Whats your ideas on age verification and are E-cigs gonna end up in bed with BT

[MTFogger]

Article on upcoming/continuing concerns. Are the current E-Cig companies lining up to merge with BT? If current in use online age verification is not good enough, what can be done to satisfy the moral creatons?.
E-cig industry on tenterhooks ahead of U.S. regulation - chicagotribune.com

 

[Dominique Hoogduin]

online age verification.. well thats gonna be either:
- Credit card .. although it doesnt identify the user using it.
- Sending the company a copy of your id

Will require a digital ID. But even that wont stop MOM/DAD/FUN UNCLE/BROTHER/OTHER from logging in for u and ordering

Its quite undoable.

 

[MTFogger]

Well yea no law is gonna stop others from ordering for another or buying, including analogs.

 

[Tinkiegrrl]

I don't think the FDA will be able to regulate the devices, PG, VG, and food flavoring. The only thing they can go after is the liquid nicotine. I can see that only being available from Big tobacco in tamper proof cartos and cartridges. It's why I plan on stepping down my nicotine to zero. While I can't see myself giving up on vaping entirely, I can see myself being able to drop the nicotine. I love the flavors, and I love the act of vaping. Of course, I'll keep fighting regulating the sale of liquid nicotine, but I'm not optimistic that's a battle we'll win and I don't plan on giving Big Tobacco any more of my money then I have.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[rbeckys8]

you can buy cigs on-line so it is pointless...

 

[retired1]

Moved to Media and General News

 

[cyndezu]

"In November and December, more than 35 organizations including e-cigarette companies, cigar and tobacco makers, trade associations, physician groups, lawyers, lobbyists and public health advocates trooped through the doors of the White House's Office of Management and Budget."

Govt's job is to protect our freedoms, not divide them.

 

[Botomline]

Test from the doctor which labels you a cigarette smoker. Gets you an ID card which gives you access to whatever you want, cause you are already sucking on one of the biggest poisons ever foisted on the world. Not really possible to do worse than you are already doing.

Not gonna even touch the new convert issue, but those of us that were already caught by big Tobacco should get a pass anyway we want to play it.

 

[vaperature]

Age can be verified through a credit card. If someone is supplying a shipping address that is different than the billing address, the further age verification may be necessary, but if John Doe's age is verified through his credit card and the product is being shipped to John Doe, then that's that.

 

[rothenbj]

Test from the doctor which labels you a cigarette smoker. Gets you an ID card which gives you access to whatever you want, cause you are already sucking on one of the biggest poisons ever foisted on the world. Not really possible to do worse than you are already doing.

Not gonna even touch the new convert issue, but those of us that were already caught by big Tobacco should get a pass anyway we want to play it.

I've always thought a "license" was the simple answer. I find your idea of doctor "verification" that you already use nicotine a bit amusing for the non-smoker who wants to vape rather than smoke. He or she will need to force themselves to smoke or use some form of tobacco to raise cotinine levels to user status to get the doc's approval, even if all they wanted was to vape zero nic liquid.

 

[zoiDman]

Article on upcoming/continuing concerns. Are the current E-Cig companies lining up to merge with BT? If current in use online age verification is not good enough, what can be done to satisfy the moral creatons?.
E-cig industry on tenterhooks ahead of U.S. regulation - chicagotribune.com

I think it needs to be a Two Prong approach.

First: Age Verification thru Credit Card or PayPal Account. Second: Buyer's Signature Requirement on Delivery.

 

[Botomline]

I've always thought a "license" was the simple answer. I find your idea of doctor "verification" that you already use nicotine a bit amusing for the non-smoker who wants to vape rather than smoke. He or she will need to force themselves to smoke or use some form of tobacco to raise cotinine levels to user status to get the doc's approval, even if all they wanted was to vape zero nic liquid.

I opted out of speaking as to how to deal with those that aren't already smokers. Sticky wicket there....

 

[vaperature]

I think it needs to be a Two Prong approach.

First: Age Verification thru Credit Card or PayPal Account. Second: Buyer's Signature Requirement on Delivery.

The signature thing can be a real pain in the ..... What happens when you're not home? And who is to say your kid isn't signing for you anyway? You'd have to pull out your ID and prove you are who you are to the postman. Anyway, it seems a huge point is being missed in the first place. If the government successfully classifies e-cigs as tobacco products, which is what they are pushing for in the guise of keeping it out of the hands of kids, it will be ILLEGAL to send it through the mail anyway, same as it is right now with real cigarettes, despite your age. I think right now for whatever reason is beyond me, it's only legal to ship cigars through the mail.

 

[Myk]

If you own property, have a drivers license or state ID, or are a registered voter your age can be verified. Or at least the person you are claiming to be can have their age verified. This will cost the shops money.

 

[Jman8]

I think it is important to note that there are several options, as I see opposition saying no based on only one method not being feasible for all cases. Options that I see for online verification include:

- Credit Card (already noted in this thread) - bank issuing card knows enough details about you to verify a whole bunch of information that confirms you are who you say you are, and how old you are

- license (already noted in this thread) - as long as things are how they are now, with little to no government intrusion, then process for obtaining license could be done thru doctors. But assuming eCig products are taxed, then I see licensing thru state, where your name is put into a database, and seller than can triple check license info with the database to confirm it is legitimate and make the sale accordingly.

- Skype with seller, share photocopy of your ID. Might take a little extra expense from buyer, but if choice is no online sales or you do this process, I think buyers will be okay with the added expense.

- sign for orders received by mail, showing ID at time of signing. If not home when mail person delivers product, this could present some problems, but not ones that haven't come up before in mail system.

Then just do similar penalties to in-person sales if someone (under age) tries to fake their age to make the purchase / obtain the product, while also doing periodic sting operations on businesses, especially those who are 'well known' for being lax with who they will sell to. Heck, I could see members of ECF or other vaping forums doing these sort of operations that wouldn't carry the penalty of law, but would be way for vaping community to handle the issue responsibly.

 

[Myk]

I think right now for whatever reason is beyond me, it's only legal to ship cigars through the mail.

Politicians and other rich people like cigars. They don't like RYO. That's why cigars saw a minimal tax increase while the poor people who "won't see any tax increases" got hit with a 2000% tax increase.

 

[rothenbj]

Age verification doesn't have to be by the person who made the purchase, just by an adult. UPS is good because you know what day the package will arrive. However, it is expensive. I was educated on the fact that USPS now has age verification also recently (that wasn't possible when PACT was approved). With a tracking number you should be able to know about when delivery will occur and it will be available locally at the PO if no one is available when they attempt delivery.

 

[zoiDman]

The signature thing can be a real pain in the ..... What happens when you're not home? And who is to say your kid isn't signing for you anyway? ....

On a Signature Required Delivery, the Shipper can state who's signature is required. So if the Buyer's Name is required, than kids could not receive the item.

Not saying it wouldn't be a PITA for Many People. But in this Case, if you we Don't provide something Iron Clad, then things like CAL AB-1500 may squeak thru on the Guise that it is Somehow "Saving the Children". Verse what it Really is, a Tax Grab.

 

[Ohms Lawbreaker]

Kids should not vape. Kids should not be having sex, using drugs, or listening to rock and roll. So I think ....

I'm sorry, I just hit some kind of force field there....can't finish my thought.

 

[twgbonehead]

I think the entire issue is a total distraction/sabotage thing.

The ANTZ wail and cry about "The children will start vaping, and that will lure them into smoking!"

And totally ignore the fact that IN THE US, 4000 UNDERAGE KIDS TRY SMOKING A CIGARETTE FOR THE FIRST TIME, AND 1000 OF THEM WILL GO ON TO BECOME REGULAR SMOKERS. Oh, I forgot... that's EVERY SINGLE DAY according to the American Cancer Society. (Sorry, will have to find the link again and add it).

Despite the fact that none of these kids can buy cigarettes legally. Despite the fact that cigarettes can't be advertized. Despite the fact that cigarettes don't come in "Bubble Gum" or "Cotton Candy" or "Fireball" flavors. Despite the millions of dollars spent on education programs to prevent teen smoking. Despite extreme penalties (i.e. suspension or expulsion) for being caught smoking at school. Despite every single tax increase on cigarettes which is supposed to "Deter teen smoking".

If, next year, that number changed to "100 kids/day started smoking, but 900 kids/day started vaping" this would be reported as a major horror story. "Garantuan, enormous increase in vaping among teens! We need to implement the same strategies that have been so successful in curbing teen smoking!!!"