Was I Way Out of Line Here?

[DeadbeatJeff]

Earlier today I saw a post in a FB vape-trading group I used to belong to, in which the guy was raffling off an authentic Caravella #386 - 33 slots for $30 per slot.

I posted something to the effect of, "So what you want is to sell a mod for $1000 and are hiding that fact with this BS?"

And was subsequently banned from the group, without any discussion, by the admin.

I'm just curious if I was really out of line... cause it seemed to me to be a flipper scam to make more from a mod than it is reasonably worth. That I was banned immediately, without anyone even talking to me about it on any level at all, makes me question the integrity of the whole group.

What do yall think? My bad or not?

 

[Smellofcordite]

Personally I find the whole situation rather intriguing. It may be a little immoral for this person to profit off of others, but it is also an opportunity for some lucky person to get a nice mod at a great price.

You may have been banned for your delivery, but I don't think it was out of line to call them out on it. Especially if the raffle is only for personal gain not charity.

 

[Rule62]

Interesting question. I hadn't seen this. Apparently, I'm not a member of that particular group; although I do belong to several FB vaping groups.
On the one hand, I've seen Carvelas go for well north of $1000 in the past. If the guy had simply posted the thing for sale at 1K, he'd probably have gotten it, fairly quickly. I dunno. Maybe the group has a cap on what a re seller can charge, like some groups do, 20% over original price, or whatever; and this is the seller's way to sneak around the cap.

 

[WattWick]

Personally I find the whole situation rather intriguing. It may be a little immoral for this person to profit off of others, but it is also an opportunity for some lucky person to get a nice mod at a great price.

You may have been banned for your delivery, but I don't think it was out of line to call them out on it. Especially if the raffle is only for personal gain not charity.

It's also a way for 32 people to pay $33 too much for nothing

Not really arguing. Sometimes I'm more of a glass half empty kinda guy. If it was a raffle for some good cause, I wouldn't think twice about it. If that "good cause" is more padding for some guys wallet, I think I would have reacted like Jeff.

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Interesting question. I hadn't seen this. Apparently, I'm not a member of that particular group; although I do belong to several FB vaping groups.
On the one hand, I've seen Carvelas go for well north of $1000 in the past. If the guy had simply posted the thing for sale at 1K, he'd probably have gotten it, fairly quickly. I dunno. Maybe the group has a cap on what a re seller can charge, like some groups do, 20% over original price, or whatever; and this is the seller's way to sneak around the cap.

Ah, so they are actually worth that much? wowzers

BUT

I suppose a brief convo followed by my public apology would have diffused the situation enough. they just kicked me out

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Interesting question. I hadn't seen this. Apparently, I'm not a member of that particular group; although I do belong to several FB vaping groups.
On the one hand, I've seen Carvelas go for well north of $1000 in the past. If the guy had simply posted the thing for sale at 1K, he'd probably have gotten it, fairly quickly. I dunno. Maybe the group has a cap on what a re seller can charge, like some groups do, 20% over original price, or whatever; and this is the seller's way to sneak around the cap.

was Vape Trading and Group Buys

kinda sore about it, cause I liked that group

If you're in it, msg Ken and let him know that in the future there are likely better ways to handle situations like this

 

[Rule62]

Ah, so they are actually worth that much?

I don't know if they're worth it. I guess they're worth whatever a buyer is willing to pay. To collectors, Carvelas are real unicorns. I've seen them go for outrageous prices.

 

[blueGrassTubb]

Personally I find the whole situation rather intriguing. It may be a little immoral for this person to profit off of others, but it is also an opportunity for some lucky person to get a nice mod at a great price.

You may have been banned for your delivery, but I don't think it was out of line to call them out on it. Especially if the raffle is only for personal gain not charity.

Since when is it immoral to profit?

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Since when is it immoral to profit?

Go ask people who didn't get into the show 'cause a scalper bought 50 tix and wants 10x the face value.

 

[WattWick]

Since when is it immoral to profit?

Nothing wrong with profit in itself. It's how you go about it that may or may not be questionable.

There are a lot of ways to make huge profits that are frowned upon by most civilized societies... even outlawed.

 

[blueGrassTubb]

Earlier today I saw a post in a FB vape-trading group I used to belong to, in which the guy was raffling off an authentic Caravella #386 - 33 slots for $30 per slot.

I posted something to the effect of, "So what you want is to sell a mod for $1000 and are hiding that fact with this BS?"

And was subsequently banned from the group, without any discussion, by the admin.

I'm just curious if I was really out of line... cause it seemed to me to be a flipper scam to make more from a mod than it is reasonably worth. That I was banned immediately, without anyone even talking to me about it on any level at all, makes me question the integrity of the whole group.

What do yall think? My bad or not?

If you thought it was a bad deal why did you care enough to write the seller/raffler? If you don't agree with how he does things, don't participate. It's not your responsibility to hold others to your moral standards. I know that if you tried that with something I was selling, I'd tell you exactly where to go, and it wouldn't be a nice place. If no one participates, he'll get the message and change things up.

It's pretty simple. If you don't like the way it's done, don't participate.

In short, MYOB.

I'm not trying to be rude, but there's only so many ways to say it. My apologies.

 

[blueGrassTubb]

Nothing wrong with profit in itself. It's how you go about it that may or may not be questionable.

There are a lot of ways to make huge profits that are frowned upon by most civilized societies... even outlawed.

And raffles is one of them?

The guy was looking to get what the fair market brings for an authentic Caravela, yet only asking one single person to pay $33.

That's a pretty tame way to profit from something.

 

[Smellofcordite]

It is not immoral to profit. I just worded that wrong. As a matter of fact as a business owner I am stunned I said it that way. The FB user selling the mod is playing the game and he is winning. I think Jeff is right in that he is scalping in a way.

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Was just a passing comment, and I dislike flippers. Maybe that wasn't the case, and maybe he thought he was doing everyone a favor.

All it would have taken was an explanation. What happened was he went crying to the admin who booted me without any discussion at all.

 

[blueGrassTubb]

Go ask people who didn't get into the show 'cause a scalper bought 50 tix and wants 10x the face value.

Is this guy a scalper? Did he buy 10 Caravelas with the intent of selling them at a huge profit? Or is he a guy who's looking to get what he feels the MOD is worth, while only asking any single person to pay a mall fraction of that amount?

And even in the scalper's case, it might be a bit ====D-ish, but so long as there are those who are willing to pay his prices voluntarily, there's nothing wrong with it. If he couldn't sell those tix at those prices to people who are willing to pay them, he wouldn't be selling tix at those prices.

 

[BostonVape]

I stopped joining vape groups on FB.. 99% of the members of the few I joined, were elitist, know at all's, who could care less about helping fellow vapers.. they just want to make fun of your setup or say you are not even worth their time unless you are into crazy sub-ohm builds..

I saw a few people ask very normal questions and were berated for using clearomizers or not knowing how to rebuild coils.. I forget the names of them, but I left the groups a long time ago..

I wouldn't even stress about it..

 

[blueGrassTubb]

It is not immoral to profit. I just worded that wrong. As a matter of fact as a business owner I am stunned I said it that way. The FB user selling the mod is playing the game and he is winning. I think Jeff is right in that he is scalping in a way.

Got it. We all make wording mistakes from time to time. It's just the idea of making a profit = something bad is a very popular sentiment in America of late, and it's easy to believe someone at face value these days when they make a statement like that.

But is the guy who pays $33 for a legit Caravela really losing? People who engage in a raffle know exactly what they're getting in to, and they know the odds of winning.

Are school raffles a scalp job?

It seems to me that there are LOTS of people who would pay $33 just for the chance of winning a legit Caravela. I'm not one of them, but that doesn't mean those people don't exist. And in the event they don't the seller will have to change his methods.

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

And even in the scalper's case, it might be a bit ====D-ish, but so long as there are those who are willing to pay his prices voluntarily, there's nothing wrong with it. If he couldn't sell those tix at those prices to people who are willing to pay them, he wouldn't be selling tix at those prices.

You should work for Nestle, who very reasonably thinks that all water should be privatized and sold for profit. After all, people will pay for it.

Nothing wrong with scalpers? Who make it so people who love music but aren't rich can't get in? Who make more per ticket than the band and the venue?

rt

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Got it. We all make wording mistakes from time to time. It's just the idea of making a profit = something bad is a very popular sentiment in America of late, and it's easy to believe someone at face value these days when they make a statement like that.

But is the guy who pays $33 for a legit Caravela really losing? People who engage in a raffle know exactly what they're getting in to, and they know the odds of winning.

Are school raffles a scalp job?

It seems to me that there are LOTS of people who would pay $33 just for the chance of winning a legit Caravela. I'm not one of them, but that doesn't mean those people don't exist. And in the event they don't the seller will have to change his methods.

dude I get it and maybe I was out of line

I didn't even have time to contemplate it though, and had no recourse = banned and blocked

-----------------

BUT

Nothing wrong with profit per se; however, there is something wrong with certain kinda of profit.

Usury? not cool, even though people may be *willing to accept the terms. A variable rate cc that will go from 15% to 35% the first time you make a late payment? Mortgage with similar penalties, by which banks foreclose on homes, derivatives of these junk mortgages, because of which the entire economy is depressed for a decade?

Some profit is bad

 

[blueGrassTubb]

I stopped joining vape groups on FB.. 99% of the members of the few I joined, were elitist, know at all's, who could care less about helping fellow vapers.. they just want to make fun of your setup or say you are not even worth their time unless you are into crazy sub-ohm builds..

I saw a few people ask very normal questions and were berated for using clearomizers or not knowing how to rebuild coils.. I forget the names of them, but I left the groups a long time ago..

I wouldn't even stress about it..

There is definitely an air of elitist sentiment on many FB groups. Unfortunately it's the best way to get info on many new MODs or modding methods/tools/materials.

And the cloud chasers are patently annoying, especially the young 19 year olds who conflate "knowing what you're doing" with building super sub-Ω coils and blowing massive clouds, and nothing else. I've seen plenty of people being outright stupid on FB groups with their .12Ω builds and a 30A battery. I'm far more insprired by the guy who can wrap a 1.3Ω coil and vape it at 18W and getting great vapor than I am with the kid wrapping .18Ω coils and blowing fog with his mech.

Many vapers couldn't care less about seeing how hot one can take one's vapor or blowing massive clouds. I'm one of them. I vape primarily with Kayfuns in the 1.2Ω-1.7Ω range and creating a personal fog bank is pretty low on the list of things I feel are important in my vaping experience, yet that experience is set aside as amateur by huge swaths of the vaping community.