What is this battery?!?!

[Midniteoyl]

Rumor, or documented? Links please.

Sony Global - Corporate Information

For which part? Where they're made? Dunno, just an educated guess - http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/News/Press_Archive/200009/00-039E/. Sony Electronics (Wuxi) Co., Ltd (China)
Sony Electronics (Singapore) Pte. Ltd. (Singapore)

Sony TV's, PlayStations, and whatnot are made in China too Not saying they all are, of course, but, they do have factories in China. They also use Foxconn

TVTechnology: Sony opens new LCD factory in China

Report: Foxconn using forced student labor to build Sony's PS4

 

[Midniteoyl]

Theres also one in Singapore: Company Outline : Company Outline : Sony Singapore

http://www.pcworld.com/article/150410/article.html

 

[Midniteoyl]

This one says more batteries will be assembled (from Japanese parts) in China and Singapore... As are Panasonics: Sony to move lithium battery assembly abroad: report | Reuters

 

[Baditude]

Thanks, I asked for links. And you provided links.

 

[Midniteoyl]

Yep.. A lot of stuff has been moved to China and elsewhere.. Remember, the only other lithium-ion battery plant in Japan was in Fukushima, and we all know what happened there I think it is just now starting to go back online. There is another plant in Nuevo Laredo, Mexico, however.

But, again, the typical 'green' battery being sold as a 'Sony' actually being a clone, is, IMHO, true, and I agree with Choc_Addic that most stores have clones.. even if they dont know it. Sony 18650-Sony 18650 Manufacturers, Suppliers and Exporters on Alibaba.comRechargeable Batteries

Shoot, even hcigar is cloning AW batteries and unless you ask them directly, you would never know. There is one Vendor on here who got burned and is selling them off cheap with the caveat that they are clones.

So beware those eBay 'deals'

 

[Hijack]

Rumor, or documented? Links please.

Sony Global - Corporate Information

Well I had found this which is what I based the Japan, Mexico and China claim on.

Sony Global - Press Release - Sony to Establish Lithium-ion Polymer Rechargeable Battery Plant in China - To further expand investment in Chinese high-tech industry -

Edit I should have read up to end of thread as this was same report just with a different link.

 

[patrao_n]

Well my sony was bought from rtd. They both are vtc5. And neither have the sony31 line on them. But I do trust rtd. And most likely the ones with that 3rd line on it are from the main plant. Whereas the others are from a different one. Would be a big help if sony came out and told us ways to identify. Like aw did with the stickers. The old stickers had an indent in a specific place. The new are hologram.

Sent from my SM-N900T

 

[slappy3139]

Is this it? I dunno.. would'nt a Sony batt say 'Sony' on it? I see a lot of these around, but can find a lot on Alibaba too..

Those look like sony vct5s to me

 

[dr g]

But, again, the typical 'green' battery being sold as a 'Sony' actually being a clone, is, IMHO, true, and I agree with Choc_Addic that most stores have clones.. even if they dont know it. Sony 18650-Sony 18650 Manufacturers, Suppliers and Exporters on Alibaba.comRechargeable Batteries

Is there any evidence of this at all? Chinese companies can get legitimate Sonys just like any other battery; these are OEM batteries meant for battery packs, which are just about all made in China. The big differentiator is performance -- if a factory can make a battery that is every bit as good as a Sony then they would be competing with Sony or producing genuine Sonys under contract.

But seeing as Sonys are near the cutting edge ... if a battery checks out performancewise, it's a genuine Sony.

 

[Midniteoyl]

Those look like sony vct5s to me

Yep.. and thats an Alibaba photo

 

[Midniteoyl]

Is there any evidence of this at all? Chinese companies can get legitimate Sonys just like any other battery; these are OEM batteries meant for battery packs, which are just about all made in China. The big differentiator is performance -- if a factory can make a battery that is every bit as good as a Sony then they would be competing with Sony or producing genuine Sonys under contract.

But seeing as Sonys are near the cutting edge ... if a battery checks out performancewise, it's a genuine Sony.

Not with these particular Sony's, no.. However, take a look around and you will see many VCT5's and AW IMR's sold from China that clearly have different ratings and specs than the 'originals'.. Again, not saying they all are clones...

Here's a tidbit: These look just like AW's, no? Well, they are not. They are HCigar clones 'made according to AW's patent' - HCigars words. These were sold as with no mention of them being clones until the Vendor became suspicious and pressed HCigar who then said they were clones. Apearently, HGigar is not the only ones making AW clones.... Sony's would be no exceptions.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...views-vaping-discussions-41.html#post13136046

 

[Midniteoyl]

Here is another 'authentic' Sony (I posted one earlier).. Notice the 'Sony 31'? These are suppose to be only on the real ones... not that it cant be cloned as well.. The pic I posted with the bunch of Sony's dont have that line..


edit: NM, pic wont post... Heres the link: http://s67.photobucket.com/user/Technonut/media/IMG_2093_zps06bdef80.jpg.html

 

[Midniteoyl]

More 'legit' pics... Legit? - Imgur

 

[catilley1092]

Yep.. A lot of stuff has been moved to China and elsewhere.. Remember, the only other lithium-ion battery plant in Japan was in Fukushima, and we all know what happened there I think it is just now starting to go back online. There is another plant in Nuevo Laredo, Mexico, however.

But, again, the typical 'green' battery being sold as a 'Sony' actually being a clone, is, IMHO, true, and I agree with Choc_Addic that most stores have clones.. even if they dont know it. Sony 18650-Sony 18650 Manufacturers, Suppliers and Exporters on Alibaba.comRechargeable Batteries

Shoot, even HCigar is cloning AW batteries and unless you ask them directly, you would never know. There is one Vendor on here who got burned and is selling them off cheap with the caveat that they are clones.

So beware those eBay 'deals'

Alberia (forgive me if it's a typo) has been reported to sell many fake AW & other batteries, many ends up on online auctions at too good to be true pricing. I use the AW 18490's, there was a seller on eBay who had them, two for $8 shipped, supposedly brand new. I gave that for one.

Though I do by some vape equipment via the Internet on promo, I won't chance it with batteries. My distributor checks out these things well & doesn't buy from 3rd rated suppliers.

For the time being, unless something better does come along & compels me to change, it's genuine AW or nothing for me. Note that the Efest equivalent of the AW 18490 (16.5A) produces almost half of the continuous discharge rate (CDR) at 8.8A. For those who sub ohms, the Efest 18490 isn't a good choice, as the battery has to have at least a 10 amp CDR for safety.

Here's a page that I bookmarked for personal reference, generated on this forum, about battery selection & safety. Note that it states that any that includes "Fire" in the name are second rate (their chargers are crap too, they burn good batteries up) & to avoid generics altogether.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...tery-basics-mods-imr-protected-icr-page2.html

And be wary of online sellers. In other words, when it comes to batteries, it's best to have a working relationship with a legit distributor of them. Doesn't matter if their e-juices are crap, we're discussing batteries here.

Being cheap with a cloned mod is no issue with me, as long as it's functions properly. But never cheap out on batteries, it's flirting with disaster.

Cat

 

[dr g]

AW fakes are fairly well-established and well-known to exist. Sonys, not so much.

Here is another 'authentic' Sony (I posted one earlier).. Notice the 'Sony 31'? These are suppose to be only on the real ones... not that it cant be cloned as well.. The pic I posted with the bunch of Sony's dont have that line..


edit: NM, pic wont post... Heres the link: http://s67.photobucket.com/user/Technonut/media/IMG_2093_zps06bdef80.jpg.html

The genuines do not all have the Sony 31 line.

 

[Baditude]

AW fakes are fairly well-established and well-known to exist. Sonys, not so much.

It's well known that AW batteries are often counterfeited, because they have been the most popular battery. Well, with the advent of sub-ohm vaping and the rapidly growing need for 30 amp batteries, guess which battery is now the most sought after battery? Sony. If not so much counterfeited now, they will be.

"Battery counterfeiting
This is a growing problem and all APV users need to be aware of it.

This is what happens: the counterfeiters buy reject Li-ion batteries in bulk, strip the covers off, and re-cover them with labels that change them to look like popular brands. In this way they can take a cell bought for 10 cents, re-work it, and sell it as for example an AW battery with a retail price of $10. The profits are very high and this practice is growing. It means that you never really know what battery you have unless you buy from somewhere with a verified supply chain. For example, all AW batteries offered for sale on Alibaba are counterfeits, and possibly dangerous."

Written by your Forum Administrator and resident battery expert, Rolygate - http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-library/129569-rechargeable-batteries.html

 

[dr g]

It's well known that AW batteries are often counterfeited, because they have been the most popular battery. Well, with the advent of sub-ohm vaping and the rapidly growing need for 30 amp batteries, guess which battery is now the most sought after battery? Sony. If not so much counterfeited now, they will be.

Again, any evidence? Sony by all accounts is meeting demand and pricing is competitive, AW had a more limited distribution network and higher prices. The secrecy surrounding AW cells may have contributed here. AW is also a branded-for-retail cell, sonys, samsungs, panasonics, etc. are oem cells, which personally I think is part of the reason we have not seen proof of counterfeiting any of them. The only established counterfeits are of retail brands -- AW, Ultrafire -- at least as far as I've seen.

 

[catilley1092]

Given enough time, somehow the Sony, Samsung, Panasonic & other IMR batteries will be counterfeited. If there is demand & market, it'll happen. It's not that difficult to re-wrap generic cells, some of which may have been reject batches of those very brands.

There are already generic copycats of OEM Samsung notebook batteries showing on eBay every now & then, the ones that's not supposed to be consumer replaceable. Crooks clones one type of battery, they'll do the same with others.

Cat

 

[Hijack]

For the time being, unless something better does come along & compels me to change, it's genuine AW or nothing for me. Note that the Efest equivalent of the AW 18490 (16.5A) produces almost half of the continuous discharge rate (CDR) at 8.8A. For those who sub ohms, the Efest 18490 isn't a good choice, as the battery has to have at least a 10 amp CDR for safety.

Cat

@catilley1092 I know that you will know this, but I just wanted to add for others who are reading to find out about fakes.
Althought the efest 18490 doesn't stand up to the AW, I think its worth saying that their standard red 18650 @1600 mAh is rated at 30amp and their purple 18650 @2500mAh is rated at 35amp which is, as far as I can tell one of the highest rated batteries out there of this size.
I think as things stand ATM, you will be less likely to end up with a fake efest in your mod as opposed to a fake sony or AW.

 

[dr g]

Given enough time, somehow the Sony, Samsung, Panasonic & other IMR batteries will be counterfeited. If there is demand & market, it'll happen. It's not that difficult to re-wrap generic cells, some of which may have been reject batches of those very brands.

I actually think that among these brands, the cutting-edge model is only cutting edge for maybe a half year at best, so by the times clones would come out, the next model is already out. I suspect that's why we never saw clones of the Samsung INRs when they were the top of the heap, why we didn't see Panasonic NCR clones, and why no one has proof of Sony VTC clones.

Althought the efest 18490 doesn't stand up to the AW, I think its worth saying that their standard red 18650 @1600 mAh is rated at 30amp and their purple 18650 @2500mAh is rated at 35amp which is, as far as I can tell one of the best rated batteries out there of this size.
I think as things stand ATM, you will be less likely to end up with a fake efest in your mod as opposed to a fake sony or AW.

The 35 amp battery is believed to be the LG ICR18650HE2, which is a 20A continuous battery. Efest plays kind of fast and loose with the amp ratings.