Why Do I Have to Steep Juice?
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I have so much good juice, that steeping new orders is not an issue for me. I like knowing that my juice is made fresh and to my personal specifications in regards to nicotine levels and vg/pg ratio, or even adding sweetener or extra flavor shots.
One of the things that I love about Ahlusion is that they profile MY tastes - so my Smooth Criminal may not taste the same as someone else's Smooth Criminal - based on subtle things I may have requested, like "I really liked this, but would have preferred it a tad sweeter with more of a tobacco finish than I'm getting". My "recipe" if you will, will be different from someone else. I also know that I have to steep my Smooth Criminal from a month to two months, and I'm ok with that - I plan ahead and vape on the already steeped Smooth Criminal I have on hand and the new batch I receive gets put away to steep until I finish my current batch.
Thanks for the reminder - off to order more now!
One of the things that I love about Ahlusion is that they profile MY tastes - so my Smooth Criminal may not taste the same as someone else's Smooth Criminal - based on subtle things I may have requested, like "I really liked this, but would have preferred it a tad sweeter with more of a tobacco finish than I'm getting". My "recipe" if you will, will be different from someone else. I also know that I have to steep my Smooth Criminal from a month to two months, and I'm ok with that - I plan ahead and vape on the already steeped Smooth Criminal I have on hand and the new batch I receive gets put away to steep until I finish my current batch.
Thanks for the reminder - off to order more now!
Nnnnno, I don't think so, Skoony. I think you could shake till your arm went numb, and it wouldn't do much of anything.
People who do a lot of old fashioned cooking and traditional food prep realize that lots of things - beef, game, fruitcakes, cordials, chutneys, jams and cheeses, for instance - just need to sit (or "hang" or "age" or "mellow") for a bit before they're at their best. You get used to it. For some reason this whole idea really bugs new vapors, though. Maybe because so few people prepare food and booze the old fashioned way now? I dunno.
Anyway, I'm sure that if juice vendors were massive industries with vast inventories, they'd be doing this for you. But they're not massive industries, so they generally don't.
I noticed that too. And with my Smooth Criminal example - shaking has nothing to do with the long steep time required to bring it to its glory. I understand some people don't have the patience to wait, but for me, it's completely worth the wait. I keep enough on hand that it's never a problem waiting for it to become a swan!
I mix my own. Because of the principle of seed steeping, my system is simple. All my flavors are pretty simple, so require less steeping. I use bigger bottles than what I would normally need. When a bottle looks a bit low, I mix up more in the same bottle. The flavors meld quickly because there is plenty of pre-steeped juice already there. I shake every time I refill a clearo.
Keep it simple, and get rid of the superstitions, folks!!
Keep it simple, and get rid of the superstitions, folks!!
Thanks for all the replies, I really appreciate the time everyone takes to respond. Once again, I understand that when you have a juice custom made you will have to age it yourself. Makes sense, it was just made. I don't agree with the wine or beef analogy though. I buy a cabernet sauvignon at the 3 year mark and enjoy. And yes for the best flavor you must breathe the wine for a short period of time after opening. But, these are very accepted tried and true methods that follow an exact science. Same with prime beef that's dry aged for 70 days. I buy it that way and it is ready to eat (getting hungry just talking about it). If I bought a just bottled cabernet sauvignon, I would know I need to wait a specific amount of time to enjoy it at its best. And this is a very predictable and repeatable amount of time. And if I slaughtered my own cow, I know I will have to dry age the beef 30 to 70 days to remove the moisture and allow time for the tissue to break down to a certain point to achieve the best flavor... once again very predictable.
But it seems none of this holds true for juice. Maybe some of what people say could be improved. Like it seems to be a common idea that juice changes color (darkens) as it ages. It might be possible to apply color spectroscopy to determine perfect aging. Or maybe viscosity changes over time and that could be measured. Not really sure. I do think that in a billion dollar industry we will see standards emerge that will make repeatability of juice aging better, and more of it done at the manufacturer for common blends. I agree it will never happen for made to order or home brews. But perhaps we will better understand the dynamics behind juice aging like the effects of heat, lighting, time, viscosity, etc. I think we will see some of this occur in 2014.
Now that I think about it. Big tobacco companies are entering the arena in 2014 (in a huge way) and they will absolutely do the testing with scientific method to understand this. I just won't believe what they say, but I'll bet their product will be extremely consistent batch to batch.
I know most think I'm making too big a deal with this, and you are probably right. So I'll just back off and read the comments and reap the reward of the more experienced vapers. Thanks again for taking the time to educate and contribute.
But it seems none of this holds true for juice. Maybe some of what people say could be improved. Like it seems to be a common idea that juice changes color (darkens) as it ages. It might be possible to apply color spectroscopy to determine perfect aging. Or maybe viscosity changes over time and that could be measured. Not really sure. I do think that in a billion dollar industry we will see standards emerge that will make repeatability of juice aging better, and more of it done at the manufacturer for common blends. I agree it will never happen for made to order or home brews. But perhaps we will better understand the dynamics behind juice aging like the effects of heat, lighting, time, viscosity, etc. I think we will see some of this occur in 2014.
Now that I think about it. Big tobacco companies are entering the arena in 2014 (in a huge way) and they will absolutely do the testing with scientific method to understand this. I just won't believe what they say, but I'll bet their product will be extremely consistent batch to batch.
I know most think I'm making too big a deal with this, and you are probably right. So I'll just back off and read the comments and reap the reward of the more experienced vapers. Thanks again for taking the time to educate and contribute.
The e-juice field is maybe 10 yrs old tops, using the unconventional method of mixing a PG/VG ratio, nicotine, and concentrated food flavoring of various types/brands. This is basically all uncharted territory at this point.
Let me ask You a question.
Say you Sell e-Liquids over the Internet or in a B&M Shop. Would you want to Mix your Entire Product line of e-Liquids of Hundreds of Flavor Possibilities and then let them Steep, waiting for someone to Order them?
Or would you Mix a Flavor when the Order comes in? And then send it to the Customer ASAP.
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10 Years? LOL
Mainstream e-Cigarette/e-Liquid Markets are about 3 Years Old.
Yes, there were e-Cigarettes in 2008 and 2009. But you probably would even Recognize them. Ever heard of a RN4081 or DSE103?
i bet my bottom dollar outfits that have the best reputation for there liquids are using mixers.Nnnnno, I don't think so, Skoony. I think you could shake till your arm went numb, and it wouldn't do much of anything.
People who do a lot of old fashioned cooking and traditional food prep realize that lots of things - beef, game, fruitcakes, cordials, chutneys, jams and cheeses, for instance - just need to sit (or "hang" or "age" or "mellow") for a bit before they're at their best. You get used to it. For some reason this whole idea really bugs new vapors, though. Maybe because so few people prepare food and booze the old fashioned way now? I dunno.
Anyway, I'm sure that if juice vendors were massive industries with vast inventories, they'd be doing this for you. But they're not massive industries, so they generally don't.
you get a consistency in product that cant be matched by letting it sit after shaking it by hand.
you also can make small custom orders on the spot.
the one fellow in a previous post in this thread mentioned his technique of using a crock pot
at medium to low heated water to put his mix in.
this is agitating the mix with out cooking it.although the heat may be slightly cooking something in his mix giving him a taste he likes.
its all about mixing the ingredients properly to get the best diffusion of the ingredients for the
flavor your looking for.
and no its not like fine wine as the properties of the grapes will change from season to season.
there are other processes going on while aging wines and spirits.
throwing a bunch of stuff together and letting it sit will not give the desired consistency one would
need for good quality control(i'm talking at the commercial level here).ever noticed its always recommended to shake your mix frequently while this steeping period is going on?
regards
mike
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I used the wine analogy for example purposes to give a better understanding as most people understand on a principle level how wine is aged to get them to understand how steeping works to an extent, not that it is exactly the same, but that it is similar, biggest commonality is time sitting capped/corked and such. Some if not most liquids do darken as they age, have to remember even while sitting, the liquid is quite active with its own chemical processes going on, interaction of the PG/VG mixture with the nicotine, flavorings and colorings interacting with those chemicals as well. I have 2 bottles of a liquid I bought couple months ago on a sale online, first got them they were a pale, pale yellow-orange color, as they sit now they are changing more toward an orange-yellow and darkening further toward orange, a pretty complex flavor of caramel, butterscotch, and vanilla in one, and when steeped properly one of the sweetest flavors I have as the three flavors meld together. But yes, this industry is relatively in in its infancy, so a lot of trial and error are being done, but many of us believe the only incorrect question is the one not asked.
Different mixes require different amounts of steeping.
Some require no steeping at all.
Some require weeks of steeping;
I suppose some mixes would require months of steeping.
There are an infinite possible number of combinations.
Some vendors will inevitably develop popular mixes which they will ensure is certifiably steeped to some requirement
Some require no steeping at all.
Some require weeks of steeping;
I suppose some mixes would require months of steeping.
There are an infinite possible number of combinations.
Some vendors will inevitably develop popular mixes which they will ensure is certifiably steeped to some requirement
Personally, I'm not much of a fan of steeping. I'm leaning towards vendors who pre-steep, pre-mix and provide gourmet experiences. There are a few that I still order who MTO (mix to order) but they're fewer and far between.
That may well be, but I don't see what that has to do with letting things sit. These two things are done for entirely different reasons.Skoony said:
Let's say I put up a batch of cordial or chutney, okay? (I live on a farm, and actually do this kinda thing every year.) It's true that the ingredients have to mixed properly, then canned or bottled properly, or you'll have a mess. But, regardless of all that, the finished products still have to sit for a bit, or the flavors will be crass and underdeveloped. The chutney will be vinegary and lack mellowness, for instance, while the cordial will taste like rubbing alcohol with fruit and sugar on top. Not nice!
The aging process might take a week or two for a chutney, and a full 6 months for a cordial, but the principal's exactly the same: the "putting away" issue is totally separate from the mixing issue.
Newb question: Does e liquid still steep even when the cap hasn't been removed for a month?
The long story of this is I ordered some juices and somehow got lost in delivery for a few weeks. When usps finally traced it, I just told them to send it back to the vendor. When the vendor got the package back, they told me they're only able to take back the hardware I ordered (batteries and such) but not the e liquids. So I thought, what the hell, might as well get everything back. It'll probably take a few more weeks to get here and that's why I'm asking. Thank you all in advance
The long story of this is I ordered some juices and somehow got lost in delivery for a few weeks. When usps finally traced it, I just told them to send it back to the vendor. When the vendor got the package back, they told me they're only able to take back the hardware I ordered (batteries and such) but not the e liquids. So I thought, what the hell, might as well get everything back. It'll probably take a few more weeks to get here and that's why I'm asking. Thank you all in advance
Yes, it does.
You can put a light colored liquid into a cupboard without ever opening it, shaking it, or even glancing at it, and it will still darken in color and mellow in flavor over time. (Which is not to say that it'll automatically taste fantastic in two months. If crap went in at the get-go, it'll still taste like crap after aging - mellow crap maybe, but still crap.)
Yes, it does.
You can put a light colored liquid into a cupboard without ever opening it, shaking it, or even glancing at it, and it will still darken in color and mellow in flavor over time. (Which is not to say that it'll automatically taste fantastic in two months. If crap went in at the get-go, it'll still taste like crap after aging - mellow crap maybe, but still crap.)
Thank you so much for the info! Well I do hope the stuff I ordered isn't crap.
Now does it make a difference when the juice is contained in a glass bottle vs plastic bottle?
I myself keep everything in glass because I'm old school and don't like the idea of plastic leaching into eliquid or food, but not everyone agrees on this point. I don't know of any actual studies done on eliquid, so I guess it's a judgment call.
Most people do agree that citrus and cinnamon juices do a number on plastic, though, so you might want to bear that in mind.
I have learned the lessons of steeping. My B&M has tons of test flavors, all quite tasty, seemingly. To save a couple bucks I ordered direct from the vendor because they had a holiday deal. I reordered a favorite previously purchased at the B&M, & it was unpalatable, downright unvapeable. I'm guessing the bottle I bought previously steeped nicely on the shelf before I bought it, so I threw the new one in a drawer, forgot about it, pulled it out weeks later, & it's now back on my favorite list.
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