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ShowMeTwice

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Are you using a clapton in a kayfun prime ? Could you post a pick of your build. Do you know if the deck the same size as a kayfun lite 2019 ?

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The build deck of the Prime and nKFL are identical right down to size. I had an order for a SVM kayfun lite 2019 (nKFL) but cancelled it due to the delays. After talking with some other folks we came to the conclusion that the nKFL is merely a Prime "lite". I bought 2 Primes when they were released. They are excellent RTA's and IMO very easy to build on.

Photo... this one is from another Prime that I happened to have a pic of. It's a 28/36 ss316L clapton coming in at 0.6 ohms and 7 wrap 2.5mm ID. I'm running it anywhere from 16-22w.
Excellent vape in wattage or TC.

IMG_1043cr.jpg
 

Edgree

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The build deck of the Prime and nKFL are identical right down to size. I had an order for a SVM Kayfun lite 2019 (nKFL) but cancelled it due to the delays. After talking with some other folks we came to the conclusion that the nKFL is merely a Prime "lite". I bought 2 Primes when they were released. They are excellent RTA's and IMO very easy to build on.

Photo... this one is from another Prime that I happened to have a pic of. It's a 28/36 ss316L clapton coming in at 0.6 ohms and 7 wrap 2.5mm ID. I'm running it anywhere from 16-22w.
Excellent vape in wattage or TC.

View attachment 830319
I really appreciate the pic now Im going to have to try that build in my kf lite 2019.

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DeloresRose

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@m1ke , I setup another Prime RTA today with a 28/36 ss316L clapton coming in at 0.8 ohms and I tested it out at 12w (your wattage) and between 400-440F in TC. It's a really nice vape. Have you considered trying claptons? If so Lightning Vapes has spools of 28/36 ss316L clapton wire. LV is where I got the wire I'm using and they are reasonable price wise. They also sell pre-made coils if you just wanted to try claptons to see if you like them.

Link to 28/36 ss316L clapton spool: Clapton Wire Spools - 25'

And pre-made coils: Clapton Wire Coils - Single Core SS 316L / SS 316L - 10 Pack


I get mine from AVS. When they have a sale, it’s usually a really good sale.

Stainless Steel Wire
 

muth

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So much complexity to achieve such a simple result.
A famous jazz musician once said practice and learn everything you have to know. Then when it comes to performing, forget all of it!

I took this to mean that it was very important to educate myself the best I could. Then when it came time to implement just let go and trust. Once I got the hang of vaping all sorts of devices in different styles it seems like second nature to choose the right temperature, wattage, coil.....juice. Yep, to me some flavors are better warmer or cooler. But then I use celsius and might confuse the whole thread. And I'm babbling again so I'll end it there.
 

GeorgeS

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    I use 24-28AWG TI or NiFe. Always in TC mode. While there is a school of thought that says turn the wattage up all the way and let the mod regulate the temperature, I on the other hand use whatever wattage setting that will allow the coil to reach its temperature set point with in a few seconds.

    On most mods and builds it ends up being between 25-40W.
     

    HigherStateD

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    I use 24-28AWG TI or NiFe. Always in TC mode. While there is a school of thought that says turn the wattage up all the way and let the mod regulate the temperature, I on the other hand use whatever wattage setting that will allow the coil to reach its temperature set point with in a few seconds.

    On most mods and builds it ends up being between 25-40W.
    I use ss316l, and agree whole heatedly. Turn the wattage past optimum, and the temp overshoot becomes an issue.

    I'd like to contribute more, but I have no idea how to calculate heat flux... I do not use round wire coils.
     

    Punk In Drublic

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    I'd like to contribute more, but I have no idea how to calculate heat flux... I do not use round wire coils.

    Heat Flux within Steam is 1 watt (or 1000 Milliwatts) divided by the coils calculated surface area. If using 1 watt for the calculation, you need to multiply the end result by 1000 to get a reading in mW/mm²

    Should 200mW/mm² be your goal. Within the Wire Wizard tab, divide 200 by the coil’s Heat Flux per Watt value to receive the optimal wattage.

    If you wish to know what Heat Flux a coil produces under a specific wattage. Multiply your wattage by the Heat Flux per Watt value.

    Example: 26 awg, 5 wraps around 3mm ID = 82.56mm² surface area.

    1000 miliwatts/82.56 = 12.11 mW/mm² (as noted by Steam)

    200 (desired Heat Flux)/12.11 = 16.5 watts

    10 watts x 12.11 = 121 Heat Flux

    The problem with Heat Flux values within Steam is they do not factor in both saturation and air flow for obvious reasons. They also calculate the entire wire’s surface area including multiple wires such as what is used within Clapton coils which gives a very inaccurate resault. The developer understands this and has no plans to modify.

    Using TC the device is always adjusting your wattage – do not see how one can follow any kind of Heat Flux value in this situation.
     

    HigherStateD

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    Heat Flux within Steam is 1 watt (or 1000 Milliwatts) divided by the coils calculated surface area. If using 1 watt for the calculation, you need to multiply the end result by 1000 to get a reading in mW/mm²

    Should 200mW/mm² be your goal. Within the Wire Wizard tab, divide 200 by the coil’s Heat Flux per Watt value to receive the optimal wattage.

    If you wish to know what Heat Flux a coil produces under a specific wattage. Multiply your wattage by the Heat Flux per Watt value.

    Example: 26 awg, 5 wraps around 3mm ID = 82.56mm² surface area.

    1000 miliwatts/82.56 = 12.11 mW/mm² (as noted by Steam)

    200 (desired Heat Flux)/12.11 = 16.5 watts

    10 watts x 12.11 = 121 Heat Flux

    The problem with Heat Flux values within Steam is they do not factor in both saturation and air flow for obvious reasons. They also calculate the entire wire’s surface area including multiple wires such as what is used within Clapton coils which gives a very inaccurate resault. The developer understands this and has no plans to modify.

    Using TC the device is always adjusting your wattage – do not see how one can follow any kind of Heat Flux value in this situation.
    I understand the theory, my issue is more basic, but shouldn't threadjack. To summarize though, I have a difficult time making simple coils, and wire wizard doesn't seem to calculate the wire I have properly. Any value I would give, would be so erroneous, and to be worse than useless.
     

    Punk In Drublic

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    I understand the theory, my issue is more basic, but shouldn't threadjack. To summarize though, I have a difficult time making simple coils, and wire wizard doesn't seem to calculate the wire I have properly. Any value I would give, would be so erroneous, and to be worse than useless.

    Isn’t this thread about Heat Flux?

    What is Wire Wizard getting wrong?
     

    Punk In Drublic

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    Yes, thats why I'm not contributing more, but following.
    Wire wizard is wrong about the resistance of my finished coil

    There can be many reasons for that. Ambient temperature, accuracy/resolution of the device reading your coils resistance, additional resistances such as internal resistance within your device/the resistance of your atomizer, etc.

    Wire Wizard works off of set parameters. Such parameters can be very different to the wire you are using. Kanthal, as an example, is an alloy that can allow a variance of +/- 10% of Chromium and +/- 3.5% of Aluminum (according to Wiki). Is the gauge of wire you are using exactly as Steams set parameters down to the thousandths of a mm? Is the coil Jig exact to Steams values, is the length of wire used within your coil exact to Steam’s calculations.

    And as you know, a coil’s resistance changes with temperature – some more than others. So is the ambient temperature the same as what Steam Engine referenced for your type of wire.

    Steam Engine is just a guide that provides a numerical value for you to compare coil A with coil B. It’s accuracy to your build is dependent on whether you are using wire that has the exact specifications as it does. Said specifications needs to come from the wire’s manufacture, and even then the numbers may not be accurate.

    Or one can perform objective measurements to find their own wire specifications. But this would render Steam to be of little or no value – why count on a virtual calculator when you can just measure for your self and obtain exact measurements.

    Edit: Just measured the thickness of 24 awg Titanium wire I have on hand, which should be 0.5106mm. My wire = 0.47mm. Steam = 0.511.
     
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    HigherStateD

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    There can be many reasons for that. Ambient temperature, accuracy/resolution of the device reading your coils resistance, additional resistances such as internal resistance within your device/the resistance of your atomizer, etc.

    Wire Wizard works off of set parameters. Such parameters can be very different to the wire you are using. Kanthal, as an example, is an alloy that can allow a variance of +/- 10% of Chromium and +/- 3.5% of Aluminum (according to Wiki). Is the gauge of wire you are using exactly as Steams set parameters down to the thousandths of a mm? Is the coil Jig exact to Steams values, is the length of wire used within your coil exact to Steam’s calculations.

    And as you know, a coil’s resistance changes with temperature – some more than others. So is the ambient temperature the same as what Steam Engine referenced for your type of wire.

    Steam Engine is just a guide that provides a numerical value for you to compare coil A with coil B. It’s accuracy to your build is dependent on whether you are using wire that has the exact specifications as it does. Said specifications needs to come from the wire’s manufacture, and even then the numbers may not be accurate.

    Or one can perform objective measurements to find their own wire specifications. But this would render Steam to be of little or no value – why count on a virtual calculator when you can just measure for your self and obtain exact measurements.

    Edit: Just measured the thickness of 24 awg Titanium wire I have on hand, which should be 0.5106mm. My wire = 0.47mm. Steam = 0.511.
    It's off by more than a margin of error I'm comfortable with. What it thinks should be 0.18, is reading, on two mods, as 0.35. I doubt the heat flux calculation is useful.
     
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    AngeNZ

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    A famous jazz musician once said practice and learn everything you have to know. Then when it comes to performing, forget all of it!

    I took this to mean that it was very important to educate myself the best I could. Then when it came time to implement just let go and trust. Once I got the hang of vaping all sorts of devices in different styles it seems like second nature to choose the right temperature, wattage, coil.....juice. Yep, to me some flavors are better warmer or cooler. But then I use celsius and might confuse the whole thread. And I'm babbling again so I'll end it there.

    We make a good pair - I'm a kiwi who uses Celsius for everything except TC vaping where I use Fahrenheit :lol:

    I think the OP would love as much info as he can get, so share your build - regardless of what it is measured in :thumb:
     

    Punk In Drublic

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    It's off by more than a margin of error I'm comfortable with. What it thinks should be 0.18, is reading, on two mods, as 0.35. I doubt the heat flux calculation is useful.

    Yes, I would say that is a significant margin. But if you care to put forth the efforts to investigate, you may find the reasons why. Could be vastly different parameters between the metals you are using vs Steam – or it could be a deficiencies with your build. Dirty contacts, broken wire (especially with multi core Claptons), or lose post screws. Many possibilities. Just keep in mind that all Steam is doing is adding 2+2 (in simple terms), and is doing so accurately. If you are unknowingly dealing with 2+4, or 2+200, then your results will not reflect Steam.

    One thing I have noticed with Steam is depending on the browser used, certain values can become locked, or perhaps better put stuck, which will skew your final result. This has happened to me in both the coil calculations tabs and the e-juice calculator. I do not know if this is a bug within Steam, or the browser – have only discovered this issue with Gecko based browsers (Mozilla and its many variants). A refresh of the page rectifies the problem, and if not, a flush of your cache/history will. Not saying that is your issue, but something to note.
     

    muth

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    We make a good pair - I'm a kiwi who uses Celsius for everything except TC vaping where I use Fahrenheit :lol:

    I think the OP would love as much info as he can get, so share your build - regardless of what it is measured in :thumb:
    Love it! See now, I don't understand why Yanks or anyone, for that matter, would use Fahrenheit on a TC mod when Celsius is a shorter, quicker scroll. Yep, I'm always looking for a shortcut. Has anyone else considered this besides me? I'll tell ya', vaping has made me a more intelligent person:laugh:. I now measure using the metric system when most americans still use Imperial. Sure, I guess it's handy to use your feet, elbow and fingers when you don't have a ruler handy:lol:
     

    muth

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    I use ss316l, and agree whole heatedly. Turn the wattage past optimum, and the temp overshoot becomes an issue.

    I'd like to contribute more, but I have no idea how to calculate heat flux... I do not use round wire coils.
    With the exception of a few, the majority of folks here don't either....we use Steam Engine's calculators. It's a great way to look real smart;)Lol
     

    m1ke

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    We make a good pair - I'm a kiwi who uses Celsius for everything except TC vaping where I use Fahrenheit :lol:

    I think the OP would love as much info as he can get, so share your build - regardless of what it is measured in :thumb:
    I have a good idea of C temps. I don't like the Imperial measurement system either. We're the only country that uses the .....
     
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