Why is XXXXXXXX so expensive?!

[llamainmypocket]

Some businesses are screwing over their consumers. I have a ** PCC and a Ovale Eroll. The materials and technology of my Eroll are superior in every way and yet the ** is more expensive. In fact, by comparison the ** is a total piece of poop.

That's just how business works. Your going to see evolutionary dead ends and others that make you wonder how they can compete against a cheetah. You shouldn't demand perfection if progress is only made through imperfection.

*EDITED TO MAINTAIN FORUM ETIQUETTE *

 

[Discord]

I used to do very high-end furniture repairs and restoration before I retired. Other than historical recipes which I taught myself through research, the cost of the materials I used and those used by budget hacks was, as you say, negligible. So bottom line was, my customers didn't pay me so much for what I did, as what I knew. I think this applies to many mods that I've seen.

I totally agree, it comes down to the design / skill stage, for some, and paying a premium for that is well worth it. The other side of what we see out there is people paying a premium for hype/lack of availability, for bragging rights or whatever. In the long run that's never worth it, IMO.

 

[llamainmypocket]

I totally agree, it comes down to the design / skill stage, for some, and paying a premium for that is well worth it. The other side of what we see out there is people paying a premium for hype/lack of availability, for bragging rights or whatever. In the long run that's never worth it, IMO.

For whatever reason the premium that one pays is a service they are paying for. Whether or not its worth it is a subjective argument. In fact, according to market theory it's by virtue of the fact that someone had payed for it that defines its worth. In a literal sense, it was worth what its buyer paid. Whether or not its worth that much to you is a notional concept. Notionally, I think most people will agree with you and that would lead to a decrease in price but the market will be the judge of that.

 

[alisa1970]

310 is not "implant grade" ... surgical implants and instruments are made of a specialized version of 316. 310 is even cheaper.

I could have misquoted him on the type. the video's available to anyone who is curious, and I was essentially paraphrasing his point, not the details.

 

[Absintheur]

Different strokes for different folks...I like the better things in life personally. If you don't own and use a high end mod on a regular basis it is hard to explain why they are better. I have had cheap mods...they work, most of the time that is, I have several that have flat died for no reason. None of my high end mods have had any problems. They don't eat batteries, they don't quit working, they all fire when I hit the button and do it very well.

Guess what?...I don't drive a Kia either...lol.

 

[Discord]

I could have misquoted him on the type. the video's available to anyone who is curious, and I was essentially paraphrasing his point, not the details.

I didn't mean to nitpick, but one of the things that seems to happen a lot is people making claims about the quality of the materials they use that sound impressive, but really aren't. Calling something implant grade or surgical steel or any of the other things tossed around really doesn't mean that much. If you put a mod made of 316LVM (most commonly used SS for implants), a "non-surgical" 316, a 304 or even lower grade, most people wouldn't be able to tell the difference so long as the finish looked and felt good. The cost difference between these metals is almost nothing, they just have different properties in how they react to tension and temperature and corrosion that are all well beyond the range they'll ever get used in any of these products.

 

[Butters78]

I'm getting an implant grade made mod to be implanted in my booty.

 

[EddardinWinter]

Here we go, again. Why won't any of my pictures upload!?!?

 

[peraspera]

Since none of the manufacturers have solicited my opinion on what they should be charging for their wares I spend zero time worrying about it. If something seems like a good value to me personally I buy it, otherwise I don't.

While I'm disinclined to pay several hundred dollars for a PV that looks to me like an overly engineered piece of plumbing I'm enormously pleased that others derive a great deal of enjoyment from doing so. My vote always goes for doing whatever it takes to make vaping more appealing than smoking—different toys at different prices are going to float different boats. It's all good.

 

[Discord]

I'm getting an implant grade made mod to be implanted in my booty.

this sounds like a good way to clear out plenty of personal space around you in crowded situations, on exhale.

 

[TheSystemHasFailed]

Say it with me everybody...

YOU-GET-WHAT-YOU-PAY-FOR.

 

[Absintheur]

I'm getting an implant grade made mod to be implanted in my booty.

Won't rebuilding coils be tough? Not to mention changing batteries....

 

[Katya]

Say it with me everybody...

YOU-GET-WHAT-YOU-PAY-FOR.

Not necessarily and not always. But often.

You have to be a savvy consumer.

A $250 Smoking Everywhere kit is not better than a mini Provari.

 

[TheSystemHasFailed]

Not necessarily and not always. But often.

You have to be a savvy consumer.

A $250 Smoking Everywhere kit is not better than a mini Provari.

It was more of a quick, "this dead horse again" on WHY "xxxxxxxxxx is so expensive".

Can you overpay, as an amendment to what I said?
Consider it amended then...

 

[Katya]

It was more of a quick, "this dead horse again" on WHY "xxxxxxxxxx is so expensive".

Can you overpay, as an amendment to what I said?
Consider it amended then...

Done.

 

[unclestu]

I generally tend to seek out and buy the best quality product and then I try to find that product at the best price. If you look at a products intrinsic value you would say every product is overpriced. The reason why people pay a premium above a products intrinsic value is because they perceive value in that product. Whether the value that is perceived is justified is irrelevant because perception is in many cases reality. Stainless steel is perceived by some as being valuable. To others the thought of surgical grade stainless steel might be priceless. I wouldn't be surprised if the next big thing would be a Titanium Provari and a Titanium Zap to go along with it because all of that stainless steel is pretty darn heavy for some of us all day vapers.LOL Maybe a carbon fiber version as well for those who tend to drop their devices on concrete floors all the time. LOL

 

[Discord]

It was more of a quick, "this dead horse again" on WHY "xxxxxxxxxx is so expensive".

Can you overpay, as an amendment to what I said?
Consider it amended then...

my attempt with this tread wasn't to keep beating the same dead horse, but that I continue to see a "why is provari/random mechanical/boutique atty/whatever so expensive" and was attempting to open it up as a general discussion that'd just apply to all of them. So many times people rush in and comment about using premium materials that cost 90% of what they sell for (pretty much always hogwash) or that there's a lot of labor involved (pretty much always hogwash), or whatever other reasons, when fundamentally what most are paying a lot for is either design or exclusivity (sometimes both). There's two aspects of design that I personally think are worth it...

1) How well it's made to work, fit, rebuild, clean and maintain, which impacts reliability and durability in the long run.
2) The artistry of it. This is pretty subjective, very important to some, not important to others.

Those are both examples of getting what you pay for. When it comes to exclusivity, IMO that's really not worth anything. For the most parts, once these things are designed and the first few are made, the vast bulk of the costs, which are the design time and the tooling costs, have been paid for. The difference between making 100 of an item and 1000 or 10000 really aren't much different, because the only expense that goes into it at that point is relatively cheap material costs and relatively cheap labor costs (relative to the sale price of these items, that is). So IMO the really low production run numbers you see on a lot of boutique items which also happen to be some of the most expensive items is almost entirely due to an artificially gamed supply/demand situation, and people get suckered into it over and over.

For examples of this, take a look at almost any mechanical mod out there that's over $200 and has a serial number. They are fundamentally all the same. They are a metal tube (cheaper by far than manufacturing out of a block of raw material, because metal tubing is produced in MASSIVE quantities for various industrial uses) with a switch and a threaded adapter. Threaded metal tubes that are laser etched with a logo and serial number that cost $200+, at least in my opinion, are not something where you get what you pay for.

 

[TheSystemHasFailed]

Ok, I'll refine it.
If you have to ask, you can't afford it.

Your point is well taken, but the same thing you are trying to circumvent, can be remedied by the same thing.

The Search Function.

And your above post has some falsities contained therein.
You describe mech mods as equal, metal this, metal that.
Not all Metals are the same.

Stick around.

 

[synthros]

I think to an extent everyone has a point.

There is the entire range of products, quality, marketing mumbo-jumbo, supply and demand(intentional and otherwise), status pieces, true rarity, overblown hype. It's trickier when you get down to opinions about an individual product and where it might fall in all this.

There is plain junk being manufactured, some of it is sold super cheap and appropriately so. Sometimes that same junk gets jazzed up, marketed and sold for absurd prices.

I see your point, but I honestly don't know if you can make any real general statements. If you're saying that devices are being sold for more than what they cost, I'm sure that's true. But it's true of everything, cars houses and bicycles too. If you're saying that for ecigs the multiple is just too high, maybe so. But this whole market is so young relatively speaking and its exploding at present so I would say its safe to say you'll see all kinds of behaviors going on. It's definitely buyer beware and its kind of a jungle to navigate anymore, there are exponentially more people making mods of all kinds and so many more kinds available. I cannot even keep up anymore, lol. I would bet there are a very small number(if any) of people who could speak with any real authority on the whole range of what's out there.

I try to do my homework before I spend money and occasionally I feel like I've been had, but st the same time someone else might have been perfectly happy. No doubt there is junk being sold at all price points. But there are also really well made, solid devices being sold at all price points too. Where you think a particular device falls is a matter of opinion. The never ending Provari argument is just one example out of many. Do I think that device represents good value for the money they charge? Yes, I do. But that's because it works for what I want/need and I'm fully aware that there are a ton of people who feel the complete opposite (and think I'm nuts are they wrong? No. But neither am I

Buyer beware, its most certainly a jungle out there. There are a lot of great devices, there is very probably one that will suit the needs of both your vape and your wallet. Also there are many people actively cashing in on this young market, to the OP's point is a serial number on a 200 each run worth a premium to me? No, and I don't think it justifies one either. But the people buying them clearly think otherwise and as long as they are willing to pony up, I guess it'll continue. Probably not forever , but clearly for now....

 

[Absintheur]

In some of his videos Busardo now shows where mods he reviews rate in conductivity. Cheap mods tend to have more drop off than better made mods. Chrome plated brass is not as good as stainless steel. Other differences such as solid copper or silver contacts make a difference as well and are normally found only on higher end mods.