Vaping for the Mentally Impaired

[PRboy25]

Well When i first got my kit I order 18mg that was like 3 weeks back and from a pack of newport a day, I went to vaping 1 18mg cartomizer and like 3 analogs cigs, but then I order some 11mg and they are just not strong an off for me so now im smoking about 1 carto of 11mg plus about 8+ analogos a day, until tomorrow that my Big order of 18mg gets here If I cant cut back completely on analogos with 18mg im going up to 24mg, So i would say If she smoke a pack a day or regular then get here 24mg if she smoke more then that a day go with the 36mg

 

[aubergine]

Thirty years of practicing psychotherapy here.

If she can handle matches, lighter and lit cigarettes, she should be able to handle an ecig. I wouldn't worry too much about the subclinical level of Mao-inhibitors in cigarettes - they're not even significant enough carry a warning re contraindications (very significant in clinical doses). She's almost certainly already getting a cocktail of big guns antipsychotics and other psychotropics - tobacco MAOs most likely an insignificant drop in the bucket. But check with her psychiatrist yada yada.

If she needs to be supervised when smoking (and she obviously does in use of the patch, unless she stopped that when properly instructed), then the same would apply with ecigs. She hasn't burned the house down, right? Nicotine overdose would be a concern if she likes them very much. Otherwise I think it's a workable idea, though that's not a professional opinion as I don't know her.

I'd very much like to see ecigs introduced into psychiatric units and hospitals. They dole out patches, but they're not very effective, and highly anxious patients suddenly tossed into withdrawal must wait for whenever the designated "smoke break" occurs if they're at a hospital that allows that on the grounds at all. This usually becomes a behavior management tool, which I find deplorable. "If you don't calm down, then no cigarette break." Very cruel and irrational, as are many practices in this ignoble profession. (You don't want to get me started.)

As for drinking the juice, schizophrenics don't usually lack that sort of judgement, if the situation is explained. If she's suicidal and told that it's poison, however, I'd not have it around. I'm sorry for the tremendous difficulties your family has been having - it's a tough one.

We are all self-medicating with nicotine.

 

[pianoguy]

My sister-in-law is also schizophrenic, and we gave her a couple batteries, a charger and some cartos to try. She tried it but didn't stick with it - unfortunately we don't see her often, and I think some steady encouragement is needed. It would be great if she'd switch - as has been noted, many schizophrenic people smoke heavily, and it really affects her breathing.

As a side note, I really had no idea what her illness was like until we saw "A Beautiful Mind" - what an eye-opener! It certainly explained a lot of her behavior when she was younger.

 

[Belletrist]

wow, *excellent* post on so many levels aubergine!

 

[martha1014]

I had no problem quitting cigarettes. I have been vaping 11 months now. Not all people with mental illness is irresponsible. Under the correct medications many people can live a normal life. I am no different than most of you as long as I take my medications. Don't assume someone diagnosed with mental illness is dangerous to themselves or others.

Mental illness would increase someone's chances of not vaping all together.

 

[aubergine]

"Mental illness" is a metaphor, not a precise denotation, and a disastrous one, unless organic neurological damage can be detected.
No. I am not going to get started. No.

Martha, you are correct, although I don't know why persons designated mentally ill would be more or less likely to vape.

 

[Katya]

We are all self-medicating with nicotine.

Yes we are.

 

[Kate51]

Wow, interesting All! What a nice sister-in-law you are cschells! I have to tell you, it was really easy to cut down nic with an e-cig, so that may be an option down the road a bit. I will probably always use nicotine, I self-medicate too for ADD. It really helps me cope with tiresome organizing and frustrating memory dis-connects. Seems that people with issues also smoke like chimneys, but it always helped keep my mood swings more even in the middle instead of high-highs or lower-than-low. It was the cigarette smoke that was killing me, so wish you all the best with this mission!

 

[cschells]

Okay! Thanks for your thoughtful replies, Aubergine, PRBoy and Pianoguy! She's functional enough and has lived with her illness for 35 years or more. And you're right, Aubergine, she's crazy, not stupid, and likely would not drink juice (I'll keep sending her cartos, anyway, as long as she asks). And she's never been suicidal. Husband and I are also trying to get her to play Wii more often but that's not working as well as the e-cigarettes!

 

[JohnnyVapor]

I'm not sure how it would be in someone who has schizophrenia, but in most people they'll self-titrate their own proper level of nicotine, i.e. someone who went from normal cigarettes to lights will smoke more often, or inhale more deeply. I think that she'd probably find her proper nicotine level and stick with it, especially as nicotine overdose is really unpleasant. As for the safety of the hardware, I don't see any major problems.

 

[Slickstick]

My sister in law is schizophrenic living with her mom. Don't know if you know this about people with mental health issues, but they tend to smoke A LOT. In an effort to get her to cut down on all the chemicals she consumes, I have introduced her to e-cigarettes. She made me laugh the first time she tried it. She inhaled and then started coughing and handed it right back to me without a word. But the next morning she asked about it again.

Encouraged, I gave her a battery and 5 or 6 carts I had on me. Just 4 and 18mg but I ordered her 32mg black tea carts with her first kit. This is the girl when she got her first nicotine patch supply, stuck them all over her body. And she drinks a lot of black tea.

I guess she is using it because her battery died quickly so the next day I exchanged it for another battery (didn't have a charger on me or I would have given her one of those as well).

I don't know if this is a question or an anecdote... I think she'll smoke regular cigarettes as well as doing the vaping thing, but I've committed to keeping her "supplied". Does anyone else smoke regular cigarettes as well as vaping? How much nicotine do you order if you do? Does anyone have any experience getting a mentally impaired person to switch habits? I think she'll get frustrated by the vaping experience as it's not as instantly gratifying and easy as lighting up. She has to be responsible for keeping her batteries charged and I'm worried she might not realise when the cartridges are kaput although I've tried to describe and warn her.

I have done this also with my sister.
After watching her use it I was in horror.

I do not advise it for a few reasons.

Some of which are...

Nobody knows the outcome of vaping 36mg straight LITERALLY nonstop for 24 hours or more. (you know they need lots of nicotine and will chain vape if they had the chance.)

It could effect medications and dosage in a very negative way.

The juice spilling and mess the juice makes takes cleaning and care (they don't clean very well and are careless and forgetful.)

They lose items often (I bought my sis a set of headphones twice a year because she looses them all the time or they get stolen)

They will burn up an atty in an hour.

I could just picture her room with nicotine stains and spilled juice all over her clothes and room. Proper brushing of teeth and washing of hands is also absolutely necessary.

I highly advise against it unless you yourself are supervising her vape sessions.

 

[Slickstick]

Some people with this illness may be able to use it, but the more severe cases would need supervision IMO.

 

[5cardstud]

I have a family member who is bi-polar and she has her moments when she doesn't take her meds. I think someone will have to spend alot of time with her vaping so she knows when it's empty or flooded or the battery is dead etc. They see the world differently than we do. I would also be skeptical about giving her any juice to refill her carts if she put all those patches on. I would also make sure she knows not to refill it with anything else like dangerous substances. I mean this in a loving manner and hope no offense is taken. JMO

 

[keyzygirl]

They were talking about cartomizers,not handing her a pv and a bottle of 36.That would be a bad idea.I think cartos are fairly safe.My son has severe rapid cycling bipolar and he looses everything,so I would have to purchase several batts a week.Instead I have him vape at home,no more fire worries at night.

 

[Slickstick]

Cartomizers would dry up in 5 minutes if my sister used them. And she would probably keep vaping it dry. seriously.

 

[Slickstick]

Let me restate that. Factory cartomizers would dry up in 5 minutes if My sister used them.
I can't say vfl cartomizers would do the same.
I Didn't realize I was on a vfl post.

 

[keyzygirl]

I know what you mean,my son uses them alot quicker than I do.He only visits so its not a 7 day a week thing.It could get expensive.It seems safer though.

 

[Adrenalynn]

Nobody knows the outcome of vaping 36mg straight LITERALLY nonstop for 24 hours or more. (you know they need lots of nicotine and will chain vape if they had the chance.)

Actually - "everyone" knows the outcome of nicotine OD. Since she smokes cigarettes, I think we've already established that that's not an issue. (That, and I chainvape 36mg as much as 20hrs a day. If I OD, I lay down for a few minutes, or eat a slice of pizza. ODing on inhaled nicotine to a point that is dangerous is incredibly difficult because it is so self-regulating)

It could effect medications and dosage in a very negative way.

But absolutely better than the thousands of chemicals she's ingesting now with cigarettes

The juice spilling and mess the juice makes takes cleaning and care (they don't clean very well and are careless and forgetful.)

Wrong forum. We don't suffer that.

They will burn up an atty in an hour.

Nor that.

I could just picture her room with nicotine stains and spilled juice all over her clothes and room. Proper brushing of teeth and washing of hands is also absolutely necessary.

Nor that.



Right church, wrong pew.

 

[aubergine]

Adrenalynne is correct, in my view. As usual.
I don't see how vaping could "mess up" meds in any case; she already smokes, and nicotine is not contraindicated in any psychotropic med that I've ever heard of. As someone noted, persons with that diagnosis very frequently take meds and smoke. Is FIRE less dangerous when mismanagement might be an issue than vaping products? How about oxygen equipment when she develops COPD? Eh.

 

[aubergine]

Just caught this, cshells: "And you're right, Aubergine, she's crazy, not stupid."

Exactly. There are so many misconceptions about this very broad population, and so much individual variance re simple practical judgement, which is sometimes not significantly impaired at all... I've worked with schizophrenic folks who can cook a 4 course gourmet meal w/no supervision at all , who can fix your car, or prepare your taxes or speculate on the fine points of Hegelian philosophy, and some who had best be supervised in the presence of a fork. Schizophrenia is not mental ......ation. Grossly disorganized behavior is not a requirement for the diagnosis, though it may be present in some cases.