What gauge of wire do you use?... and why?

[Ryedan]

O...M...G! I read this and decided to go into my bathroom, in front of the mirror, and do a little experiment. I took a drag like I normally would and exhaled it in front of the mirror. Then I did a second and focused on actually doing a lung hit. The difference in the amount of vapor I exhaled, and the density as well, was significant. I've been mouth to lunging a .2 ohm coil. It appears the issue I've been having with vapor density wasn't my coil, my mod, or even my wicking. Turns out it was me. (Facepalm!) Gonna definitely try that 4 millimeter idea though. I'd like to see my coils wick a little faster.

This is why it's so hard sometimes to help people troubleshoot a problem online. 'Little' details can really get you .

Glad to see @Revelene got you sorted out with this one. Air flow is important, the more power you use the more of it you need to keep from wasting that power. And the less power, the less you want, hence why tootle puffers prefer mouth to lung. It helps cut down the amount of air moved through the atty per drag. That's important at 10 watts.

@Boden's point about keeping the whole coil in the air flow path is also a very good one IMO. I've found that if I make the coil too much longer than the air hole the ends of the coil will gunk up faster than the middle section, probably because the ends are running hotter than the middle. In some attys with round holes I find vertical coils are better for that reason.

Using bigger diameter coils is a great way to handle finished coil length too. It's been a while since I've made a micro coil because of that.

 

[MrDripper]

For me, it all depends on what build I am doing. If it's straight up coils (I always use 2), I use 26G Kanthal. If it's something a little more advanced like say, a clapton, I use 2 strands of 24g Kanthal as my core, wrapped in 30g NiChrome. Aliens are triple strands of 24g NiChrome core and wrapped in 32g NiChrome.
NiChrome heats up faster than Kanthal but Kanthal has a higher melting point. The difference is very minimal to me. I like both kinds of wire equally.
I don't mess with Nickel or Titanium at all as I have no need for a TC device. I like vaping at .3 or .5 and the temp is almost the same on both kinds of wire.

 

[Visus]

I've got a TIG welder that I've used for the same thing.

I figured you did with wrapping like that and your ecf join date, I kept going for someone who doesn't know they exist.. They are killer for those type coils heck for any most popular in atomizers today offset coils that little extra step guarantee no hot legs ever.. It why people love the velocity so much with even spaced legs.

 

[carlyO]

My first wire purchases when I started building a few months ago consisted of many many feet of 28g and 30g...seemed like a good place to start. Came to realize the 30g is almost useless to me for regular single coil type builds. However, since having spent wayyyy too many hours browing the forums I have learned about twisted and parallel coils. I basically only build parallel or twisted (or a combination of the two) at this point, the 28g and 30g both lend themselves really well to those types of builds. I love the tinkering aspect of vaping...at this point (I vape 3mg DIY), I'm not sure if I'm still chasing the nicotene or the hobby side of it. I love trying different builds/wicking techniques...so I ordered some 26g. Waiting for that to come now. My favorite build so far has to be triple twisted 30g dual coils. Usually 5/6 wraps comes in right around .5 ohms(ish) depending on inner diameter. I like to build with a decent inner diameter not sure of mm, but gives plenty of space for wicking and allows for small increase in resistance when I'm doing a lot of strands twisted/parallel etc.

 

[ian-field]

I've spent the last couple of months experimenting with wire. Between all the different gauges, and different builds, I feel I'm no closer to finding my sweet spot. It feels like I'm on a never ending quest to find that perfect balance between flavor and vapor production. It just never ceases to amaze me how complex this little hobby can be.

After finally getting the chance to work with 22 gauge wire, I wasn't as impressed with it as I thought I would be. My hope was that at 9 wraps it would perform about as well as a 26 gauge parallel coil of the same length and resistance. ( by length I'm referring to the overall surface area ) It didn't. The vapor production and flavor was much better on the parallel coil, and my RDA didn't heat up nearly as bad. Go figure.

Now, keeping in mind that most coils I build generally fall in the range of .2 to .4, I'm curious to see what gauge of wire most people seem to gravitate towards. Also, do you get better results with dual single coils, or dual parallels? The possibilities here are simply endless, and I don't think I'm going to live long enough to try them all. A little feedback from the community on this will go a long way.

End of line.

IME: small changes in the essential parameters (like wire gauge) make a big difference to the end result.

The wire I bought was higher resistivity than wire I'd salvaged, so the 0.17mm wire I got lumbered with was way too thin.

Initially I had acceptable results by twisting a pair of wires together before winding the coil onto the wick. Since then, I've been getting even better results by twisting 3 strands - but I'm using a lot more juice.

Originally I was using 5 wraps and aiming somewhere around 1.2 - 1.5 Ohm, with the thicker bundle I put an extra wrap on and get a lot closer to 1.0 Ohm.

 

[Revelene]

Huh. Well ain't that something. I think this was the nail in the coffin for 22 gauge wire as far as I'm concerned. I think I'm going to go back to something smaller. I really haven't been that happy with the 22 gauge anyway.

End of line.

Don't let that stop you from experimenting.

Yes, physical contact with the wick is less with higher gauge wire... but that isn't the whole story. See the larger gaps? Liquid does go into said gaps, so the overall surface area that is vaporizing liquid is much higher with 22g.

Seriously, just experiment and find what works best for you.

 

[Boden]

Yes, physical contact with the wick is less with higher gauge wire... but that isn't the whole story. See the larger gaps? Liquid does go into said gaps, so the overall surface area that is vaporizing liquid is much higher with 22g.

For a fraction of a second there is liquid filling the gap, after that vapor bubble expansion pushes the liquid away from the coil until the vapor bubble is vented between the wraps. Suction caused by the venting vapor bubble combined with surface tension pulls the liquid back against the coil. With large wire this causes spitting because of the volume of the eliquid in the gaps combined with a slow cycle oscillation. Thick eliquid with high surface tension exacerbates this problem as the gas bubbles are larger before they are vented if they have the space to grow.

With smaller gaps the cycle/oscillation is faster with less inertia which increases vapor production and reduces spitting.

The myth of large wire having more surface area is logical at first glance as larger wire does have more surface area (and mass). Problem is we are not heating air, this is a hydrodynamics equation. The contact area of the coil and wick combined with venting potential (recharge speed) of small wire makes it a much more efficient system.

The same myth exists with Art coils. Relative to a simple small wire contact coil covering the same area of wick they are much much less efficient at turning eliquid into vapor. They may have wicking properties but the liquid wicked into the gaps vaporizes within a fraction of a second leaving only the inner contact patch to do all the work while the rest of the coil is exposed to the air. They make some vapor and a lot of hot air.

Art coils such as Clapton may work better than a solid wire of the same overall diameter but that is because of the increased venting between the small wires wrapping the core.

The hydrodynamics involved is a bit more complex than most realize.

 

[Revelene]

For a fraction of a second there is liquid filling the gap, after that vapor bubble expansion pushes the liquid away from the coil until the vapor bubble is vented between the wraps. Suction caused by the venting vapor bubble combined with surface tension pulls the liquid back against the coil. With large wire this causes spitting because of the volume of the eliquid in the gaps combined with a slow cycle oscillation. Thick eliquid with high surface tension exacerbates this problem as the gas bubbles are larger before they are vented if they have the space to grow.

With smaller gaps the cycle/oscillation is faster with less inertia which increases vapor production and reduces spitting.

The myth of large wire having more surface area is logical at first glance as larger wire does have more surface area (and mass). Problem is we are not heating air, this is a hydrodynamics equation. The contact area of the coil and wick combined with venting potential (recharge speed) of small wire makes it a much more efficient system.

The same myth exists with Art coils. Relative to a simple small wire contact coil covering the same area of wick they are much much less efficient at turning eliquid into vapor. They may have wicking properties but the liquid wicked into the gaps vaporizes within a fraction of a second leaving only the inner contact patch to do all the work while the rest of the coil is exposed to the air. They make some vapor and a lot of hot air.

Art coils such as Clapton may work better than a solid wire of the same overall diameter but that is because of the increased venting between the small wires wrapping the core.

The hydrodynamics involved is a bit more complex than most realize.

Don't really care how it works really. I just know that a 22g at 0.4 Ohm performs better than 28g at 0.4 Ohm in my experience. For standard coils, I always get the thinner wire to heat up too quickly and it just cannot keep up with my vaping pref. Something other than surface area is at play here... lower ohms needs thicker wire.

 

[Sm0keydaBear]

Right now while mainly utilizing my mechanical, I'm using lowest gauges possible to get the lowest ohms. Anything above .2 ohms on my mechanical mod and the coil takes too long to heat up (should note that I do mouth to lung hits.)

As far as gauges go, mainly I try to aim for making a clapton coil first, then adjust the size of the gauges. If the gauge is too low to clapton (right now I'm using 30 gauge as the wrap,) then clapton will not be making an appearance.

 

[WattWick]

@both of the above posts;

Think of the coil as a buffer. This buffer needs to be full before any vapor is produced. What you "gain" from thicker wire is simply a bigger buffer. You don't gain any extra vapor production. You simply gain the ability to use more power to produce the same amount of vapor.

 

[Boden]

Don't really care how it works really. I just know that a 22g at 0.4 Ohm performs better than 28g at 0.4 Ohm in my experience. For standard coils, I always get the thinner wire to heat up too quickly and it just cannot keep up with my vaping pref. Something other than surface area is at play here... lower ohms needs thicker wire.

More heat needs more surface area to be spread over.

I'm guessing you are using a mech since you only mention resistance. If you are game I'll design a coil for you using 28 gauge in parellel to be used at 4V/0.4 ohms (40W) that will out perform a 22 gauge coil.

What ID to you prefer?

 

[Boden]

Right now while mainly utilizing my mechanical, I'm using lowest gauges possible to get the lowest ohms. Anything above .2 ohms on my mechanical mod and the coil takes too long to heat up (should note that I do mouth to lung hits.)

As far as gauges go, mainly I try to aim for making a clapton coil first, then adjust the size of the gauges. If the gauge is too low to clapton (right now I'm using 30 gauge as the wrap,) then clapton will not be making an appearance.

You have to go so low because of the mass of the coils you are using.

If you like give this a try.

This is a 9/8 wrap parellel 28 gauge at 2.5mm ID, 0.4 ohms . Do a 7/6 for 0.3 ohms

 

[tj99959]

Meanwhile back at the farm, I'll just build a 2 ohm 30ga coil, stick it in a 8.5mm ID chamber, and tootle puff away.

Sure is nice that there are so many different ways to do the same thing.

 

[Revelene]

More heat needs more surface area to be spread over.

I'm guessing you are using a mech since you only mention resistance. If you are game I'll design a coil for you using 28 gauge in parellel to be used at 4V/0.4 ohms (40W) that will out perform a 22 gauge coil.

What ID to you prefer?

I'm good but thanks anyways.

I vape quite happily at 0.1 Ohm daily driver with a few coil builds and they are all of thick wire. More surface area is usually always good... but so is the ability of the wire to handle more power. This is where cool specialty coils like the clapton come into play, having both plenty of surface space and enough wire to handle the load.

I know how to build coils. I've been vaping for 4 years, and building my own coils for a little over 3. Teaching many people how to build their own coils and get them kickstarted into a life free of ash. I even have people that want to pay me to build them coils...

No matter how you try to spin it... lower ohms needs thicker wire to handle the power and heat. If not, you end up with a build that will get too hot, too fast and not be able to be held on for more than a couple of seconds without burning the wick... or in extreme cases, glow red even with proper juice flow. It can cause longer inhales to be near impossible without a burnt wick, even if it has plenty of juice on the wick. Been there done that... would rather stab eyes with needles than have a low ohm build with thin wire...

 

[Revelene]

Meanwhile back at the farm, I'll just build a 2 ohm 30ga coil, stick it in a 8.5mm ID chamber, and tootle puff away.

Sure is nice that there are so many different ways to do the same thing.

Hey, some people like that and it is perfectly fine! Whatever keeps you from actual smoking, ammiright?

 

[Boden]

I'm good but thanks anyways.

I vape quite happily at 0.1 Ohm daily driver with a few coil builds and they are all of thick wire. More surface area is usually always good... but so is the ability of the wire to handle more power. This is where cool specialty coils like the clapton come into play, having both plenty of surface space and enough wire to handle the load.

I know how to build coils. I've been vaping for 4 years, and building my own coils for a little over 3. Teaching many people how to build their own coils and get them kickstarted into a life free of ash. I even have people that want to pay me to build them coils...

No matter how you try to spin it... lower ohms needs thicker wire to handle the power and heat. If not, you end up with a build that will get too hot, too fast and not be able to be held on for more than a couple of seconds without burning the wick... or in extreme cases, glow red even with proper juice flow. It can cause longer inhales to be near impossible without a burnt wick, even if it has plenty of juice on the wick. Been there done that... would rather stab eyes with needles than have a low ohm build with thin wire...

I suggest a challenge

You tell me what wattage to hit and I'll create a build using only 28 gauge and vape it in my Velocity.

Just for fun, I want to experience this.

 

[tj99959]

I'm good but thanks anyways.

No matter how you try to spin it... lower ohms needs thicker wire to handle the power and heat. If not, you end up with a build that will get too hot, too fast and not be able to be held on for more than a couple of seconds without burning the wick... or in extreme cases, glow red even with proper juice flow. It can cause longer inhales to be near impossible without a burnt wick, even if it has plenty of juice on the wick. Been there done that... would rather stab eyes with needles than have a low ohm build with thin wire...

Easy solution:
Don't build so low when using thinner wire.
That's the part that most never figure out. Thinner wire requires less wattage to reach the same temperature.

 

[ian-field]

Easy solution:
Don't build so low when using thinner wire.
That's the part that most never figure out. Thinner wire requires less wattage to reach the same temperature.

I got lumbered with 100m of wire that was higher resistivity than I was expecting. A useable resistance meant about 3 - 4 wraps, not enough surface area. Initially I twisted a pair of wires together to get more turns without too high resistance - lately I've been twisting 3 strands. It might even be better than if I'd bought the right diameter to start with.

 

[Sm0keydaBear]

I got lumbered with 100m of wire that was higher resistivity than I was expecting. A useable resistance meant about 3 - 4 wraps, not enough surface area. Initially I twisted a pair of wires together to get more turns without too high resistance - lately I've been twisting 3 strands. It might even be better than if I'd bought the right diameter to start with.

Twisting up and making effective clapton wires requires the usage of smaller gauge wires regardless. High inner diameter of the coil and you run the risk of not being able to do anything cool with the wire, so it's a trade-off. The lower the gauge, the harder it will be to add things like clapton and simply make the coil have more surface area and could have too low resistance.

 

[classwife]

I keep it very simple

32 gauge wire - 'cause I have 2 spools of it...


4 1/2 loose wraps on a blunt needle and it gives me a nice 1.7 coil



easy peasy