taste like fruit, rolaids come in berry flavors, polident is mint flavored, milk of magnesia is mint or cherry flavored, ensure comes in strawberry, chocolate, vanilla, as does slimfast, protein powder/shakes, ex lax chocolate...oh wait.....
Is this because they are marketed to kids? Or maybe, possibly, because adults prefer good flavors, too? Or are they supposed to be flavored as brocoli, lima beans, liver and onions, and oysters?
And the whole....training wheels to the real thing. Yeah, a kid is going to invest $150 in equipment and use it and work his way up to a stinky nasty pack of $5 smokes. And a corvette is training wheels to a dodge omni. And if they have a tootsie pop, they might work their way up to licking ashpalt off the street.

 

[Robert]

a percentage of these kid the're trying to save will grow up to be smokers.......all the just say no bs don't work, education don't work................................

If the e-cig goes away then the children wont have a choice when they reach legal age to smoke- and some of them will start a lifetime addiction to smoking...........

Nicotine has been used for thousands of years and will continue to be used for thousands more.....

It might be politically incorrect, but I say the e-cig can stop me from smoking and stop future 18 year olds from starting smoking........ If your a smart 18 year old then if you have three friends who are 19 one smokes, one don't, and one vapes- you now have another choice.....

 

[TheIllustratedMan]

... Or are they supposed to be flavored as brocoli, lima beans, liver and onions, and oysters?
...

... I like all of those things (well, never actually tried liver, but I imagine I would probably like it, since I like hot dogs and other organ-meat derived products).

 

[need_2quit]

Proof of safety and efficacy rests with the manufacturer. There is no use applying your "common sense" to the problem. Regulations are written, not thought up at the last minute to fit a given situation. Marketing of e-cigs has been less than stellar by some makers/sellers.

Vape to your heart's content .. and until it becomes illegal to buy any more stuff. Don't blame your government for doing its job. Blame the people who made and sold you the products without following proper procedure. Now we all get to pay for that folly.

TB I LOVE your old school practical reasoning heheh.

Ppl we can't have it both ways. Want safety with no regulation? - not gonna happen.

Is the FDA nutz? Probably so. My husband asks why they're not busy keeping our food safe instead or worrying about ecigs.

By the same token, years later we may drop like flies from PG. Then watch the ..... storm about why the FDA did nothing to regulate them.

Like TB said, the ball is in the manufacturers court to prove these things are safe.

States like OR have become more nanny state since californians invaded, so nothing is a surprise there.

 

[need_2quit]

I just saw the video and didn't see anything about a mother and child. ?? All they said was the devices were untested.

 

[Magestorm]

Ummmm, there have been long term studies done on PG and VG, with no appreciable or demonstrable risk shown, waaaaay back in the 40's. it was used in bomb shelters in the UK to keep the spread of diseases down. At issue is the fact the FDA wants to call this a new drug, when it's old items we already KNOW ARE SAFE!

 

[souporvapor]

Someone on a 'flavor' thread mentioned other 'adult' flavored items.... hmmm
we could start with vodka and move on to other mature 'pleasures'.... gee I think I'd like my guy to wear a nice pair of yummy spinach flavor boxers please?

I offered my SD filled with RY4 to a not underage younger than me person...
"I WANT to smoke" - was his response - complete with mentioning friends who use e-cigs and the fact that p/v's are too much trouble.

alcohol, nicotine lozenges, xxxproducts (and just x), cough syrup, pipe tobacco..... just a few of the 'approved' goodies 'us adults' enjoy in flavors.

I can agree with not marketing to 'kids' - but not on the basis being used.

30 years of smoking
Vaporized by my ScrewDriver!

 

[jen28f]

I just saw the video and didn't see anything about a mother and child. ?? All they said was the devices were untested.

It was in the story, not the video. The last paragraph or so.

 

[rocketvapor]

And if that sales pitch gets that mother off analogs and allows her to have many more years actually being a mother to that child, instead of a sad memory filled with nightmares of hospitals, surgeries, chemo, radiation......

How is this a bad thing????

Maybe I missed the point here......

 

[TropicalBob]

Magestorm: I'm the one who posted the first information about those 40s' studies, in a thread called "germ-killing vapor" in the Health section. I've read every word of those studies -- and more. I'm a believer in the health benefits of inhaling propylene glycol vapor. That said, it's not PG we inhale. It's not nicotine we inhale. It's a chemical mix -- including PG and nicotine -- that has never been tested for human inhalation.

THAT'S the problem. Individual ingredients might be GRAS (although nicotine is a poison and highly addictive), but the combination might have unintended side or long-term effects. That's why government makes the demands that it does on new drug mixes. Frankly, I think any real problem could only come from flavorings, not PG or nicotine in the amounts we inhale. But we won't know until science reveals provable truth.

 

[seminolewind]

Tylenol overdose can kill you. It will destroy your liver. That's why the FDA approved cherry flavored children's Tylenol. Maybe they just don't like kids

 

[Symmetric]

Fine, stop all the flavors and just make Hate flavor, and I'll vap that and I'll like it.

mmmmm... Hate....

 

[AVITWeb]

Tylenol overdose can kill you. It will destroy your liver. That's why the FDA approved cherry flavored children's Tylenol. Maybe they just don't like kids

And lets not forget one of the most recen "fads", taking mommy and daddy's pills out of the medicine cabinet and bringing them to the party...No age restriction needed...Just a pill bottle and an old prescription!

Why??? because in this country we reward the fuknuts!

 

[Satyr]

Fine, stop all the flavors and just make Hate flavor, and I'll vap that and I'll like it.

Dude, you just cracked my .... up! That sounds like it should be a line straight out of Metalocalypse.

 

[Webby]

"The company has six days to respond to documents to alleviate the state’s fears or it will be shut down."

Who wants to take bets on SE sticking their heads in the sand while this deadline passes? TBob has been making the argument for months that it's not a common sense issue. I don't even blame the Chinese manufacturers, history is full of "entrepreneurs" who dumped products on world markets without testing them.

Mexico doesn't allow electrical imports (now) without having them tested ever since a TON of cheap Chinese gadgets flooded their shores in the 60s. I'll bet they wish they'd had Underwriters Labrotories or a version of Consumer Reports back then.

I blame the early pioneers (SE and Njoy) who had the foresight to see the profits but lacked the long term vision and responsibility to step up and provide the scientific testing that might have headed all this off months ago.

Now any effort is so mired in political jockeying for position that having a consensus on e-cigarettes is about as likely as Pelosi and Rush Limbaugh settling their differences over a frosty mug of Uncle Obama's Whitehouse Ale.

 

[Applejackson]

OMFG, I'm sick to my stomach hearing about this Marketing to Children crap! What, Mint, and Strawberry flavors are only made for children? Adults don't enjoy the simple pleasures of Mint/Strawberry/etc?

Fine, stop all the flavors and just make Hate flavor, and I'll vap that and I'll like it.

I've tried the Hate flavor... kinda bitter.