Upgrade Dilemma

[elmattias]

Well if you stop misinterpreting what variable wattage is then we may be able to actually discuss it. I try new juices all the time - so I don't know what they vape best at. What I do know is I can change the watts without worrying about being in the wrong volts for the ohms I have. Because the Zmax2 adjusts automatically. That's one of the big reasons I like it. I also like to vape the same juice at different watts sometimes - depending on whether I feel like a cooler or warmer vape. Again I just change watts, and don"t worry about what my ohms are.

Yes, you can get to the same place your way, and if that's what you like then fine. But that's not an argument against variable wattage. That's just you.

you're still being dodgy to the fact: vaping MY WAY, i'd still need to change an atty and a setting, regardless if it's VV or VW, its all the same....sure, VW is an easy button, but it's all reaching the same destination with a different route taken.....your point is COMPLETELY invalid in my argument....

and don't go highlighting variable like it's special, they are both variables, you're just changing the end vs. the means, but again, it would still require the exact same thing.

 

[cyclotron]

I feel that if you tried VW you'd find it easier and more reliable way to jump to something you already like. I don't think VW is the end all be all. In fact I'd love a device that read the temperature of the media and you could record your preferences like a quick dial. That would be awesome. It isn't that much to think we will see such devices in the coming months. The technology to deliver such a thing is already well sorted.

 

[kiwivap]

you're still being dodgy to the fact: vaping MY WAY, i'd still need to change an atty and a setting, regardless if it's VV or VW, its all the same....sure, VW is an easy button, but it's all reaching the same destination with a different route taken.....your point is COMPLETELY invalid in my argument....

and don't go highlighting variable like it's special, they are both variables, you're just changing the end vs. the means, but again, it would still require the exact same thing.

Ok, variable wattage. The point being that the argument that you have to change watts for some juices is a silly one. That's why it has variable wattage - so you can vary it.

I don't know why you put MY WAY in caps. I had just said "Yes, you can get to the same place your way, and if that's what you like then fine. But that's not an argument against variable wattage. That's just you."

Exactly - that's your way. Not mine. And I don't have to want your way. I prefer mine. And yes, I do think it gives an advantage. It's pretty obvious you just want to knock this pv.
As for the review - well he made a big deal about an extender cap costing $6. Last time I looked provape were charging $24 for theirs.

 

[elmattias]

I feel that if you tried VW you'd find it easier and more reliable way to jump to something you already like. I don't think VW is the end all be all. In fact I'd love a device that read the temperature of the media and you could record your preferences like a quick dial. That would be awesome. It isn't that much to think we will see such devices in the coming months. The technology to deliver such a thing is already well sorted.

this is besides the point, i'd never switch attys out for one thing vs. another.....using a fruit flavor in the tobacco atty would be....well quite frankly it would taste gross....and using a tobacco flavor in the fruit atty would taint it forever.....my point is i'd STILL need to change an atty and change a setting....it changes VERY LITTLE.

as stated earlier in this thread, i'm going to get a Zmax in soon, just to put the device through it's paces....as for your assumption that i've not tried VW, i have, and as stated, i don't find it anything other than exactly as i've stated before: changing the ends vs the means to the end.

 

[kiwivap]

I feel that if you tried VW you'd find it easier and more reliable way to jump to something you already like. I don't think VW is the end all be all. In fact I'd love a device that read the temperature of the media and you could record your preferences like a quick dial. That would be awesome. It isn't that much to think we will see such devices in the coming months. The technology to deliver such a thing is already well sorted.

I think that's a good point for me as a vaper cyclotron. I find it much more convenient. I just use VW mode and love it.

 

[cyclotron]

I really can't wait to see some mods based on the Evolv DNA20d. I would like a Darwin but those aren't readily available.
The competition and rate of innovation is accelerating and its really exciting to think of what we might have available in 6-12 months. Maybe sooner?

 

[elmattias]

Ok, variable wattage. The point being that the argument that you have to change watts for some juices is a silly one. That's why it has variable wattage - so you can vary it.

I don't know why you put MY WAY in caps. I had just said "Yes, you can get to the same place your way, and if that's what you like then fine. But that's not an argument against variable wattage. That's just you."

Exactly - that's your way. Not mine. And I don't have to want your way. I prefer mine. And yes, I do think it gives an advantage. It's pretty obvious you just want to knock this pv.
As for the review - well he made a big deal about an extender cap costing $6. Last time I looked provape were charging $24 for theirs.

still missing the point....but i'm done arguing that with you because it's beating the dead horse....changes will happen, it's just the nature of the beast.

 

[kiwivap]

this is besides the point, i'd never switch attys out for one thing vs. another.....using a fruit flavor in the tobacco atty would be....well quite frankly it would taste gross....and using a tobacco flavor in the fruit atty would taint it forever.....my point is i'd STILL need to change an atty and change a setting....it changes VERY LITTLE.

Except I don't have to worry about the ohms. That's a big difference for me when I'm on the go in the weekends. You're going to buy one - with the bias you already have I won't be waiting to see what you think.

 

[cyclotron]

.as for your assumption that i've not tried VW, i have, and as stated, i don't find it anything other than exactly as i've stated before: changing the ends vs the means to the end.

Elmattias, The statement wasn't for you. I know you think this thread that you highjacked is for your war on anything not provari. I intended my statement to the poster sepulse. But by all means continue the war...

 

[kiwivap]

I really can't wait to see some mods based on the Evolv DNA20d. I would like a Darwin but those aren't readily available.
The competition and rate of innovation is accelerating and its really exciting to think of what we might have available in 6-12 months. Maybe sooner?

A lot of people are anticipating that. On the other hand, I think we'll see a lot more affordable VW devices. The Vamo has RMS and a lot of people have been buying it. At $40 it's a good price.

 

[Baditude]

I was just at this same spot. I just ordered a Provari myself. I decided to skip all the ,bolts,zmax,vmax,lava tube's, ect. ect. ect. And go straight to the gold standard. I believe I will save money in the long run skipping all the others.

Zack did his homework well.

I think that this is one of the major points that elmattias, Off Topic, and even myself have been trying to get across in these friendly debates. The Chinese X-techs, lava tubes, etc have had a notorious reputation of poor durability and inaccuracy, not to mention no manufacturer support post warranty. We consider them to be disposable devices, with the longivity not much better than an eGO.

But some people are ok with that. If they get several months out of their device, they're somehow ok with that, because they saved $50 by not buying the Provari.

And I don't mean to be racist or a nationalist or whatever the term is against Chinese people. I just don't know how to label these mods. I call them Chinese only because that is where the majority of them originate.

Perhaps my perspective is slanted, as I have not owned one of those. I spend a large portion of my ECF time in the Provari forums, because I own one. I read a lot of posts by disgruntled owners of Chinese mods who finally decide, after hundreds of dollars spent on those devices, to finally get a Provari. Typical comments are "I really wish I had gotten this to begin with" or "I never believed the hype, but now I understand."

But it all doesn't matter. People will chose what they feel is best for them at that moment in time. I happen to enjoy these debates, as long as people don't get too bent out of shape. It's kinda fun, the back and forth. Maybe the Chinese manufacturers are finally getting their act together and making a decent product. That would be a good thing for vaping in general.

Now vape on.

 

[kiwivap]

.i would never EVER vape fruit flavors in my atty for tobacco flavors, and vice versa, would never vape tobacco juices in my fruit atty....either way, i have to switch the atty, then switch the voltage...

I never suggested putting different juice in the same atty. ??

it would be NO different from VW vs. VV in this situation, as both require an atty switch, and both would require a setting change due to liking the cooler vape with certain juices vs. a warmer vape with others, your entire argument is invalid on this principle...

As I said, I make one adjustment. You have to make two because you have to calculate for ohms.

no matter what, attys will be changed, and settings will be adjusted at some point....both numbers eventually get to the same goal.

And I didn't disagree with that. But I prefer a more convenient way of getting there. And you don't. To each their own.

 

[cyclotron]

Zack did his homework well.

This post brought to you by the person that started the thread "Provari, why all the haters?".

 

[elmattias]

As I said, I make one adjustment. You have to make two because you have to calculate for ohms.

you missed that again, i said in the first post on this argument that people get used to their devices....i know the voltages i like on all my flavors for their particular attys off hand already.....it becomes second nature, you learn the numbers that are right for you in either setting, be it VW or VV, i hardly ever calculate anything anymore...the only time i do math for vaping is when i'm trying to explain to someone how it works, and how to reverse engineer ohm's law...

even then, just about everyone has a smartphone these days, and they all have scientific calculator functions....plus every COMPUTER has these functions as well, and being this is a website, you have to be accessing this one of these ways...math shouldn't be that hard....this is a step that takes less than ten seconds.

 

[kiwivap]

Zack did his homework well.

I think that this is one of the major points that elmattias, Off Topic, and even myself have been trying to get across in these friendly debates. The Chinese X-techs, lava tubes, etc have had a notorious reputation of poor durability and inaccuracy, not to mention no manufacturer support post warranty. We consider them to be disposable devices, with the longivity not much better than an eGO.

Well you have just lumped in several different manufacturers as if they were all one company. Young June, L-Rider, Smoktech, Uniq... to name a few. They aren't all the same. You have no idea of the longevity of the Zmax 2. You've made a completely speculative statement to put people off. I'm surprised at that.

But some people are ok with that. If they get several months out of their device, they're somehow ok with that, because they saved $50 by not buying the Provari.

You don't actually know what all the owners expect here. This is really just you saying that's all they'll get from this device, but you don't know that. It's the same old speculative argument raised against any new pv. Until you know, you can't say.

And I don't mean to be racist or a nationalist or whatever the term is against Chinese people. I just don't know how to label these mods. I call them Chinese only because that is where the majority of them originate.

Ok, so how about dealing with each mod on its merits, and not lumping all the companies and mods into one. Doesn't matter what the country is, some companies are better than others, and some companies improve and bring out something better than they had before.

Perhaps my perspective is slanted, as I have not owned one of those. I spend a large portion of my ECF time in the Provari forums, because I own one. I read a lot of posts by disgruntled owners of Chinese mods who finally decide, after hundreds of dollars spent on those devices, to finally get a Provari. Typical comments are "I really wish I had gotten this to begin with" or "I never believed the hype, but now I understand."

Well that's a nationalistic argument. I don't lump a Young June lavatube in with an L-Rider one. Different companies and the mods are not the same.

But it all doesn't matter. People will chose what they feel is best for them at that moment in time. I happen to enjoy these debates, as long as people don't get too bent out of shape. It's kinda fun, the back and forth. Maybe the Chinese manufacturers are finally getting their act together and making a decent product. That would be a good thing for vaping in general.

Well Bad, lets not either of us pretend we aren't posting so folk will take heed of what we write. But you end with another nationalistic argument, as if all Chinese manufacturers are the same, and somehow inferior. I disagree with that.

Now vape on.

Vaping the Zmax 2 as I sit here.

 

[elmattias]

This post brought to you by the person that started the thread "Provari, why all the haters?".

says one of the new Zcultists.

 

[kiwivap]

you missed that again, i said in the first post on this argument that people get used to their devices....i know the voltages i like on all my flavors for their particular attys off hand already.....it becomes second nature, you learn the numbers that are right for you in either setting, be it VW or VV, i hardly ever calculate anything anymore...the only time i do math for vaping is when i'm trying to explain to someone how it works, and how to reverse engineer ohm's law...

And you missed it el mattias - I said I try out new juices all the time. I also have a bunch of them and can't always remember what they vape best at. Those are two of the reasons why I appreciate not worrying about ohms because I can just set the watts and it adjusts the volts to the ohms automatically.

 

[cyclotron]

says one of the new Zcultists.

Says the one that doesn't know that SS is lighter than brass and doesn't know that the Provari has its own flaws such as higher vampire drain. And last but not least, seems to be fighting a war that is amusing since nobody cares.

See we both can do that....

 

[justinred]

 

[Baditude]

This post brought to you by the person that started the thread "Provari, why all the haters?".

My comment was for his sound decision to skip the mid-level mods with questionable longivity and nonexistant longterm support for the tried and true Provari whose reputation is based on those very factors. Disposables vs non-disposable. I agreed with the rationale that he made his decision with. That was the point of the homework analogy.